Sainsbury's wouldn't sell me a beer...

[GinG]

Was reading this yesterday and thinking what a load of carp. Me and the missus then went to Asda for our weekly big shop. Beers were on offer 3 boxes for £18 so thought we would add them into our basket.

Got to the till and got asked for ID (1st time in probabally 4 years)...all was fine until we realised we had sent our drivers licenses off due to change of address (sods law!).

What I did think was a bit off, was they would not accept my gf's staff nurse ID as proof she is older than 18 (no way can you be 18 to be a staff nurse), her old Uni ID (you have to be at least 18 to go to uni, also would not accept a 'Platinum' Credit card (again have to be over 18 to obtain this).

What really bugged me was rather than use common sence they couldnt accept it because it didnt have a 'pass' logo on any of them. I then started to explain my passport or driving licence does not show a 'pass' logo on so that point was invalid. Also she said she was sorry as she realised we were over 18/21 whatever however as she had asked she couldnt back down...what a load of bs!

In the end we just paid for the other groceries and left not very happy customers!

 

[Ring Peace]

Company policy is they don't want to contribute towards the vast swathes of morons buying drink for under 18's. They feel the best way to enforce this is to simply refuse the sale to anyone who they reasonably suspect may be doing this.

It really is that simple. I used to get this all the time working in games retail - you wouldnt beleive the amount of 18-21 year olds trying to buy stuff like GTA for a 15 year old brother. The whole age thing is a nightmare for the people working there, it really is. It's not that people who are 24 look 18, its that people who are 17 can often look much older, meaning you've no real idea how old anyone is.

If you want to buy alcohol or 18 rated stuff, buy it when you are not with a child.

If you dont like this, buy from a store with a different policy.

It really is that simple and none of the ranting and moaning about how nanny state it is will change it.

I don't know if this has been raised as I haven't read all of the thread, most of this is rubbish. Firstly age on Games has been shown to be guidance only and there is no law mandating the age. Secondly there is no law prohibiting you from buying alcohol and giving it to a minor, the law in fact states this is exactly what you can do, the legal minimum age for alcohol consumption is 5. The licence law also states that some alcohol is allowed to be drunk in restaurants by those aged 16+ if accompanied buy an adult, alcohol is wine beer,cider and perry.

 

[jp_bl_68]

Firstly age on Games has been shown to be guidance only and there is no law mandating the age.

From the BBFC's website:

"Under the terms of the Video Recordings Act 1984 it is illegal to supply a video, DVD or video game which carries a British Board of Film Classification age rating to anyone under the age stated. Failure to comply with this can lead to a fine or imprisonment."

 

[stoofa]

I don't know if this has been raised as I haven't read all of the thread, most of this is rubbish. Firstly age on Games has been shown to be guidance only and there is no law mandating the age. Secondly there is no law prohibiting you from buying alcohol and giving it to a minor, the law in fact states this is exactly what you can do, the legal minimum age for alcohol consumption is 5. The licence law also states that some alcohol is allowed to be drunk in restaurants by those aged 16+ if accompanied buy an adult, alcohol is wine beer,cider and perry.

No, if a game carries a proper BBFC certificate then it is a legal requirement to only supply to those of correct age.
The non-BBFC advisory are just that, advisory.
Don't get the two confused.

 

[stoofa]

I don't know if this has been raised as I haven't read all of the thread, most of this is rubbish. Firstly age on Games has been shown to be guidance only and there is no law mandating the age. Secondly there is no law prohibiting you from buying alcohol and giving it to a minor, the law in fact states this is exactly what you can do, the legal minimum age for alcohol consumption is 5. The licence law also states that some alcohol is allowed to be drunk in restaurants by those aged 16+ if accompanied buy an adult, alcohol is wine beer,cider and perry.

I'm afraid you are also wrong about the buying of alcohol for people underage.
The law states:

Purchasing alcohol on behalf of a minor is illegal in Scotland, England, Northern Ireland and Wales. This means acting as the young person's agent.

http://webarchive.nationalarchives....Chapter12SaleandSupplyofAlcoholtoChildren.pdf

 

[Abraham]

Secondly there is no law prohibiting you from buying alcohol and giving it to a minor, the law in fact states this is exactly what you can do, the legal minimum age for alcohol consumption is 5. The licence law also states that some alcohol is allowed to be drunk in restaurants by those aged 16+ if accompanied buy an adult, alcohol is wine beer,cider and perry.

There is no minimum legal age, it is legal for alcohol to be drunk by anyone of any age within their home. It is however entirely illegal for alcohol to be bought for the purpose of supplying minors. It is rather like prohibition, in which the consumption of alcohol was never outlawed, but the sale/purchase of it was (I believe). The implicit meaning of this is that if you have alcohol in your home purchased for personal consumption or consumption by adults then it is legal for minors to have some.

Drinking alcohol with a meal is entirely different, it allows ONE drink to be consumed with a meal, in a designated restaurant area of licenced premises.

 

[Moley]

I think we need more people to exercise their right to take their business elsewhere, then perhaps shops will stop this nonsense of not selling alcohol to someone who is old enough to buy it and has proven they are old enough but has a younger person with them.

 

[Abraham]

What I did think was a bit off, was they would not accept my gf's staff nurse ID as proof she is older than 18 (no way can you be 18 to be a staff nurse), her old Uni ID (you have to be at least 18 to go to uni, also would not accept a 'Platinum' Credit card (again have to be over 18 to obtain this).

You do not have to be over 18 to go to uni. A Credit card isn't a valid proof of ID let alone age. I wouldn't know the difference between a staff nurse card and that of any other NHS employee

What really bugged me was rather than use common sence they couldnt accept it because it didnt have a 'pass' logo on any of them. I then started to explain my passport or driving licence does not show a 'pass' logo on so that point was invalid. Also she said she was sorry as she realised we were over 18/21 whatever however as she had asked she couldnt back down...what a load of bs!

