Martial arts for self-defence for rookies - the experts need to be more frank I think.

[Retromatic]

I've been interested in Krav Maga and Muay Thai for a while, got my eldest son into Muay Thai which he loves. He was being picked on at school by some older boys and after a time things got physical and he gave the ringleader a smack in the chest, they left him alone after that.

For myself I wouldn't mind learning either just for a piece of mind/fitness. I haven't had a fight for years but always handy to know I guess...

 

[SexyGreyFox]

but he said the reality is scary - people so drugged up or psyched up that almost no matter how hard you hit them they won't go down.

And virtually every night on Bravo or Sky3 we can see Cop shows where 6 burly coppers are having trouble keeping a small bloke down.
That's the reality.

 

[Zatoichi.uK]

And virtually every night on Bravo or Sky3 we can see Cop shows where 6 burly coppers are having trouble keeping a small bloke down.
That's the reality.

Reminds me of a classic quote. 'Its not the size of the dog in the fight, but the size of the fight in the dog'. The willingness to fight is a massive factor that is often underestimated.

One thing I will say is that in general, I find people who train in traditional MA to be more humble students that those that come from MMA/Boxing environments, typically because they cover elements of philosophy and history. There are exceptions of course but in general holds true.

I've also found almost every MA is plagued by politics and rivalry that is almost in comparison with religion. Everyone seems to think theirs is the only true way and is scared to open their eyes to see what else is out there. It's a real shame.

 

[Eliot]

Last time I went to a house party
Not a party in a house BTW we are talking all out drink fest
I had a few but was in control and some guy I never met before came up to me and I could tell the conversation was going only 1 way from the start
It was totally pre emptied tbh and after about 20 secs I lost it
BTW being tall and skinny people who are short and huge people try to smash you in at any opportunity. Any way long story short is I ended up blocking 11 punches to the head
I can remember all of them and in fact I actually counted

Point is I think blocking punches is easy once you've been alerted to the fact that it could be possible. I managed have someone start on me in magaluf too. And just pushed them back with my right Arm about 4 or 5 times while he swung
That time some random who I talked to for all of 5 seconds ran up and full force swung for the guy he ended up with quite a cut tbh

So like I said defense imo isnt too hard in real life situations imo
The hard part is avoiding the fight verbally

 

[snapdragon]

It's a good idea on learning how to stop a potential fight at the verbal stage through the use of body language and verbal tones. The best and imo the only way to lauch a suitable defence is to go on the offence as soon as you know a fight is unavoidable.

in a street situation this is all there is too it, talk it down or strike first

 

[Dj_Jestar]

ocuk's very own street thugs. lol. Just lol.

 

[Lightnix]

Also, no amount of training is going to help you if an attacker sneaks up behind you with a metal crowbar and cracks open your brain stem killing you instantly.

Right, but some training might help the attacker if he's going for the brain stem with a big vertical swing rather than the temple.

That said my opinion on martial arts is that whilst it's not going to turn you into some kind of invulnerable house like man, it's helpful in the instant someone who doesn't really know what they're doing goes for you. And, if nothing else, the exercise will give you a bit more stamina when it's time to run away.

 

[Dj_Jestar]

That and the world's armies have been training their troops martial arts in one form or another for millennia, tells you it helps.

 

[Beansprout]

My two kids are going for their Brown belts this coming weekend, they've been doing karate for just over 2 years now, twice a week without fail. A lot of the techniques you speak about are 2nd nature to them NOW. I instilled into them that they must learn self defence because basically there are some severe LOW LIFES out there and they must be in a position to defend themselves at all times. Needless to say I'm hoping to be a very proud Dad come Saturday evening. BTW one is 15 the other is 9 and it also helps that my wife is at the same level Mess with me, mess with my family...lol

What happens when the bad guy has a knife?

 

[Dj_Jestar]

Heaven forbid someone actually tries to prepare themselves, or to at least do something to help if they find themselves in an unfortunate situation. People have guns too, might as well top ourselves right now.

P.S. dealing with knife wielding attackers is a huge part of any martial art.

 

[Lightnix]

When I used to do ju jitsu my instructor (/sensei, however you want to say it) made sure to tell everyone that the most important part is getting out of the way of whatever it is that's about to cause damage to you - I think it was that the second most important thing is making sure you're in a good position to get out of the way again. I think that concept was also applicable to knives.

 

[Hive]

You get good at something by practising. You practise to not just improve technique but most importantly to make things (in the case of fighting: moves) instinctive. Fights go at a manic speed and trying to react to attacks on a conscious level is hopeless.

Having training in most martial arts will always provide a better chance to escape a hostile situation.

 

[hurfdurf]

hurfdurf do you train, or are you just a big MMA fan?

I train, I'm also a massive MMA nerd/super fan. My lifestyle doesn't really cater to being an athlete so I train more for the fun of it, self defence and mainly so I can understand it more and relate to the fighters when I watch it on TV or talk to them.

I think when my life calms down I would love to try my hand at competing, but at the moment it would be a waste of time and I would get my ass kicked against all but the scrubbiest of scrubs without the confidence of knowing my training had been my top priority.

They use everything from every "brand"

There are plenty of holds/locks taken from Aikido (particulary wrist locks) that form an integral part of Jiu Jitsu - and vice versa.

Cro Cop's famous high kicks can be directly related to Kung Fu, Karate, hell even Capoeira.

A lot of core movements in all forms of martial arts are the same movements. The different styles only differ on how they use these movements in conjunction with other movements.

