British man to be exectuted by Chinese

Oh well no loss to any one and probably a positive to any drug user scum bag.
 
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I'm a bit amazed at the sheer level of ignorance in some of the posts in this thread tbh. I can only assume that some people are just not bothereing to read about the actual circumstances and have simply seen the word 'drugs' and come in here to wave a copy of the Daily Mail about.

Anyway, there is some more info on Akmal and his case here:

http://www.reprieve.org.uk/stephenfryappeal

It seems pretty clear he suffers from serious mental illness. And i would imagine that for anyone that has been close to someone who suffers from something similar the delusional rantings in the emails linked at the bottom of that page will seem sadly familiar. It's ridiculous that he's not even had a mental health assessment during the course of his trial.
 
Smuggle heroin = deserve to die, sell alcohol = that's ok, despite the fact that alcohol kills 50x more people than heroin every year (despite not having any of the purity problems that street heroin has) and causes terrible physiological damage.
 
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Sinque said:
Yeah, platinum87 is pure comedy gold. Or platinum. Or a troll :p

And on topic: It's a different country and they can do what they like, especially China.
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On Topic, you all over complicated the issue (well not all)

Jibba jabba about wanting to make certain drugs legal etc? And all this nonsense about alcohol comes up every single time there is a thread about drugs... I do realise its a forum but it is strange to have such depth to a convo when 99% of the people posting are more stubborn than a 5 ton rock.. Essentially those posting that, and the others a tiny comment, not getting into the convo.

1) British? Well im sure if i went to texas and murdered 50 people they would execute me too, im not sure if being british should get people exempt to the death penalty??? (unless your a pansy)

2) Everyone should know the law, being unaware, or the law being more harsh in certain places is not an excuse

3) Trying to say someone has mental problems is also not an excuse, because you cant prove it, and its open to abuse, If the person actually is mentally unstable then its even better... Id rather be robbed at gunpoint by a sane criminal than one with massive mental problems (why you dont fight crackheads)

4) Death penalty is for punishment or to "set an example", if it doesnt prevent anything then people will keep dying non-stop..
Its FACT that the death penalty does prevent more than not, If someone paid me £X to smuggle drugs, id do it, thinking its worth the risk to get 5 years prison time? etc... If there was a death penalty i wouldnt do it, unless it was much more money.... Money doesnt grow on trees! The drugs in this example would be more more expensive and in reduced supply...
 
Energize said:
Smuggle heroin = deserve to die, sell alcohol = that's ok, despite the fact that alcohol kills 50x more people than heroin every year (despite not having any of the purity problems that street heroin has) and causes terrible physiological damage.
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What a entirely stupid thing to say, people have free will, they CHOOSE to drink and die as a consequence, no people however are killed in the buying, selling and producing of alcohol. The difference in the heroine trade is, people are MURDERED while producing, buying and selling the stuff. This isn't guys out there making the stuff happy as can be, selling it legally and being generally nice people and people only dying from using the stuff.

Its the murder, the attacks, the gang warfare side of the heroine production and trade that also catches completely innocent bystanders in the process and THATS why they are incomparable. I don't care about the addicts killing themselves by using the drugs long term or OD'ing, thats their choice. What does matter is the people killed in getting those drugs to that addict, and the potential victims of that addicts crimes when he goes looking for money.

Yes, this guy, afaik, only smuggled some drugs, but its part of a greater industry that involves violence, murders and lots and lots of crime.

Its up to them what laws they have, he broke them, it was his free will to do so. Maybe he wasn't metally competant to make that decision, but he did make it, maybe he was competant to choose what he did, you can't KNOW either way.

AS for the people who go on about the morally right and civilisation, twaddle, the former is questionable, the latter ridiculous. We don't have and will never attain this civilised status. We as a race of people are not civilised people. We are driven by greed, fear and lots of other things and we will never in our lifetimes be at a point where no one will do anything wrong. If people are out there doing bad things, punishing them by stopping their ability to do harm to others is not a bad thing.

Maybe this guy deserves help and leniency, but judging by his behaviour, his completely inability for his family to help him, and his impaired judgement, whose to say he won't commit a far worse crime in the future. It looks to me that this guy is either a hardened criminal on the way to worse crimes, or someone genuinely unable to control himself, which would likely head down the same path. What the alternative, stick him in an institution till he dies, so doped up he can't speak for the next 60 years, sounds like torture to me, but I guess thats civilised by some arbitrary measure of things some people make.
 
platinum87 said:
4) Death penalty is for punishment or to "set an example", if it doesnt prevent anything then people will keep dying non-stop..
Its FACT that the death penalty does prevent more than not, If someone paid me £X to smuggle drugs, id do it, thinking its worth the risk to get 5 years prison time? etc... If there was a death penalty i wouldnt do it, unless it was much more money.... Money doesnt grow on trees! The drugs in this example would be more more expensive and in reduced supply...
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I can't understand people's argument that the death penalty doesn't work. It takes 3 seconds to consider if you yourself would commit a crime, like robbing a bank if their were no consequences, if there were minor consequences, or if getting caught would mean you face the death penalty. 99.999% of sane people would get to the death penalty consequence and decide never to ever think about it again as the risk is FAR to great.... therefore, it works, you have to be a flat out moron to think it doesn't.

