Koran burning in reaction to 9/11

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bhavv said:
The barbaric Chinese regime is not as much of an international problem, and it doesnt lead to teaching hatred or intolerance towards non Chinese people. The communist government itself is very inhumane and extremist, yet these problems do not lead to conflicts between the chinese people themselves and others, nor do they teach their people to be intolerant or hateful towards other people.

There is a very big difference to me between China's communism, and political Islam.
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Now that's a decent reply. I don't agree with you, but at least you tried this time. ;) :p The parallel was drawn with Communist China (especially during the Mao/Cultural Revolution era) because Sharia Law and Muslims were basically being tarred as the extreme of extremism, and people were inferring that religion was the cause of all the nastiness in the world.

My point was, and remains, that a quick look at the way atheism led to Communist barbarity in and around China refutes this idea completely. Tibetans would strongly disagree that China hasn't spread the bile and violence outside of her borders, btw.

I see no difference between certain factions of Islam and the way China's regime conducted (conducts?) itself. My point being that religion most certainly isn't the common element as Mao was staunchly atheist. The whole barbaric farce came about precisely because Mao decided the religionists were backwards and needed dragging 'kicking and screaming' into the modern era. The way non-Han nationals are treated continues to be comparatively appalling and again we certainly can't blame Islam for that.
 
Lol @ the replies in this thread.

Let me start;

Bhavv, you have an issue with Muslims, and no it's not because you're an atheist. And you don't know FA about Islam. All you can do is pick the bits which seem very bad out of the Qur'an, for you that is enough to say "OMG IT'S EVIL". Show's how much intellect you have. Life is a balance, as it goes with the Qur'an, it's balanced. Tbh, you have no respect for Muslims/Islam, just because 2 girls and a taxi driver asked you how you can't believe in God.

thedoc46, you might as well parade around naked with a board on your body which says "I'm with bhavv."

Rainmaker, this guy actually looks at both sides of the river. See this is what you call balance. And his replies are actually half decent.

Seriously, learn to study Islam as well as other religions and not bend over backwards because of the media hype. Bhavv, look at page 5 of this thread and my post at the bottom. You'll see it says;

"2:62 Those who believe (in the Qur'an), and those who follow the Jewish (scriptures), and the Christians and the Sabians,- any who believe in Allah and the Last Day, and work righteousness, shall have their reward with their Lord; on them shall be no fear, nor shall they grieve.".

So how can Islam only favour the Muslims, for we are all Gods creation. People who disbelieve will get Punished, no doubt about that, as it says in the Qur'an. But why do you think wrong of that? I really think you are scared tbh, you're scared of religion, whether it be Islam or any other. This is why you talk utter BS.
 
Vita said:
Rainmaker, this guy actually looks at both sides of the river. See this is what you call balance. And his replies are actually half decent.
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Only half? I am disappoint. ;) Seriously though, let's continue;

So how can Islam only favour the Muslims, for we are all Gods creation. People who disbelieve will get Punished, no doubt about that, as it says in the Qur'an. But why do you think wrong of that?
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So basically, despite my best endeavours to be appreciative of your viewpoints, to try to understand your religious beliefs (and my professed total respect of them and your right to them), your closing words are that I, as a non-Abrahamic follower of a different belief system, will be rightfully punished?

Hmm.
 
Rainmaker said:
I see no difference between certain factions of Islam and the way China's regime conducted (conducts?) itself. My point being that religion most certainly isn't the common element as Mao was staunchly atheist. The whole barbaric farce came about precisely because Mao decided the religionists were backwards and needed dragging 'kicking and screaming' into the modern era. The way non-Han nationals are treated continues to be comparatively appalling and again we certainly can't blame Islam for that.
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Mao is held in high regard in China, and is respected for having modernized the country and turning it into a major world power. Chinese people are on the whole very modernized and tolerant towards other people. A least today, freedom of religion is allowed in China, however not a freedom of Assembly. Plus people in China have many more equal rights than people under the Sharia law do.

Islam however spreads intolerance and hatred towards non Muslims within its sharia states, and still has laws to execute people for not living according to backward, barbarianistic religious rules.

I dont consider China today to be even 50% as bad as the Islamic world is.

Vita said:
"2:62 Those who believe (in the Qur'an), and those who follow the Jewish (scriptures), and the Christians and the Sabians,- any who believe in Allah and the Last Day, and work righteousness, shall have their reward with their Lord; on them shall be no fear, nor shall they grieve.".

So how can Islam only favour the Muslims, for we are all Gods creation. People who disbelieve will get Punished, no doubt about that, as it says in the Qur'an. But why do you think wrong of that? I really think you are scared tbh, you're scared of religion, whether it be Islam or any other. This is why you talk utter BS.
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Because in the real world, most Muslims do not follow that belief. Also, it says nothing about non religious people, or people outside of the Abrahamic religions which you have already proven to be incredibly disrespectful towards yourself.

