A day out ratting
- Thread starter Rainmaker
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Yes, I also commented on his rat boiling practices and how it seemingly had gone unnoticed. Suffice is to say the guy has some very strange attitudes towards animals in general imo.
Oh and as for Sunama's posts... I don't really have enough info to make a judgement, tbh. If he came from an extremely poor background (no disrespect), and didn't have access to things like proper equipment or a gun, I can understand why he and his kin wouldn't want to go near a caught rat and had to devise a way to kill them from a distance.
I'm not saying it does (or doesn't) apply in his case, but in monetary poor parts of Asia with fairly poor sanitation, lack of accessible and/or affordable modern medical care and no source for handling equipment or whatever, how else would they kill a caught rat without risking a potentially dangerous bite or escapee?
You certainly don't want to risk touching it, or letting it go again. If you can't shoot it through the mesh of a trap or whatever there's not a great deal else you can do. Perhaps better to place kill traps down, but again maybe they didn't have that luxury. Who knows? Obviously in the UK there's no excuse for making anything suffer. But in certain circumstances I can understand how you'd have to do what you had to do.
On the other hand, maybe he's from an affluent background and just likes boiling rats. You can't make a judgement call over a forum really, can you? I'm the last person to start jumping on someone from another country because of what they consider fair practice... within the realms of reason.
I'm not saying it does (or doesn't) apply in his case, but in monetary poor parts of Asia with fairly poor sanitation, lack of accessible and/or affordable modern medical care and no source for handling equipment or whatever, how else would they kill a caught rat without risking a potentially dangerous bite or escapee?
You certainly don't want to risk touching it, or letting it go again. If you can't shoot it through the mesh of a trap or whatever there's not a great deal else you can do. Perhaps better to place kill traps down, but again maybe they didn't have that luxury. Who knows? Obviously in the UK there's no excuse for making anything suffer. But in certain circumstances I can understand how you'd have to do what you had to do.
On the other hand, maybe he's from an affluent background and just likes boiling rats. You can't make a judgement call over a forum really, can you? I'm the last person to start jumping on someone from another country because of what they consider fair practice... within the realms of reason.
Soldato
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Great post. Brought a lot of points in perspective, including my personal thoughts.
Yes, if rats were being tortured, then I would disagree with that.
Quick clean kills however no. I understand that some animals are going to be abused/culled by humans more because of their 'status' or whatever. It may be a double standard and personally, I think that rats are misunderstood and are intelligent creatures and I wouldn't object to keeping one as a pet. But they are going to be hunted in this way because of how many there are, alledged disease, etc.
I don't agree with it but then I obviously don't speak for everyone. People are ignorant in their treatment of other animals and individually, any animal should be given respect. Like the crab thread, which is also very long, you can see someone giving an animal an un-neccessarily cruel death, but what can you do? People are going to act like retards no matter what. The OP's dogs seemed to kill the rats fast enough though.
I do agree that sunama's 'methods' are the worst.
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Good first post but you are playing with words. Look at the Rat disease survey results, particularly the % of rats carrying diseases. Now tell me humans in the same locality carry as many infectious diseases or that the % of humans carrying disease is as high.
Although it is possible for humans to spread serious diseases in the UK it is very uncommon. Therefore your comment that "You either carry and transmit disease or you don’t" is rather naive.
Soldato
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All this - "it's pest control and the dogs enjoy it / get exercise" is complete tosh. There's no need to take your pet dog to a field to rip apart a smaller, relatively harmless animal- regardless of what that particular breed is designed for. I bet if someone asked you to come and collect rats in order to rehome them, avoiding any of the killing, you would much rather sit on the internet all day.
There's no excuse for this - completely unnecessary however you look at it. I'm glad that rat bit your dog's nose... good on that rat!
There's no excuse for this - completely unnecessary however you look at it. I'm glad that rat bit your dog's nose... good on that rat!
All this - "it's pest control and the dogs enjoy it / get exercise" is complete tosh. There's no need to take your pet dog to a field to rip apart a smaller, relatively harmless animal- regardless of what that particular breed is designed for. I bet if someone asked you to come and collect rats in order to rehome them, avoiding any of the killing, you would much rather sit on the internet all day.
There's no excuse for this - completely unnecessary however you look at it. I'm glad that rat bit your dog's nose... good on that rat!
you, sir, are deluded.
It's funny. we have gavin with a really good first post and then this.
Nope - we only really have Rattus Rattus and Rattus Norvegicus in the UK as most other varieties of Murinae can't readily adapt to the climate.
I keep Rattus Norvegicus and can fully understand the reasons for trying to keep the numbers in check as colonies can multiply at a staggering rate - one breeding pair can potentially become 15,000 rats in a year. They breed in such huge numbers as a significant amount of attrition from predators is the natural way to regulate colony growth - take away the predation and you could soon have an epidemic.
Dogs probably are the most humane method to cull in the wild - I don't really think Brodifacoum or Warfarin could ever be classed as humane unless you find making an animal haemmorrage to death after a period of agonising dehydration acceptable.
All this - "it's pest control and the dogs enjoy it / get exercise" is complete tosh. There's no need to take your pet dog to a field to rip apart a smaller, relatively harmless animal- regardless of what that particular breed is designed for. I bet if someone asked you to come and collect rats in order to rehome them, avoiding any of the killing, you would much rather sit on the internet all day.
There's no excuse for this - completely unnecessary however you look at it. I'm glad that rat bit your dog's nose... good on that rat!
What a load of drivel. As for your hypothetical re-homing scenario; do you know many people who'd like to house a few thousand disease-ridden, aggressive wild rats? I do hope you weren't talking about catch and release rather than 'homing', as that would be illegal (release of a pest animal into the wild, under the Wildlife & Countryside Act for one).
ROFL Kindly stifle your moral outrage and prejudice. I'm no more a toff than you are, and probably less so. Why would you presume that one ought to be a 'toff' in order to enjoy a spot of ratting? Places like Liverpool, Sheffield, Birmingham etc hold a huge concentration of hunters and the populace would hardly be regarded as 'toffs'. I find your stereotypical and prejudicial views amusing. Ratting has pretty much always been the predilection of the working class. The 'toffs' as you call them would have been far too busy tending to deer hunting, boar hunting, and later fox hunting and game-bird shooting.
Though of course, nowadays pretty much every section of society has discovered just how much fun ratting is. That's right; fun
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As opposed to generalising all townies and everyone against hunting as 'tree hugging do gooders'?
Anyone who's that bothered about someone controlling rats does pretty much fit that criteria in my book, yes. But that still doesn't make me a toff by any stretch of the imagination. I just happen to like working my dogs, and if a few dozen or even hundred rats are culled that day all the better.
You mean ratting being a working class thing as in killing rats in the sewers for a living back in the 70s? I don't know anybody working class who goes out into fields to go 'ratting' and then comes home and talks about their methods and which breed of dog is the most effective in the way you have done.ROFL Kindly stifle your moral outrage and prejudice. I'm no more a toff than you are, and probably less so. Why would you presume that one ought to be a 'toff' in order to enjoy a spot of ratting? Places like Liverpool, Sheffield, Birmingham etc hold a huge concentration of hunters and the populace would hardly be regarded as 'toffs'. I find your stereotypical and prejudicial views amusing. Ratting has pretty much always been the predilection of the working class. The 'toffs' as you call them would have been far too busy tending to deer hunting, boar hunting, and later fox hunting and game-bird shooting.
Though of course, nowadays pretty much every section of society has discovered just how much fun ratting is. That's right; fun
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