Thats like saying Stephenie Meyer takes her ques from Shakespear because they both write in English and use a pen. CroCop has never had an Aikido, Kung Fu or Capoeira lesson in his life, its such a laughable form of martial art Anderson Silva bought in Stephan Seagul for his last fight, as a practical joke!

The reality is a lot of styles have been severely shown up by MMA coming to fruition and all these mythical fighting styles being shown to not work in real life or physical combat competition, and now the Bullshido forums actively seek these people with their fantastical claims and challenge them to fights, always proving that they were talking rubbish. A Karate or TaeKwondo practitioner may throw kicks, and some of those kicks may have similarities to a Kickboxers, but they are completely different forms of combat, and only the Kickboxers have ever made it any where in MMA whereas the majority of pretty yet completely ineffective styles have been all but abandoned in open competition because of their worthlessness.

I am sorry if you did one of those martial arts and you are trying to cling on to the false confidence it has given you. Even talk of breaking boards and baseball bats is nothing but trickery and most 12 year old girls could do it given 3 weeks conditioning, its not impressive to anyone who knows the tricks to it and understands its worthlessness as anything but a showcase of aesthetics or parlour trick aimed at non practitioners.

 

[hurfdurf]

My two kids are going for their Brown belts this coming weekend, they've been doing karate for just over 2 years now, twice a week without fail. A lot of the techniques you speak about are 2nd nature to them NOW. I instilled into them that they must learn self defence because basically there are some severe LOW LIFES out there and they must be in a position to defend themselves at all times. Needless to say I'm hoping to be a very proud Dad come Saturday evening. BTW one is 15 the other is 9 and it also helps that my wife is at the same level Mess with me, mess with my family...lol

You are being conned out of money and are putting your kids in danger, hth.

 

[Greenlizard0]

If I completed my martial arts training, I would actually be fearful of causing another mans death should I lose my temper in a more ferocious than normal fashion.

Will you be that hard in prison? Or will he?

 

[panthro]

You are being conned out of money and are putting your kids in danger, hth.

Seriously, you have no idea about martials arts because of your closed mind and attitude towards everything that isnt MMA. You seem to think you are some kind of authority but you clearly arent from any of your posts. Just stick to being an MMA fanboy, youre obviously good at it.
Im not going to start any arguments with you but just wanted to point out to other posters to not take what you say as some kind of guide or gospel, because that would be putting them in danger HTH.
BTW - regarding one of your posts earlier about MMA artists training in karate etc, Bas Rutten is a black belt in Kyokushin and TKD.

 

[eatcustard]

You are being conned out of money and are putting your kids in danger, hth.

What?????
Where is the danger?

 

[SexyGreyFox]

P.S. dealing with knife wielding attackers is a huge part of any martial art.

But how many times have you dealt with a proper knife wielding attack where it isn't a preset controlled swing at you in a Dojo?
I'm not saying your training is useless but just not real world.

 

[The IPB]

Seriously, you have no idea about martials arts because of your closed mind and attitude towards everything that isnt MMA. You seem to think you are some kind of authority but you clearly arent from any of your posts. Just stick to being an MMA fanboy, youre obviously good at it.
Im not going to start any arguments with you but just wanted to point out to other posters to not take what you say as some kind of guide or gospel, because that would be putting them in danger HTH.
BTW - regarding one of your posts earlier about MMA artists training in karate etc, Bas Rutten is a black belt in Kyokushin and TKD.

Lots of MMA fighters have black belts in traditional arts, in fact most of them I would have thought.

It will slowly die out though, as the new breed of kids coming into the sport train MMA from the start.

Most of the current crop, were training in traditional arts before MMA got popular and then crossed over into MMA.

I'm not knocking traditional arts, they all have something to give hence the term mixed martial arts

 

[Banzai_Joe]

This is a good post, OP should read this post and my posts in this thread, ignore all others, except maybe Meridian's.

I hope you're joking because with respect, a couple of your posts of so narrow-minded. The opposite of what MA is supposed to teach.

Every single MA/CA is as good as the individual makes it.
I've only been in 2 violent encounters when out in the city. One was around the time was training in kick/thai boxing (5 nights a week) and often teaching it. 2 guys attacked, one hit the deck from a simple but fast leg sweep, the other legged it.
The other incident was again 2 guys attacking me. This was well over decade later and my main art was aikido. And it was purely aikido that subdued them both. I understood aikido and was pretty good at implementing it....by moving out the way and letting both of them hit the wall (daft as it may sound to some) then ground-locked both of them.

hurfdurf you are obviously picturing the flowery looking techniques of aikido and dismissing them as rubbish and worthless; This, i think is narrow-minded.
I'll agree with anyone that says MMA is the most practical (yourself included). How could it not be, its a mix of 'allegedly' the best parts of many MA's. However, some of the best MMA fighters are BJJ exponents, and i doubt very much that a pub brawl would end up on the floor without others joining in. Therefore upright fighting technique is required...hence the effectiveness of MMA.

So, back to the "its what the individual makes of each art". My long time friend and aikido collegue has a dan degree in Dang Lang Kung Fu, and i've not met anyone who can touch him in a sparring match. Even my other 2nd shotokan/2nd aikido collegue who used him for extra sparring for his 3rd dan grading.
His fluidity and hand/foot speed is staggering and he could hit me about 6 times before i'd got 1-2 shots in and i thought my hand speed was good.

Don't be so quick to dismiss what may 'look' useless. All MA's have a purpose, even tae kwon do ( ).
But the individual counts more than the art, especially if they 'understand' it.

BTW, this isn't a thread about which art is best in the street. Are we wandering off topic slightly?