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Very disappointed.
5Dii (for real this time)
- Thread starter robmiller
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It's not a worthy competitor to the D700 at all and i LIKE Canon !
3.9fps, 9 points AF........
Yes, the ISO is good, FF but no weather sealing and it seems all they have done is put in Digi IV, up the MP and ISO.......3 years this took, 3 Fricking YEARS !!!!!!!!!!!! Not to mention is launched at a higher price than the D700 too, even compared to the D700 launched price it's still £300 more ! Currently its not less than a 1DsMKIII.............
I am disappointed to say the least, the only cool bit is the HD movie mode, but i doubt i would use that much.
After reading through he specs and some other peoples opinions I fully agree. All the important stuff hasn't really changed.
ANd we don't know about the ISO performance, just because the options to go high are there doesn't mean its usable. If the noise is similar the Sony A900 then the camera would be severely crippled at anything about ISO 200.
As for the HD movie mode, rumour has it that a firmware upgrade may add this to all Nikon cameras with Live view.
hmmm..
The word "cake, eat it" comes to mind
I mean if you can afford it the 1DSM3 has the resolution and the AF. Why would canon make the same camera for half the price? when most people buying it will be using it for landscape/portrait where you don't need 50 point AF. (1d territory)
9 point Af with assist points sounds pretty reasonable to me, 50 point AF isn't all its cracked up to be anyway, most people prefer a few manually selectable points. The test with AF isn't how many points exist, but how well it tracks on one or 2 points. (in my opinion)
The 5d series has never been about sports or amazing AF, why should it all of a sudden be able to do everything?
My friend has a D700 and it is a frighteningly good camera, however i'd prefer another 10MP than a few more AF points, but thats just me
Full HD video aswelldo any other DSLRs do video?
neeeed
Nikon D90
Caporegime
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hmmm..
The word "cake, eat it" comes to mind
I mean if you can afford it the 1DSM3 has the resolution and the AF. Why would canon make the same camera for half the price? when most people buying it will be using it for landscape/portrait where you don't need 50 point AF. (1d territory)
9 point Af with assist points sounds pretty reasonable to me, 50 point AF isn't all its cracked up to be anyway, most people prefer a few manually selectable points. The test with AF isn't how many points exist, but how well it tracks on one or 2 points. (in my opinion)
The 5d series has never been about sports or amazing AF, why should it all of a sudden be able to do everything?
My friend has a D700 and it is a frighteningly good camera, however i'd prefer another 10MP than a few more AF points, but thats just me
I don't want it to do everything, i don't want weather sealing or intergrated grip nor 8fps, but across the road in Nikon's camp they have a D700 which is FF, with 52points AF, 8FPS, weather sealing. The previous 5D had no direct competitor, now it has and rather compared to the 1dsmk3, compare it to its direct rival which is the D700, everything just doesn't look as good.
Now you see, all this talk of FPS and AF points is where a lot of photographers start to disappear up their own backsides I'm afraid!
Yes, it's different to the D700, and does things in a slightly different way (the same as the current 5d and D300 did) but the bottom line is that both are capable of recording excellent images. It's an evolution of the old 5d, and that's a bad thing because?
As V-Spec has said, if you NEED an AF system like the 1d, then you should buy one. If you NEED 51 point AF, then buy a Nikon.
The current 5d is in no way a pile of scrap all of a sudden, so a camera that moves things forward is to be expected isn't it?
I'm still not convinced by the Video function, and I respectfully suggest that if you are that 'in to' video then a dedicated video camera for less than the 5d would probably suit your needs better and be more flexible and future proof. As it is, shooting video on a DSLR to me would be like cutting my lawn with a pair of scissors!
Yes, it's different to the D700, and does things in a slightly different way (the same as the current 5d and D300 did) but the bottom line is that both are capable of recording excellent images. It's an evolution of the old 5d, and that's a bad thing because?
As V-Spec has said, if you NEED an AF system like the 1d, then you should buy one. If you NEED 51 point AF, then buy a Nikon.
The current 5d is in no way a pile of scrap all of a sudden, so a camera that moves things forward is to be expected isn't it?
I'm still not convinced by the Video function, and I respectfully suggest that if you are that 'in to' video then a dedicated video camera for less than the 5d would probably suit your needs better and be more flexible and future proof. As it is, shooting video on a DSLR to me would be like cutting my lawn with a pair of scissors!
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Thats the thing right there.
If you have £2k to spend, it's not even a choice anymore. I am saying that the direct competitor is just better and cheaper for the money, to wait 3 years for this i am just very disappointed.
Well, we don't know how much the street price for the 5d will be yet, but I'd be surprised if it was very far away from the D700.
The thing is, what can you not do on a 5d at the moment that you will be able to on the 5d II (video aside!).
And, similarly, what are you able to do with a D700 that you can't on a 5d?
Not a lot is my guess, you just do things differently to get somewhere near the same results, but I hear the disappointment you're feeling regarding its specs relative to the competition.
hmmm..
The word "cake, eat it" comes to mind
I mean if you can afford it the 1DSM3 has the resolution and the AF. Why would canon make the same camera for half the price? when most people buying it will be using it for landscape/portrait where you don't need 50 point AF. (1d territory)
9 point Af with assist points sounds pretty reasonable to me, 50 point AF isn't all its cracked up to be anyway, most people prefer a few manually selectable points. The test with AF isn't how many points exist, but how well it tracks on one or 2 points. (in my opinion)
The 5d series has never been about sports or amazing AF, why should it all of a sudden be able to do everything?
