[F1] Gerhard Berger - Out of his mind...

[Noto]

Another ex-Formula 1 driver, Gerhard Berger, who drove for both Ferrari and McLaren, has accused Mark Webber of trying to take out his title rivals during the race in Korea.

In an interview with Austrian TV, Berger said: "He took out Rosberg, but it was the wrong one. I think in his mind he would have preferred Alonso or Hamilton." Asked to clarify whether he thinks Webber's move was deliberate, Berger added: "Yes, I think that's very clear."
(Full story: Servus TV)

Errrr what? So lets assume Mark Webber thought rosberg was Alonso / Hamilton. how on earth can you pull off a crash like that deliberately, to take the car out.

Even if it was his intention... it would hand Seb the lead and then the entire backing of red bull favouring 1 driver since its their darling.

Maybe its a case of an publicity is good publicity for Berger...

Source: http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/motorsport/formula_one/9126809.stm

 

[JonnyGLC]

He didn't pull the crash off deliberately, what he did do deliberately was not touch the brakes at all after he'd made contact with the wall. He let the car continue to roll backwards, quite obviously with the hope of taking one of his main rivals out as well.

I'd do the same in his position!

 

[ins0mn1ac]

He's saying that by not taking action after the crash was deliberate, not tapping the brakes which to me would seem to be a natural reaction in that situation. Again like I said in the other thread, if my dreams were just possibly crushed in front of me due to a crash I'd also "accidently roll back" into someones driving line, hoping it'd be my rival. Mark missed.

 

[Participant]

Would his brakes not have been affected by the impact with the wall?

 

[alx]

I find it hard to believe he would deliberately do that, not because he couldn't get a possible advantage, but more because rolling into the path of another car could cause serious injury or even death. I'm not saying it's the most likely situation but it's a massive risk to take. Also I'd be surprised if the first thing that came into his mind after crashing was "Hmmm why don't I try and take another car out".

I personally think Berger's talking out of his ****

 

[GravyMonster]

I think Berger's right. He hit the wall and in the split second he decided he'd try and get the car back over to the the grass and off the track.

However, I'd say personally he knew what he was doing and was trying to take Hamilton/Alonso out - with the get-out clause being he was trying to get the car out of the way should he be hauled before the stewards.

IMO the problem with the safety of F1 cars these days is that intentional crashes or dangerous moves are going to be more and more common. Just look at Renault/***** and MSC/Barrichello at Hungary.

Would his brakes not have been affected by the impact with the wall?

Unlikely given that it was a pretty light hit, and the brake lines would have been well away from the damaged areas.

 

[stockhausen]

Errrr what? So lets assume Mark Webber thought rosberg was Alonso / Hamilton. how on earth can you pull off a crash like that deliberately, to take the car out. ...

Find a seven times World Champion and ask him . . . or Damon Hill . . . or Jacques Villeneuve . . . or Rubens Barrichello

 

[ShakenNstirred]

his left rear tyre was flat and the car was sitting on its floor, you could see some of the wheels off the ground so how was he meant to brake
berger doesnt know what he`s on about

 

[Dunks]

his left rear tyre was flat and the car was sitting on its floor, you could see some of the wheels off the ground so how was he meant to brake
berger doesnt know what he`s on about

Probably has more of a clue than you.

 

[gord]

his left rear tyre was flat and the car was sitting on its floor, you could see some of the wheels off the ground so how was he meant to brake
berger doesnt know what he`s on about

The reason you use doesn't really consider what happened. He rolled across the track, ergo, the car is in a perfectly acceptable state to have the brakes applied.

Considering what happened in Singapore I'd say Berger wasn't too far off the mark... ... but I wouldn't dare to accuse.

Facts are:
The initial impact isn't that bad. So, was he just trying to get the car pointing the right way again to at least limp back to the pits?
Maybe he was trying to get the car over to the inside safety area?
As soon as Webber crashes he flicks the steering over. The front left is working, the front right is off the ground. He looks right immediately. Looking for a rival? Or looking to see if someone is going to hit him? If he was looking to avoid, he makes no attempt to change direction when he realises Rosberg has decided to go inside. Why? He should known its Rosberg, not Hamilton, and there's no advantage to be gained there. Or, this is a split second and he simply doesn't have time to react to Rosberg's choice?

There's way too many variables and decisions made quickly to judge. Rather silly accusation from Berger.

