The 4k performance (over)Hype

Soldato
Joined
11 Jul 2007
Posts
2,524
I've mentioned this a few times in other threads, but I thought I'd start a new topic to try and explain myself further and invite discussion.

I believe that the emphasis placed on 4k performance in current SSD's is overhyped for 99% of people.
This is most probably due to the bad old jMicron first gen era, where it was quite rightly highlighted that the drives suffered in general use thanks to 4k write performance that was significantlyworse than conventional hard drives. This cause a lot of emphasis in benchmarking to be placed on 4k performance as it was now linked in our minds that 4k performance was what really mattered.

If we take a realistic look at things however, as all the software we run was - and will be for a considrable amount of time - designed around the limitations of mechanical drives, our PC's don't actually spend that much time as it is on them.
There are diminishing returns on the percieved performance improvement with 4k IOPS.
This is similar to how if you see two graphics card benchmarks, one has a minimum fps of 100FPS in any game max settings, the other has a minimum fps of 200FPS with max settings, to play them you wouldn't feel any difference. Of course, if price and all other factors were the same between them, you'd go for the 200FPS card, becasue it would be more futureproof, but the SSD world is more complex than that, firstly 4k performance demands are limited thanks the the prevailance of mechanical drives. They are going to be with us for a very long time becasue NAND SSD's are unlikely to ever reach mainstream pricing, and developers have to consider the lowest common denomonator.
Secondly, Sequential performance is always noticable - halving the time it takes to load a few GB of photoshop files or a game level is very perceptable.

Taking some numbers from the traces done for AnandTech's "Heavy Workload" SSD test which states:

If there’s a light usage case there’s bound to be a heavy one. In this test we have Microsoft Security Essentials running in the background with real time virus scanning enabled. We also perform a quick scan in the middle of the test. Firefox, Outlook, Excel, Word and Powerpoint are all used the same as they were in the light test. We add Photoshop CS4 to the mix, opening a bunch of 12MP images, editing them, then saving them as highly compressed JPGs for web publishing. Windows 7’s picture viewer is used to view a bunch of pictures on the hard drive. We use 7-zip to create and extract .7z archives. Downloading is also prominently featured in our heavy test; we download large files from the Internet during portions of the benchmark, as well as use uTorrent to grab a couple of torrents. Some of the applications in use are installed during the benchmark, Windows updates are also installed. Towards the end of the test we launch World of Warcraft, play for a few minutes, then delete the folder. This test also takes into account all of the disk accesses that happen while the OS is booting.

The benchmark is 22 minutes long and it consists of 128,895 read operations and 72,411 write operations. Roughly 44% of all IOs were sequential. Approximately 30% of all accesses were 4KB in size, 12% were 16KB in size, 14% were 32KB and 20% were 64KB. Average queue depth was 3.59.

We can extrapolate that in every second activity, and assuming the 30% 4k accesses evenly split between reads and writes, we average
(.3*((60/22)*72411))/3600 =
16.46 4k writes
G
(.3*((60/22)*128895))/3600 =
29.3 4k reads

I drew up a table for a few common drives, using 4k MB/s numbers from crystaldiskmark and legitreviews:

YRosO.jpg


As you can see, on mechanical drives, you are spending hundreds of ms on 4k ops, wheras moving to even on a "value" SSD like the Kingston SSDNow v+ series you are spending less than 10ms on either.
To put this into context, at 60FPS there is 16ms between frames and it feels smooth to the most discerning gamer, TV and movies get by on 24fps, over 40ms between frames. It's safe to say that you won't notice that 10ms worth of delay spread over a second. In fact in an hour an ssd like the common indilinx is only spending 15seconds on 4k reads or writes, and the top of the range c300 only saves you around 10seconds per hour on writes, or 3 seconds on reads.
Of course, these are average values, and there will obviously be peaks in activity, but they demonstrate my thinking quite well. In addition, the time your drive spends on operations is even less noticable becasue many will be performing in the background whilst your attention is occupied by other things - you don't care what your web browser does in the background whilst you are reading a web page. Conversely, many sequential operations (most program and file loading, copying files, loading games, are things that you are waiting to complete before you can proceed ... though of course there are exceptions here too, such as watching a movie where you don't care about the constant disk activity becasue your attention is on the movie
This makes it almost impossible to design a realistic benchmark, all i can really say is that you'd be hard pressed to detect any difference in practice based on 4k performance alone amongst any of the current crop of ssd's.


TLDR: Unless you're running a hardcore database, even under heavy multitasking use your drive doesn't spend much time on 4k ops anyway, so as long as it's a current gen drive, look to sequential numbers for perceptible improvement.
 
