Koran burning in reaction to 9/11
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A great many people (intelligent or not) view Islam as a religion that encourages acts of terror against non-believers etc.
I'm not saying its right, but thats the reason.
It seems they want to achieve a 'mental strike' against Islam, which in all honesty, is working.
Indeed. A cursory read of the Koran/Qur'an does indeed make disturbing reading. While the Christian bible (especially the old testament) makes many references to ancient violent culture etc, most of the violence seems to be centred around acts of God himself. Not that that's a good thing (I'm neither Christian nor Muslim btw).
In the Koran/Qur'an however, it rather more openly encourages random and ongoing violence by its followers, at least as far as I can see as an interested but independent reader. For example:
"Slay them wherever you find them...Idolatry is worse than carnage...Fight against them until idolatry is no more and God's religion reigns supreme." (Surah 2:190-)
"Fighting is obligatory for you, much as you dislike it." (Surah 2:216)
"If you should die or be slain in the cause of God, His forgiveness and His mercy would surely be better than all the riches..." (Surah 3:156-)
"Seek out your enemies relentlessly." (Surah 4:103-)
"Believers, take neither Jews nor Christians for your friends." (Surah 5:51)
"Believers, when you encounter the infidels on the march, do not turn your backs to them in flight. If anyone on that day turns his back to them, except it be for tactical reasons...he shall incur the wrath of God and Hell shall be his home..." (Surah 8:12-)
"Make war on them until idolatry shall cease and God's religion shall reign supreme." (Surah 8:36-)
"If you do not fight, He will punish you sternly, and replace you by other men." (Surah 9:37-)
"Believers, make war on the infidels who dwell around you. Deal firmly with them." (Surah 9:121-)
"Fight for the cause of God with the devotion due to Him...He has given you the name of Muslims..." (Surah 22:7
"Muhammad is God's apostle. Those who follow him are ruthless to the unbelievers but merciful to one another." (Surah 48:29)
One or two of those can be read a little ambiguously, for example they could be taken on a spiritual rather than physical level, but most are rather un-ambiguously xenophobic and openly hostile. Whatever happened to love your neighbour as you love yourself? If the above really is in the Muslim holy book, and Muslims are expected to follow it, then no wonder some people get so worked up by it.
Worthy of further study, I think.
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Soldato
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What's wrong with a bit of self-belief, stick ALL religions up your arse that's what I say.
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You're wrong there, did you see how many times the Philistines were massacred lol?
Sorry I should have been clearer. As I said I'm neither Christian nor Muslim; I simply meant to say that for all their respective foibles, the Christian bible seems to preach "Love thy neighbour as thyself, you reap what you sow" etc. The Qur'an on the other hand, as quoted above, says that Muslims can't be friends with non-Muslims and must make war against them in God's (Allah's) name regardless, even if they don't want to. The penalty of avoiding this is eternal hell.
Quite a difference.
Muslim's are 'special' due to the large amount of terror groups attributed to them, they tend to get special treatment in various cases as to avoid acts of terror against the country/people in question.
Denmark was a very good example with the cartoons.
Just googled these:
2 Corinthians 6:14
Do not be unequally yoked with unbelievers. For what partnership has righteousness with lawlessness? Or what fellowship has light with darkness?
2 Chronicles 15:12-13
And they entered into a covenant to seek the LORD God of their fathers with all their heart and with all their soul; That whosoever would not seek the LORD God of Israel should be put to death, whether small or great, whether man or woman.
In the Koran/Qur'an however, it rather more openly encourages random and ongoing violence by its followers, at least as far as I can see as an interested but independent reader. For example:
Worthy of further study, I think.
"Slay them wherever you find them...Idolatry is worse than carnage...Fight against them until idolatry is no more and God's religion reigns supreme." (Surah 2:190-)
"Fighting is obligatory for you, much as you dislike it." (Surah 2:216)
"If you should die or be slain in the cause of God, His forgiveness and His mercy would surely be better than all the riches..." (Surah 3:156-)
"Seek out your enemies relentlessly." (Surah 4:103-)
"Believers, take neither Jews nor Christians for your friends." (Surah 5:51)
"Believers, when you encounter the infidels on the march, do not turn your backs to them in flight. If anyone on that day turns his back to them, except it be for tactical reasons...he shall incur the wrath of God and Hell shall be his home..." (Surah 8:12-)
"Make war on them until idolatry shall cease and God's religion shall reign supreme." (Surah 8:36-)
"If you do not fight, He will punish you sternly, and replace you by other men." (Surah 9:37-)
"Believers, make war on the infidels who dwell around you. Deal firmly with them." (Surah 9:121-)
"Fight for the cause of God with the devotion due to Him...He has given you the name of Muslims..." (Surah 22:7
"Muhammad is God's apostle. Those who follow him are ruthless to the unbelievers but merciful to one another." (Surah 48:29)
Read your translation and now read mine. Yes some are different, but why pick out the bad bits only? It's not random, there's more to it. If you read all of the translations, it's balanced.
