old cars and new cars

Housey · 24 Sep 2010 at 19:41

I was actually working in a Pug garage when the 205GTi was released, it was simply awesome.

adam cool dude · 24 Sep 2010 at 19:46

[TW]Fox;17444124 said:
Each manufacturers higher end cars are more powerful and faster than ever before!

A Focus ST is quicker than a Ford Escort Cosworth. A BMW M5 is considerably quicker than an E34 M5. A Golf GTI is faster than it was in 1995. The fastest non M Power 3 Series in 1995 was 192bhp. Now, the fastest non M Power 3 Series is even quicker than the mid 90's M3 at over 300bhp. In 95 a hot Clio had 150bhp, now it has 200bhp...

But yea, it was way better in 95, right? Before all the emissions stuff, yea?

Thats simply due to the evolution of engines over time. Variable Valve Timing being a big one that came in during the mid 90's. Engines are putting out a lot more power but please tell me how many of them are built N/A engines or the cheaper more environmentally friendly turbo option. The BMW M5 has gone from a V10 to V8 with turbo's has it not? The Focus ST is only FWD whereas the Escort Cosworth was a Homologation built 4wd rally car.

I agree with you on clio's. Their performance option has gotten a lot better over the years but then you only have to think back to R5GTT2 or the Clio V6 and look at what they got now.

Also if we didn't have all this emmisions rubbish cars would be more powerful then what they are now.

[TW]Fox · 24 Sep 2010 at 19:49

adam cool dude said:
Thats simply due to the evolution of engines over time. Variable Valve Timing being a big one that came in during the mid 90's. Engines are putting out a lot more power but please tell me how many of them are built N/A engines or the cheaper more environmentally friendly turbo option.

The current M3 is normally aspirated and 400bhp. The current 911 GT3 is normally aspirated. etc etc? There is no current M5. Sure the next one is Turbo but are you saying there wasn't a turbo craze in the 90's?

The Focus ST is only FWD whereas the Escort Cosworth was a Homologation built 4wd rally car.

Is that the TURBOCHARGED Escort Cosworth?

adam cool dude · 24 Sep 2010 at 19:55

[TW]Fox;17444280 said:
Is that the TURBOCHARGED Escort Cosworth?

Yep just like the the engine in the focus ST which is a 90's designed volvo engine

.

wassap · 24 Sep 2010 at 22:02

I want both, I appreciate that we will never go back to the good old days where a modern car will have the real driving feel, new cars to me are just over assisted with brakes and steering and have too many stupid driver aids such as electronic hanbrakes and such like, but they have their place.I spent 3 years running a ST3,and after a year of owning a Accord and a NA MX5 I will never go back to running a hot car day to day.I never thought I would say this but old mans cars to have they place

Love the feel and feedback from an old car, you just feel like you are driving them.I love the fact I can fix them myself.

But I love the fact I can just get in my Honda and drive for 30k a year without it ever skipping a beat, feel means nothing when trundling up and down the M5 doing the daily grind.I love the fact I can plug in my Ipod and all that jazz.

sigma · 24 Sep 2010 at 22:14

I don't quite understand this thread now. People are basically saying that great cars are great and crap cars are well, crap. :s

Iamzod · 25 Sep 2010 at 00:26

Old cars for fun, new cars for boring everyday stuff.

Unless you have really deep pockets!

Joshy · 25 Sep 2010 at 10:14

Joshy said:
Cars (at least to an enthusiast) should have at least a little bit of drama.

Just to prove that I mean this, today it looks the the seals of the Soarer's blowers are... well, blown

.

It's a bill that is going to mean that financially I'm better off writing off the car, but I'm not. I'm going to get it fixed, and I'm actually going to enjoy it.

Buying new bits for old cars and fixing them gives me sort of a warm, fuzzy feeling that I just don't think I'd have if I had to replace the DPF on a 57 plate Golf TDI out of my own pocket.

Scania · 25 Sep 2010 at 13:05

adam cool dude said:
Also if we didn't have all this emmisions rubbish cars would be more powerful then what they are now.

Not really, as an example, a bog basic current fiesta puts out more power than the old XR2.

The older car had no emissions rubbish as you put it, the modern one has more power, but more weight.

Incidentally, old trucks had sod all in terms of emission control, current ones are cleaner than equivalent vans of not so many years back....

Scanias latest big beast puts out 730BHP,while meeting all of the Euro emission regs.

It will still better the fuel consumption of the older, non "emission rubbish ruined" Scania 3 Series - the 143 500 V8 - despite having 230 more HP and being a 16litre over the 14litre lump in the older models (great engine that it was mind)

Progress I think its called.....

lemonade · 25 Sep 2010 at 13:45

I prefer old cars, they just had more character and something else about them, new cars leave me cold, too sterile and most are too big, don't like the styling either, too round and bulgy looking, that said I would still buy 'new' cars, depends on what I want at that moment of time.

Lum · 25 Sep 2010 at 14:30

Yes, technology has improved, however think of how much more it would have improved if we didn't have so much emissions crud in there?

Anyway my objection to the emissions stuff isn't that it should be removed completely, just that the modern stuff is far too complicated, expensive and short lived for the gains it gives. EGR was bad enough, "hey, lets fill the intake full of oil and crud", but at least it's fairly cheap to fix/bypass compared to some of the stuff on cars these days.