She's not wrong, and her point wasn't invalid, the official guidelines are currently:
-driving licence
-passport
-something carrying the PASS logo

 

[GinG]

You do not have to be over 18 to go to uni. A Credit card isn't a valid proof of ID let alone age. I wouldn't know the difference between a staff nurse card and that of any other NHS employee

She's not wrong, and her point wasn't invalid, the official guidelines are currently:
-driving licence
-passport
-something carrying the PASS logo

Fair enough, on the Credit Card & Uni, however on her NHS it says staff nurse and her name with the BSc Hons on...which shows she has completed uni and a full qualified staff nurse...so using common sense would make her at least over 21...

 

[Abraham]

I think we need more people to exercise their right to take their business elsewhere, then perhaps shops will stop this nonsense of not selling alcohol to someone who is old enough to buy it and has proven they are old enough but has a younger person with them.

The problem is that shop's expect their staff to be idiots, so they have to set a rule, it's hard to make a rule that's idiotproof without inconviniencing some.

 

[TheCrow]

I take my 2 year old to the checkout with beer, and I never get asked.

My sister got refused with her 6yo daughter.

 

[Dano]

Fair enough, on the Credit Card & Uni, however on her NHS it says staff nurse and her name with the BSc Hons on...which shows she has completed uni and a full qualified staff nurse...so using common sense would make her at least over 21...

Only if the checkout operator knows what a BSc Hons is and how long it generally takes to achieve, stop assuming that they know the ins and outs of the UK education system and you'll realise it's not a very good argument at all and doesn't come close to being common sense.

 

[sbi5ar]

Simple... Just carry ID... I used to get frustrated and annoyed about things like this, however that was when I was underage and didn't get served...

If your old enough... carry ID... no problems!

 

[Vonhelmet]

There is no minimum legal age, it is legal for alcohol to be drunk by anyone of any age within their home.

I've heard the age of 5 mentioned before now...

EDIT: Yep, it's 5...

5 Giving intoxicating liquor to children under five.
If any person gives, or causes to be given, to any child under the age of five years any alcohol (within the meaning given by section 191 of the Licensing Act 2003, but disregarding subsection (1)(f) to (i) of that section), except upon the order of a duly qualified medical practitioner, or in case of sickness, apprehended sickness, or other urgent cause, he shall, on summary conviction, be liable to a fine not exceeding level 1 on the standard scale.

For the record, section 191 Licensing Act 2003 lists all kinds of alcohol, and subsections f to i, disregarded in the text above, are for: denatured alcohol, methyl alcohol, naphtha, or alcohol contained in liqueur confectionery.

So you can give your kids all the liqueur chocolates you want.

In any case, it would probably be trivial to show child neglect or abuse if you were consistently giving your kids alcohol, even if you were at home. Word has it that social services take a pretty dim view of kids under 14 being given alcohol.

 

[King85]

There's a key to the right of the letter "m" that you might find useful.

Also, "tool"? Grow up. The "tool" probably thinks it's really cool to... keep his job by adhering to store policy.

Thanks for your ever so needed input there, why would a store employ a policy (I'm assuming you've guessed at this) which doesn't coincide with legal policy?

Nothing to see here folks just another keyboard warrior with a bone to pick.

 

[Dano]

Thanks for your ever so needed input there, why would a store employ a policy (I'm assuming you've guessed at this) which doesn't coincide with legal policy?

Lots of store employ policy that have little or are in direct opposition to law.

Nothing to see here folks just another keyboard warrior with a bone to pick.

Ironic.

 

[Vonhelmet]

Thanks for your ever so needed input there, why would a store employ a policy (I'm assuming you've guessed at this) which doesn't coincide with legal policy?

Because it's cheaper and - in the long term - easier to maintain a higher level of scrutiny in order to avoid falling foul of the law.

As has been said before, stores food hygiene laws are often stricter than is legally required, because it's cheaper to maintain those stricter laws than to fall foul of them and be fined, or whatever. They're just doing the same thing with regard to alcohol restrictions, because they can be brutally clobbered for failing to adhere to the law.

 

[K.C. Leblanc]

If you cannot buy alcohol with friend if one of you don't have an ID then surely parents should not be allowed to buy alcohol when shopping with kids too.

I am confused.

In my local store the woman in front of me was refused a computer magazine because they thought it was for her teenage son.

EDIT; I think the biggest problem is the supermarkets don't encourage their staff to use their own judgement. The trouble is they need a policy that can be understood and implemented by their stupidest employee.

Just think about the stupidest supermarket employee you've ever met.

 

[stoofa]

But as has been said above.
Once you start making your own "judgement" mistakes happen.
When the person actually serving can get their own personal fine, along with the store getting one and the risk of license being taken away etc.
It is 100% safer to employ a strict rule.

That's what "Prove you're 21" is all about.
18 maybe the legal age limit to buy alcohol, but many places make you prove you're 21.
It's just safer that way.

They would rather lose a few customers who lets be honest, buying a case of Stella isn't going to be a great loss.
Than get a few k of fines.

 

[King85]

Because it's cheaper and - in the long term - easier to maintain a higher level of scrutiny in order to avoid falling foul of the law.

As has been said before, stores food hygiene laws are often stricter than is legally required, because it's cheaper to maintain those stricter laws than to fall foul of them and be fined, or whatever. They're just doing the same thing with regard to alcohol restrictions, because they can be brutally clobbered for failing to adhere to the law.

He showed i.d proving his age though, if he were to then give it to a minor then the store would suffer no ramifications and the individual who purchased the alcohol would be the one receiving the fine.