My friend has a D700 and it is a frighteningly good camera, however i'd prefer another 10MP than a few more AF points, but thats just me
I agree, there's nothing wrong with the AF in the 5Dii. It does what it needs to do.
The frame coverage of 51 AF points (Nikon) vs 9 AF points (Canon) is pretty much the same, it's just a difference in density. There's a function to select from just 11 of the 51 AF points on the Nikon AF system; in reality, hardly anyone requires that many.
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it is true that the price will drop, but the D700 is at £1500 street price now, even if the new 5D drop to that, it's still looks worst on paper from a spec point of view. If you have existing gear like me and just need a new body to upgrade then you'll be as disappointed as me when seeing what you could have for the same money with a D700.
So is it just the 51 point AF, the weather sealing and FPS that you feel is lacking on the 5dII?
The reason I ask is that what would this enable you to do that you can't now?
The proof of the pudding is in the eating so to speak, so lets wait and see what images it can churn out.
Do you really need a new body though?
I'm using Pentax K20d's now, and the best bit of advice I was ever given was to spend as much as you can afford on the lenses. I used to scoff at this idea, but when I became frustrated at the slow AF and 3 FPS on my current bodies, I tried a decent f2.8 zoom (that cost me more than the body!), and was blown away by what I could now achieve. All of a sudden, with f2.8 open to me, the AF was quicker and 3 FPS was no longer an issue now all three were in focus! Just before this point I had nearly sold all my gear and switched to Canon/Nikon.
I just don't get your main complaint that the 5dII does not appear to be as good as the D700, when most respected magazines put the current 5d just about on a par with the D700, which is amazing given the age of it!
It all comes down to what you use your camera for doesn't it? I suspect the 5dII and D700 will have relative strengths and weaknesses, like all cameras...
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Yes i need a new body, i need it for wedding stuff and the 30D's high ISO performance is not as good as i wanted, at 3200 ISO its not really that good. With Wedding stuff i would like faster FPS, 5fps. I already said that i can live without Weather Sealing but more AF points can't hurt.
EDIT - I am sure it is a very capable camera and would suit my needs but i guess i was hoping for more after such a long wait and what i would mis out on when look across the pond.
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Associate
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In terms of including video in SLR's, this is geared more towards photo journalists, not general consumers, it is a professional camera after all. The option to capture video and still images through the same piece of kit is fantastic for journalists. I think the future of journalism is going to lie in video, in years to come these cameras will soon be good enough for editors to take still images from video, it already looks to be gearing towards that capability now with Canon and Nikon's newest cameras.
As far as the 5Dii goes, the Nikon D700 is still looking better for my money. I'm waiting till I can have a go with the new Canon though first.
As far as the 5Dii goes, the Nikon D700 is still looking better for my money. I'm waiting till I can have a go with the new Canon though first.
As a long time Pentax user, I soon learnt to stop looking across the pond and love the one I'm with so to speak!!
5FPS for weddings? What kind of stuff are you doing that needs that? I've never noticed that being a limitation for the weddings and events that I've done the last year. I'd be interested to know.
Weather sealing however, that's another story! With the summer weather we've had this year, a couple of times I've been out in the pouring rain whilst the bridal party have been safely ensconsed within the church porch, and weather sealing was much for useful than a couple of extra FPS.
Regards ISO, the big numbers we're starting to see only make sense if the photographs are useable. My K20d can do 6400, but you wouldn't use them (apart from in some kind of abstract way!), and I certainly wouldn't dream of including them in clients portfolios.
I've shot in some very dim venues this year, and again I'd say lenses come to the fore here. I've shot on the K20d at 400 iso with a Pentax 16-50 f2.8, and the results have been great. I've heard that the D3 is in a different league regarding ISO, but it is in a different league price wise too.
I know it sounds like I'm berating you for being disappointed at the 5dII in comparison to the Nikon competition, I suppose I'm just trying to help get it into perspective.
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Well not really, that's a bit of a broad statement to make (although for your needs it obviously applies of course) as it depends on your usage. You wouldn't buy a 1ltr Fiesta if you were planning on going to Porsche track days.
The 5D looks like a great bit of kit though and it should be very interesting to see how the Nikon/Canon war develops over the coming months and years! I'd like to see MP count not go too much higher (although super tight crops would be possible I guess which would be handy at times) but noise lvels get to a point where ISO 50 and 6400 look almost the same.
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I know what you are saying, I suppose I just can't help but feel disappointed. Its not just me, loads of people on PoTN feels the same, and that is a Canon forum! The good news is that i sold all my lenses last month so jumping ship won't cost me that much but i do like Canon and their UI. I can pick one up without the manual and use it in 30 seconds, I picked up a Nikon D2X once and even after a minute i couldn't figue out how to switch to AV mode.
As for the fps, i might not need 5fps every day but it would be nice to have the option and knowing its there when i can rely on it.
p.s. 21mp RAW file !!! I will need a new PC with 10G of RAM for lightroom with that !
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Well, you've twisted my analogy a little and took it away from the point I was trying to make!
Is 3.9 FPS '1ltr Fiesta' performance? It isn't really that different to 5 FPS, and certainly in the same ballpark. 10 FPS would be significantly different of course, but the point I was trying to make was that I've noticed a lot of people making reference to FPS as a 'make or break' feature especially when comparing brands at similar price points. We all know, or should do (!), that it's the overall package that's important, and matching a camera to your needs.
If you don't consider the overall package, then we're back to comparing cars on 0-60 times when cornering speeds, braking performance etc etc could mean overall that a slower 0-60 model is faster/more suitable for you.
Hopefully that's enough car analogies though!
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Soldato
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Looks to be a killer wedding photography camera.
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