EDIT: Zynoist Jews killing the innocent Philistines (Palestinians), just because they won't leave Jerusalem were Masjid Al-Aqsa is. But no-one calls them terrorists? I think people are so against Islam because they're scared. They're scared that it is the right religion. No-one mentions other terrorists groups, or relates any other religions to them. Look at the Tamil Tigers, they're mostly hindu. IRA are probably made up of Christians, prositents or Catholics?
EDIT 2: Unbelievers further on in the Qur'an also result to Muslims who are Hypocrites. They say they don't do things against Islam, but then do them. Like I said, it's balanced.
To Balance out more.
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A semantic point, perhaps, but please be clear the translation isn't 'mine'.
As I said I'm just reading around out of interest.Are you serious?
EDIT: BTW Yes the IRA, for example, are Catholic but as far as I know they are terrorists because they want Ireland to be independent of Britain. They don't plant bombs because someone, somewhere isn't a Catholic. Muslim extremists on the other hand, are the ones directly equating terror with their religion. "Death to the unbelievers", "Behead those who do not follow Islam", "Death to the West, Allah is god" etc. That kinda gives Islam a negative spin to those third party observers who previously had no interest either way. Surely you see the distinction? They certainly don't fear Islam because deep down they suspect it's actually the "right" religion. LOL
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Surely he can't be.
I pretty much am, and forgive me if I offend you. But as of this moment It seems to me like it is the case. I mean why burn the Qur'an? A holy book which is read by billions of the Muslims in the world?
But burning it just because of terrorist Islamic extremists? That is lame. It's such a small petty excuse. I think there is more to it, then they ever let on. Maybe burning it, they want to see if Allah is there and to see what will happen when they burn it? If nothing happens, they will say there is no Allah and Islam is made up. But people say that anyway.
If you really believe that, you really are deluded. I've never heard such silliness. Or should I say, I'm astounded by your twisted logic. You didn't offend me in the slightest, I just think you're very 'different' in your thought process than the average bear.
See my edit above about equating religion to terror, too. Islam really doesn't help itself in its promoted image - and then you come up with the above in response? I'm very much a proponent of interfaith as frankly being a human being is more important to me than a person's religion. But when you say something like that? I can only lol. Sorry.
That just sounds... insane. Do you honestly think they are burning it to see if Allah will strike them down? Really?
It is stupid to accuse most people of wishing they were a Muslim, you just dont do things like that... or well maybe you do.
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Sorry I should have been clearer. As I said I'm neither Christian nor Muslim; I simply meant to say that for all their respective foibles, the Christian bible seems to preach "Love thy neighbour as thyself, you reap what you sow" etc. The Qur'an on the other hand, as quoted above, says that Muslims can't be friends with non-Muslims and must make war against them in God's (Allah's) name regardless, even if they don't want to. The penalty of avoiding this is eternal hell.
Quite a difference.
Actually, you're not quite right... Sadly I went to a Christian school, so I know a few bits and bobs. The new testament is effectively modern Christianity, and yes it is for the most part entirely peaceful.
However, Jews and Christians both have beliefs linked to the Old Testament, and there is plenty of stuff in there about slaughtering the enemies of God. Much fire and brimstone (sodomites, philistines, ...), so whilst most Christians don't take the old testament too seriously - the new testament overrides it - it would be inaccurate to say it is all peace and love. That most definitely is not the case.
Anyway, I'm not a religious person either, just find it interesting really.
According to Vita you actually don't like the old testament because you want to become it.
To you I may be deluded, but I that's what I believe. Logic isn't twisted, just because you don't believe the same, doesn't mean my logic is twisted.
Rainmaker said:
Islam has only got a bad image because of the idiotic terrorists. Say before 9/11, what was your opinion of Islam? Did you think it was a peaceful religion or a crazy bomb exploding one?
It's ok to lol, some people agree, some people disagree.
To you I may be deluded, but I that's what I believe. Logic isn't twisted, just because you don't believe the same, doesn't mean my logic is twisted.
Islam has only got a bad image because of the idiotic terrorists. Say before 9/11, what was your opinion of Islam? Did you think it was a peaceful religion or a crazy bomb exploding one?
It's ok to lol, some people agree, some people disagree.
Let's be clear here. I'm not having a go at you, and I deeply respect your religious belief and your right to it.
I'm sorry if I came across any other way, genuinely. However you have to admit, saying casually that people fear Islam and/or Muslims because they know it's the correct religion was a bit... shallow? Short sighted? As you said, 20 years ago there was much less, if not nil(?) association of Islam with extreme terrorism as there is today. As you further correctly state, this is down to extremists (who by definition don't represent your majority). In that case, surely your statement is self-defeating and you actually acknowledge the FEAR (aka TERROR) was caused by the, um, TERRORists?
That's all I meant.
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