 

[ShakenNstirred]

Probably has more of a clue than you.

lol maybe
that doesnt make him right though

 

[arknor]

his left rear tyre was flat and the car was sitting on its floor, you could see some of the wheels off the ground so how was he meant to brake
berger doesnt know what he`s on about

martin brundle said the same thing during the race ! (that webber should have braked)

 

[Goksly]

I think it would have happened far too quickly for him to have worked out a plan. More than likely his instinct was to get off the track... for all he knew anyone following was far enough back to see he was rolling backward and go past the front of the car. Rosberg chose to go for a gap that was always going to disappear. Actually, if he had breaked leaving the car smack in the middle of the track, would there have been enough room for cars to go around him (car lengthways across track?).

As said, I think Webber would rather Alonso or Hammy win than Seb, so taking out either of them would have only strengthed Red Bulls backing of Seb.

 

[Podmonkey]

Or he was happy to let his car wheel back off the track onto the dirt and not be sat in the middle of the road and have to get out leaving the wreckage there whilst the entire grid was going to be coming around the corner.... Gotta love the conspiracy theories that come out under the most straight foreward situations.

We dont know the damage to the brakes etc.
He was looking forward - i.e. not looking for a target....
He wouldnt have had time to get over the crash and think 'oh darn, hmmm lets see if i can turn this incident to my advantage and aim for someone...' Chances are he was trying to correct it whilst thinking '**** **** ****'.
Front wheels were turned when going backwards but didnt affect the cars direction much suggesting the damage and the wet track were more in control than he was at that point.
He didnt hit Rosberg until they were both on the dirt, could have gone either way.
If he had wanted to take his rival out then he would have braked and parked it in the track rather than wheeling it onto the dirt.

 

[mmj_uk]

Given the dreadful visibility from spray I expect his instinct would have been to get off of the track rather than be sat bang in the middle of it with the whole field approaching, it's easy for a spectator to say he should have braked but your opinion might change under the same circumstances.

Rosberg didn't slow for fear of losing position to Hamilton and it cost him a podium or possible win.

Even if it was done entirely in the hope of hitting a rival Schumacher made a career out of it and nobody seemed to complain.

 

[ShakenNstirred]

martin brundle said the same thing during the race ! (that Webber should have braked)

i know he did and yes he should have
i was just saying when tyres are flat and others off the ground what real braking did he have left and it was wet
we have seen how hard it is to stop a car when one wheel is flat and the others are not in full contact with a dry track so going backwards on a wet track isn't going to be easy to stop.
i give him the benefit of the doubt instead off saying he tried to take the others out

 

[drunkenmaster]

The reason you use doesn't really consider what happened. He rolled across the track, ergo, the car is in a perfectly acceptable state to have the brakes applied.

Brakes don't change the direction of the car, why are people talking about breaking?

THe car changed direction of its own accord, his hands are off the wheel, one tire is in the air, the car was going in that direction, would it have been more controlled had he kept hold of the wheel tightly, maybe, would he have broken both wrists doing so, maybe.

Breaking in and of itself wouldn't have prevented him going across the track.

In this instance it simply wasn't on purpose, theres wasn't time to think or react, his hand wasn't on the wheel, could he really have predicted by not having his hands on the wheel the car was going to swerve back onto the track, thats a very good guess, if he wanted to do it intentionally, why didn't he turn the wheel and actually try his hardest if he meant to do it?


As for the previous race, IMHO, he without question hit Hamilton in a dangerous manner that should have earned him a black flag. That one felt more like red mist, "he got me, i'll show him" . For me that incident was clear as day, should have gotten a black flag and, I'm not sure, if you were black flagged do you also get a penalty in the next race, grid drop or something? He went into that corner just like Sutil did, with absolutely zero chance of not hitting the other car, how he got away with it and Sutil didn't I don't know. At least Sutil had a break problem, crap tires and was in the wet.

 

[utajoker]

i agree with berger.

 

[Noto]

hmm having read some opinions here, i can see some of your points, im in two minds now


/edit

just re-watched the video, i think Berger and some of you are right. Alonso corrects his 'line' for the next turn after seeing webber come back across so had alonso been going faster / Webber crashed faster / the corner was super high speed. he would have collected him. And with later Vetel's failure that would have been ideal for him. O well.

 

[gord]

Brakes don't change the direction of the car, why are people talking about breaking?

I am seriously worried about your concept of braking.

Just the other day, I was driving along in the forward direction, and used the brakes to stop moving that way!