Last edited:
so does this mean my ocz LE sf-1500 @ 280read 270write is not noticably better than any other SSD or whut? :o
i saw somthing @ legitreviews about the vertex LE but they wer using the old (as advertised) firmware @ 270 read 250 write, (apparently launch delay was to install new firmware back up to vertex 2 pro spec of 280/270)
 
Last edited:
so does this mean my ocz LE sf-1500 @ 280read 270write is not noticably better than any other SSD or whut? :o
i saw somthing @ legitreviews about the vertex LE but they wer using the old (as advertised) firmware @ 270 read 250 write, (apparently launch delay was to install new firmware back up to vertex 2 pro spec of 280/270)

It all comes down to what you use it for. It's still got great sequential read and write speeds, so if those numbers are correct you can expect it to be around 10% - 20% faster than anything else during any significant load times or copies, but you won't be able to tell if the start menu or a folder full of thumbnails pops up any faster :)
 
It all comes down to what you use it for. It's still got great sequential read and write speeds, so if those numbers are correct you can expect it to be around 10% - 20% faster than anything else during any significant load times or copies, but you won't be able to tell if the start menu or a folder full of thumbnails pops up any faster :)

i have installed a few apps multiple times where no loading bar came up, all just happened too quick lol, needs some getting used to
 
Interesting thread - thanks for posting :)

Since you seem to be well clued-up on the subject: How does this relate back to windows boot-up times, particularly on a mature windows copy where several small applications are initialised on boot? My previous understanding was that small reads (and to a lesser extent writes) were much more important during program loading and windows boot. Based on the assessment you make above (and assuming anand's figures for the percentage of 4kb or smaller writes are accurate) I'm beginning to doubt this assumption...
 
Been saying it for a while, my 4kb random read/write goes up very nicely with 2x 64gb crucials in raid 0, but I can't feel the slightest difference between single drive and raid 0. Sure my sequentials have gone my massively which makes moving large data files much quicker..... of course I download all data to mechanical drives, and store all big files on mechanical drives due to space issues and reducing writes on the SSD's so that makes smeg all difference. Mechanical drives on the cheap in raid 0 are great for sequential data and moving large files around quickly anyway.

I had 2x 64gb samsungs in raid before, the cheaper MLC 100mb/s reads and 80mb/s writes and theres a difference between those and the crucials, but properly alligned even those weren't very bad. The very early j-micron drives also had the problems with misallignment, not great optimisation in drivers, controllers and windows.

Anyway, i've been trying to tell people for a while that 4kb random read/writes are important, to a point, after which you really don't come across situations in real life usage that its a problem. An indilinx drives basically goes past that with a single drive, my older samsungs would do about 12mb/s on random writes in raid, though single, at around 6mb/s, it still stuttered now and then. Mechanical hdd's and you're looking at 0.5mb/s random 4kb writes.

The latest drives do well in synthetic benchmarks but in reality most things people at home do, like game, its not 100% load dependant and ssd's aren't offering much if any performance advantage there compared to normal drives. The uber snappy feeling of windows is great, but you don't need 50mb/s random writes to get that feeling, 10mb/s and over is more than fine for smooth ssd usage.

Most people will just end up severly dissappointed they spent the extra and given the chance to compare an Intel 25-m, a sandforce, and a cheaper Indilinx and 99.9% of home users wouldn't notice the blindest bit of difference.

Its just a shame not everyone got them at launch pricing.

I normally wait to buy things after the initial rush, but got my two crucials and my 5850 at launch, and I'm happy on both counts I did. At £100 the 64gb Crucial offers the same realistic performance as anything else you can get, if they get back to that pricing you'd be mad to pay any more for other drives.

The wait now is for mass production to kick into gear for the new process node that will offer more chips per wafer and higher capacity for the same cost.

Its also a shame that prices and capacity should have increased massively already but a lot of R&D money wasn't spent and a lot of fabs weren't built due to the market crash and the economy in the last year. 18-24 months ago we were looking at 1-2 years of insane growth with fabs ready to be built to produce nand flash in far higher volume.
 
Interesting thread - thanks for posting :)

Since you seem to be well clued-up on the subject: How does this relate back to windows boot-up times, particularly on a mature windows copy where several small applications are initialised on boot? My previous understanding was that small reads (and to a lesser extent writes) were much more important during program loading and windows boot. Based on the assessment you make above (and assuming anand's figures for the percentage of 4kb or smaller writes are accurate) I'm beginning to doubt this assumption...
It's difficult to say, I'm not equipped to run a trace on windows and do a theoretical breakdown to see what it spends it's time loading. Best way i can think of to test would be if you can limit your SATA to controller to SATA 150 - your small file performance should remain the same, but it willl cap your sequentials. If you could then test again with a different ssd drive (with different 4k performance) also capped on SATA 150, you could see how 4k performance affected the boot and how sequential performance affected the boot.
 
Last edited:
Whether 4k is overhyped or not is a matter of opinion. If it's used as the be all and end all deciding factor then yes, otherwise it's a strong indicator and should be the first thing to look for.

I agree 4k is only usefull up to a point for standard use, but then that applies to everything. It's just common sense.

4k performance indicates a solid drive (forgive the pun) which has spare potential should it ever be needed, and is a good starting point in your reserch for a drive that will fit your needs, whatever they may be.
 
Back
Top Bottom