The Budget - Band G Tax £1000!

clv101 said:
You say that as if it's a bad thing? When we are all put off buying big engined cars the country's oil import bill will be reduced, our economy will be in better shape relative to economies still struggling on with inefficient cars. Running an efficient vehicle fleet boosts the economy - looking for somewhere else to get the tax from is a small price to pay for a stronger, healthier economy.
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Yawn! You keep enjoying your diesel supermini :(
 
clv101 said:
You say that as if it's a bad thing? When we are all put off buying big engined cars the country's oil import bill will be reduced, our economy will be in better shape relative to economies still struggling on with inefficient cars. Running an efficient vehicle fleet boosts the economy - looking for somewhere else to get the tax from is a small price to pay for a stronger, healthier economy.
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It is a bad thing if you actually like cars, because small engined cars are horrible as anything other than basic transport, and they are pretty horrible at that too compared to bigger, better cars.
 
OllyM said:
Yawn! You keep enjoying your diesel supermini :(
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Thanks I will. Say we both drive 10,000 miles a year and for sake of argument I get 50mpg and you get 25mpg. You get through some 200 gallons of oil extra. As we're rapidly becoming an oil importer that's an extra 200 gallons of imported oil - sending pounds out of the economy. The money I've saved by not buying the extra 200 gallons, I can spend/invest within the UK, strengthening our economy.
 
I'd still rather get 25mpg and actually enjoy my car than drive a rattly old diesel supermini, but each to their own and all that :)
 
Dolph said:
It is a bad thing if you actually like cars, because small engined cars are horrible as anything other than basic transport, and they are pretty horrible at that too compared to bigger, better cars.
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It's not that bad... the BMW 320d, 174bhp, 0-60 in 7.6 sec, 58mpg is 128g CO2/kg making it free in the first year then £95 going forward.

Is that car "horrible, basic transport"?
 
clv101 said:
Thanks I will. Say we both drive 10,000 miles a year and for sake of argument I get 50mpg and you get 25mpg. You get through some 200 gallons of oil extra. As we're rapidly becoming an oil importer that's an extra 200 gallons of imported oil - sending pounds out of the economy. The money I've saved by not buying the extra 200 gallons, I can spend/invest within the UK, strengthening our economy.
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But without the higher taxation (which is one of the least efficient approaches to economic investment), they would have more money to spend in the UK economy anyway...
 
Dolph said:
But without the higher taxation (which is one of the least efficient approaches to economic investment), they would have more money to spend in the UK economy anyway...
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But tax revenue also stays in the country - the government spends it on things like teachers who then spend it in the country...

Taxation is not comparable to importing Saudi oil.
 
clv101 said:
It's not that bad... the BMW 320d, 174bhp, 0-60 in 7.6 sec, 58mpg is 128g CO2/kg making it free in the first year then £95 going forward.

Is that car "horrible, basic transport"?
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If you're an enthuiast driver, yes. The power delivery is all wrong for spirited driving, the excessively long gearing to counter the short rev range significantly blunts the ability of the car to be driven fast and so on.

The fact that is so frequently missed is that most high emmissions cars don't actually do the high mileage that lower emission cars (especially company owned diesels) do, and hence why the tax is poorly targetted to start with.
 
clv101 said:
But tax revenue also stays in the country - the government spends it on things like teachers who then spend it in the country...
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Which I have already commented is a very inefficent method of propping up an economy. Tax cuts have a much higher economic benefit than tax raises.

Taxation is not comparable to importing Saudi oil.
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When comparing economic impacts, it certainly is, because both have a negative effect. Increasing taxation has a negative effect on the economy, as do excessive imports. Trying to deal with one using the other is pretty much doomed to failure...
 
clv101 said:
It's not that bad... the BMW 320d, 174bhp, 0-60 in 7.6 sec, 58mpg is 128g CO2/kg making it free in the first year then £95 going forward.

Is that car "horrible, basic transport"?
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The NOx emissions are horrible, yes

As said it is stupid, the type of cars that are the high VED classes are driven less.

I just wish they would get rid of this stupid system all together and just integrate it into the cost of fuel. That way it is a logical system at least and it really will be based on emissions.
 
Simon said:
The NOx emissions are horrible, yes

As said it is stupid, the type of cars that are the high VED classes are driven less.

I just wish they would get rid of this stupid system all together and just integrate it into the cost of fuel. That way it is a logical system at least and it really will be based on emissions.
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I wish they'd start ringfencing taxes properly and giving proper, auditable accounting of where the money is being spent so we can ensure we're getting value for money in what's being stolen from us...

Unfortunately, that won't happen, because the government has no desire to admit how economically inefficient it's services are.
 
Simon said:
I just wish they would get rid of this stupid system all together and just integrate it into the cost of fuel.
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I do agree with that in theory - but it's practically impossible.

To add an average £200 to an average 10,000 miles in an average 35mpg car would mean adding 15p to duty.

So yes - I would support the scrapping of VED in exchange for a 15p increase in duty. It's just not politically viable.
 
OllyM said:
What a great idea, making people pay more for something. No different to going in to Sainsburys and saying 'Please PLEASE charge everybody an extra £5 on this bottle of wine, I WANT to pay more for it!'
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No, it's like saying "Please PLEASE charge everyone who wants to buy a £1000 bottle of vintage port £30 more, and use that to take 50p off the price of a £5 bottle"

Sort of. :p
 
Arse looks like me Seat Leon Cupra on an 03 plate is about to get expensive.

I assume we'll have to wait and see when they update their website to relect the tax changes.
 
clv101 said:
I do agree with that in theory - but it's practically impossible.

To add an average £200 to an average 10,000 miles in an average 35mpg car would mean adding 15p to duty.

So yes - I would support the scrapping of VED in exchange for a 15p increase in duty. It's just not politically viable.
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But hasn't the purpose of previous constant increases in fuel duty been enviromental?

Hasn't this tax already been done once?

Why does it have to add ANOTHER increase? We've been having constant increases for a good long while now anyway in the name of the enviroment.

If the above was done by a company, they'd be had up for fraud.
 
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