Most of what we do in life is risk vs reward, put the highest risk in the mix and you put off the massive majority of people commiting those crimes.


We should however make ALL drugs legal, for several reasons. Firstly as we constantly see, ban one thing and someone comes up with a legal variation that mostly we have no idea what the side effects are, some are deadly, some do nothing, some have long term effects we don't know about and lots and lots of people take them.

Making drugs legal means you take out the risk, meaning rather than get a huge amount from an incredibly risky source that you might go to jail for, when you can get a safe amount from a government run store thats a pure source without rat poison cut in and again the majority would get their drugs from the safer source. You cut out a lot of OD's, deaths and most importantly, criminal supply. If you're supplying it legally, theres literally no money to be made growing it illegally and the "crime" side of it evapourates. So does the cost, rather than making a profit and being produced in tiny quantities, mass produce it, sell it cheap but in limited amounts and people who do get addicted, who would be addicted anyway, don't need to commit muggings and burglarys and other violent crimes to fund their habit, yet more crime dissappearing.

Also going back to the type of drugs, why try a bunch of untested unknown new designer drugs, when you have safe quantities of tested over, well literally thousands of years, drugs to use.

Criminalising drugs just spawns crime and makes it less safe for those people who will still use it.

When there was prohibition, all it did was make criminals huge sums of money and got a lot of people in trouble, created more criminals and got people killed and everyone still drank however it cost a shedload more. Make alcohol legal, tax the crap out of it, stop any criminals making money off it, get rid of large number of criminals, there was no downside, at all.
 
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drunkenmaster said:
What a entirely stupid thing to say, people have free will, they CHOOSE to drink and die as a consequence, no people however are killed in the buying, selling and producing of alcohol. The difference in the heroine trade is, people are MURDERED while producing, buying and selling the stuff. This isn't guys out there making the stuff happy as can be, selling it legally and being generally nice people and people only dying from using the stuff.
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Alcohol causes tons of violent crime in the UK, stabbings, thefts, bar fights which affect the general population far more than some drug gang member being killed.
 
Energize said:
Smuggle heroin = deserve to die, sell alcohol = that's ok, despite the fact that alcohol kills 50x more people than heroin every year (despite not having any of the purity problems that street heroin has) and causes terrible physiological damage.
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Not really a great comparison. You would need to look at per user statistics to see how dangerous heroin is when compared to alcohol.


drunkenmaster said:
I can't understand people's argument that the death penalty doesn't work. It takes 3 seconds to consider if you yourself would commit a crime, like robbing a bank if their were no consequences, if there were minor consequences, or if getting caught would mean you face the death penalty. 99.999% of sane people would get to the death penalty consequence and decide never to ever think about it again as the risk is FAR to great.... therefore, it works, you have to be a flat out moron to think it doesn't.
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Generally because criminals do not do the "if I get caught" bit or the crimes that normally have the death penalty are ones which rational thought tends not to figure in too much.
 
tedmaul said:
I'm a bit amazed at the sheer level of ignorance in some of the posts in this thread tbh. I can only assume that some people are just not bothereing to read about the actual circumstances and have simply seen the word 'drugs' and come in here to wave a copy of the Daily Mail about.

Anyway, there is some more info on Akmal and his case here:

http://www.reprieve.org.uk/stephenfryappeal

It seems pretty clear he suffers from serious mental illness. And i would imagine that for anyone that has been close to someone who suffers from something similar the delusional rantings in the emails linked at the bottom of that page will seem sadly familiar. It's ridiculous that he's not even had a mental health assessment during the course of his trial.
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This very valid point has already been made in the thread, it does not suit the agenda of the ignorant so they chose to ignore.
 
platinum87 said:
4) Death penalty is for punishment or to "set an example", if it doesnt prevent anything then people will keep dying non-stop..
Its FACT that the death penalty does prevent more than not, If someone paid me £X to smuggle drugs, id do it, thinking its worth the risk to get 5 years prison time? etc... If there was a death penalty i wouldnt do it, unless it was much more money.... Money doesnt grow on trees! The drugs in this example would be more more expensive and in reduced supply...
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Money may not grow on trees but the opium poppy grows in fields if we're trading tautologies.

Both you and drunkenmaster seem to assume that the death penalty is weighed up by criminals and evaluated on a risk/reward basis - this is not necessarily so. Either because they do not expect to get caught as highlighted by RDM or because they are incapable of considering the consequences through the passion that caused the crime or they are mentally unable to do so.
 
JBuk said:
How do you know this?
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Because there is massive amounts of research that clearly shows that the death penalty does not have a statistically meaningful deterrant effect?

Most capital crimes in places like the US are crimes that are either irrational or delusional (especially murder), and so a good risk assessment is not made.
 
Rroff said:
Good examples above why no one should be a in position of absolute power... and just how ****** the human race is. We are so far from civilisation.
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What because some people dont agree with your point of view? Under your guidance "civilisation" would just be a great big mess of carebare society... and look what that has done for the UK under labour.
 
JBod said:
What because some people dont agree with your point of view? Under your guidance "civilisation" would just be a great big mess of carebare society... and look what that has done for the UK under labour.
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How about because some people are irrational and seemingly incapable of evaluating an argument prefering instead to rely on prejudice even when it flies in the face of all evidence?
 
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