What if? Historical Scenario

I am not so sure America would have launched Nuclear bombs at mainland Europe.

Hitler's total disregard for the facts was his undoing. The sheer ignorance of the real situation time and time again proved he was totally disconnected from reality. Especially in the later stages of the war.

Issuing command to units that were stuck in frozen ice and had no ammunition or food and expecting them to comply. It wasn't just Hitler, his entourage can hold much of the blame for his military failures for pampering to his ego.

The best way for Germany to have won the war would have been for Hitler to have been removed from power, assassination or otherwise in the early forties. Imagine if someone like Speer had been the Fuhrer! Then we really might still of had a Nazi Germany.
 
jak731 said:
Not that I know a lot about history, but didn't germany secure lots of oil fields when it invaded russia, even though it failed to take stalingrad? If they had a peace treaty they would not have had this important resource for the rest of their effort in europe.
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Middle East ;), They would have defeated us in north africa and then ripped through the middle east and to the Iraq/Kuwait/Dubai Oilfields.
 
rare said:
The best way for Germany to have won the war would have been for Hitler to have been removed from power, assassination or otherwise in the early forties. Imagine if someone like Speer had been the Fuhrer! Then we really might still of had a Nazi Germany.
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Their is no might, Nazi Germany would definatly still be around today and no doubt control a huge part of world.
 
Chiiives said:
I don't know. By the time America had nukes, I'm sure that Germany would have had nukes aswell, So I think that the USA wouldn't have risked nuking Germany and would have tried to make peace with germany. Leaving Germany to rule North Africa , Europe and the middle east. Nice little empire for them eh.
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After the heavy water production facility was destroyed I would say not.

Another problem was towards the end of the war they were starting to run out of desperately needed materials they simply couldn't get within their own territory. The Allied Air control also severely hurt their industry.
 
I think nuclear weapons are a bit of an irrelevence tbh.
If Hitler hadn't opened a second front against the Russians, I think it's safe to assume that good old Britains days of independance would have been over long before the Americans finished developing the nuclear bomb.
And I think that with Western Europe under German control, and Britain neutralised, the Americans would have sat on their side of the Atlantic thinking all was fine in the world.
Germany declaring war on the Russians was the saving of Britain I think. They were the most potent foe that Germany could face, massive manpower and resource reserves that Germany couldn't hope to match once the initial shock was over.

Phew! Close one. ;)
 
Will Lucky said:
Another problem was towards the end of the war they were starting to run out of desperately needed materials they simply couldn't get within their own territory. The Allied Air control also severely hurt their industry.
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They would have got all the resources needed from the middle east.
Again it comes back to hitler,if he hadn't stopped the development of the jet into a fighter then they would have devestated and completely stopped the Allied Bombing raids.
 
jak731 said:
Not that I know a lot about history, but didn't germany secure lots of oil fields when it invaded russia, even though it failed to take stalingrad? If they had a peace treaty they would not have had this important resource for the rest of their effort in europe.
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they never really secured any oil fields worth while. What they really needed was to fully attack in Africa, getting to the middle east that way. This would have also shut off the Suez Canel ruining the allied convoys and naval power in the Mediterranean. Still the problem is transport, getting all that oil back to Germany.
 
pah 'what if's"... ok then...

what if work on frank Whittle's Jet engine has not been dismissed by his short-sighted superiors in 1928 - Air superirority by Britain Would have been achieved well before the need for American assitance was required.


edit: indeed possibly before war ever broke out?
 
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Everyone has forgotten the Japanese as well. What would become of them?

It's an interesting scenario especially given the massive Soviet counter offensive that freed the Eastern Front from Axis control. The Russians had a truly frightening army if you sit back and think about the push they made from Moscow all the way to Berlin.
 
The amount of military power at your disposal is irrelevant if you leader is as tactically inept as Hitler was. He wasn't assassinated for that very reason.
 
Hitler did not 'hold back' at Stalingrad, taken in by Goring's promises of air supply he told the 6th Army to stand fast and defend German gains after it was it encircled. If Von Paulus had attempted a breakout in the early stages of the encirclement it is probable that the Germans would have broken through and made it back to a more defensible line to wait out the winter. Hitler and Von Paulus ensured the demise of the 6th Army.
 
OldCoals said:
The amount of military power at your disposal is irrelevant if you leader is as tactically inept as Hitler was. He wasn't assassinated for that very reason.
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There where a large number of attempts on Hitler's life which obviously never came to anything. Hitler was paranoid and prone to changing his plans at the last minute which proved to hinder any assassin. I suggest you read about Georg Elsner and his lone attempt which so nearly succeeded.
 
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eddiemcgarrigle said:
Hitler did not 'hold back' at Stalingrad, taken in by Goring's promises of air supply he told the 6th Army to stand fast and defend German gains after it was it encircled. If Von Paulus had attempted a breakout in the early stages of the encirclement it is probable that the Germans would have broken through and made it back to a more defensible line to wait out the winter. Hitler and Von Paulus ensured the demise of the 6th Army.
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Not only this, but when the Russians were preparing the counter offensive they only barely outnumbered the German forces but due to tactical intelligence on the Soviet's part they managed to get a 2:1 ratio of forces at key points.
 
He wasn't assassinated for that very reason.
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Eh? He wasn't assassinated successfully, but there were many attempts. The 20th July plot being the most famous, which could have very easily killed Hitler had it not been for sheer luck on his part.
 
eddiemcgarrigle said:
There where a large number of attempts on Hitler's life which obviously never came to anything. Hitler was paranoid and prone to changing his plans at the last minute which proved to hinder any assassin. I suggest you read about Georg Elsner and his lone attempt which so nearly succeeded.
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rare said:
Eh? He wasn't assassinated successfully, but there were many attempts. The 20th July plot being the most famous, which could have very easily killed Hitler had it not been for sheer luck on his part.
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he meant allied attempts on his life, we never tried to kill him. Almost all assassination attempts were by GERMANS because they knew how things would be so much better without him.
 
Forgot to mention. I read a good book on the toilet that dealt with alternative histories called 'Virtual history: Alternatives and counterfactuals' by Niall Ferguson (editor).

K1LLSW1TCH said:
Everyone has forgotten the Japanese as well. What would become of them?

It's an interesting scenario especially given the massive Soviet counter offensive that freed the Eastern Front from Axis control. The Russians had a truly frightening army if you sit back and think about the push they made from Moscow all the way to Berlin.
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Sheer bloody man power and persistence paid off. Their enemy however weakened over time to the point they were fighting starved soldiers.

Not only did they push on the E front, but they eventually pushed the Japs out of Soviet soil as well at the end.
 
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rare said:
Eh? He wasn't assassinated successfully, but there were many attempts. The 20th July plot being the most famous, which could have very easily killed Hitler had it not been for sheer luck on his part.
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There were, obviosuly, quite a few assissination attempts on Hitler's life which are well documented. However, towards the end of the war Hilter became more and more unpredictable and more of a hinderence to the Nazi war effort so it was generally thought it was better for the Allies if he was alive than dead.
 
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