Why the heck should I, or anyone else be required to respect Islam when Islam doesnt respect other religions, or lack of religion (which it really doesnt, anyone that thinks it does is a blatant liar).

Rainmaker said:
So basically, despite my best endeavours to be appreciative of your viewpoints, to try to understand your religious beliefs (and my professed total respect of them and your right to them), your closing words are that I, as a non-Abrahamic follower of a different belief system, will be rightfully punished?

Hmm.
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You can appreciate and respect Islam as much as you want to, but make no mistake, Islam will never respect you or any non Muslim.
 
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Rainmaker said:
So basically, despite my best endeavours to be appreciative of your viewpoints, to try to understand your religious beliefs (and my professed total respect of them and your right to them), your closing words are that I, as a non-Abrahamic follower of a different belief system, will be rightfully punished?

Hmm.
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TBH a lot of his posts have been :\

TBF I'm keen to know how Quantum Mechanics entwines with the Buddhism teachings of Cosmology, I can't find any specifics, I am genuinely interested in this stuff.
 
I'm laughing at Obama ordering everyone to be tolerant in regards the mosque.

Now this guy wants to do something on his property and Obama is saying don't.
 
bhavv said:
Actually the Bible makes a lot more sense than the Koran does, at least its English version is understandable.

Anyhow, this is what the Koran says:



Much of that is not about a 'defensive war', only 5.33 specifically is.



Yet more denial and lies about Muslims being tolerant towards non Muslims. This really is not the case, all the evidence in the world can back that up, but of course, Spawn will just deny it, and tell you that everything is a lie.
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Despite the risk of getting in to a pointless tit for tat quotation of the Qu'ran, so I shall only take the first quotation,

Qu'ran said:
3.151 3.151 . We shall cast terror into the hearts of those who disbelieve because they ascribe unto Allah partners , for which no warrant hath been revealed . Their habitation is the Fire , and hapless the abode of the wrong doers .
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See the different (and valid) translation and interpretation of the words. In this context it is simply stating that their belief in Allah will terrify those who believe in the other abrahamic versions God when they realise that they do not have the word of God given to them. They are consigned to dwell in fire (purgatory) as unbelievers. It doesn't necessarily mean that Muslims should go around burning the infidel.

Also you need to put the entire Surah into context and include other Ayats to garner a fuller view of what is being said (I agree it is difficult to get through) for example Ayat 3,159 states:

Qu'ran said:
3.159 . It was by the mercy of Allah that thou wast lenient with them ( O Muhammad ) , for if thou hadst been stern and fierce of heart they would have dispersed from round about thee . So pardon them and ask forgiveness for them and consult with them upon the conduct of affairs . And when thou art resolved , then put thy trust in Allah . Lo! Allah loveth those who put their trust ( in Him ) .
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Here it states that peace should be the preferred option, and that teaching and mercy are the preferable courses of action.


This is what I mean by interpretation, like most Holy scripture of any description, translations and interpretation can make anything sound or seem like whatever the interpretor requires, and I am sure that anyone could and will interpret those passages somewhat differently.

But my point is, it is not the Words, but the Mind of the person that uses them that can decide how they are used.
 
Allnamestaken said:
Bhavv you dont happen to be asian/ Indian by any chance lol...
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Allnamestaken said:
:P he has a typical indian name lol... which could explain why RedDan :p
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Because there are no Asian / Indian atheists, am I right? Oh no wait, I'm not, seeing that I am not one myself.

I would also suggest you try looking up some Ex Muslim opinions on Islam, I would highly recommend for you to look up both Wafa Sultan, and Maryam Namazie, both of who are Ex Muslims and highly critical and against the religion.

I cant take anyone with your viewpoint seriously, you have to be incredibly small minded to think that brown Asian people must automatically be Muslims or some other religion.

We can modern, westernised and secular too you know.
 
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Rainmaker said:
So basically, despite my best endeavours to be appreciative of your viewpoints, to try to understand your religious beliefs (and my professed total respect of them and your right to them), your closing words are that I, as a non-Abrahamic follower of a different belief system, will be rightfully punished?

Hmm.
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What about me? I seem to know more about their religion than they do and yet I don't ascribe to any religion. I am a real unbeliever.


Although Islam does state that it is Actions and not simply Belief that is rewarded in Heaven.:p
 
pirate said:
I think they are closer than we think with the growing hatred against Islam especially in the US.
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We live in troubled times but I dont take most of whats in the media on board its all lies propaganda and petrol dollars for the most part.

Also a frightened population consumes more which is great for big business.

Look how more frightened the US were during the Cold War than us here in the UK reds under the bed and all that.
 
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