Wikileaks - latest leak

fez said:
They could confuse people by explaining that its not hacking in the stricktest sense of the word. They could then go into technical terms about how all of the computers used in the DDoS attack were taken over but again whats the point. I bet that you read plenty of articles that misuse technical terminology but you just don't realise as you don't understand enough to, also it is beside the point.
Click to expand...

It *is* hacking. They've hacked the webserver / TCP stack to bend to their will using technical knowledge (admittedly, not difficult in this case).

They haven't 'cracked' it, or broken any security (at least, that we're aware of).

Hacking is the manipulation of hardware and software to your own ends, be it legal or not.
 
Koalaboy said:
It *is* hacking. They've hacked the webserver / TCP stack to bend to their will using technical knowledge (admittedly, not difficult in this case).

They haven't 'cracked' it, or broken any security (at least, that we're aware of).

Hacking is the manipulation of hardware and software to your own ends, be it legal or not.
Click to expand...

Hacking, in the computer sense, is programming.

This is organised computer misuse, yes, but it's not hacking.
 
Tefal said:
Presumably whatever software they're using to do it was programmed at some point.
Click to expand...

OK, so someone hacked the software that was used to crack the computers that make up the botnet which has then been used to DDOS the Mastercard site...

If you want to be technical about it, yeah?

They've certainly not "hacked the webserver / TCP stack" as Koalaboy said.
 
vonhelmet said:
Hacking, in the computer sense, is programming.

This is organised computer misuse, yes, but it's not hacking.
Click to expand...

So Kevin Mitnick diving through dumpsters to retrieve systems operating manuals, or phoning internal numbers posing as an engineer to get password information wasn't hacking ?

Gosh.

Social Engineering is hacking. If you're using it to gain information regarding a computer system it's hacking.

As Tefal also pointed out, I'm pretty sure that using the Low Orbit Ion Cannon is construed as hacking, even though the individual users may not be reponsible for the tool itself.

You'll be disputing Angelina Jolie's role as Acid Burn next :D
 
vonhelmet said:
OK, so someone hacked the software that was used to crack the computers that make up the botnet which has then been used to DDOS the Mastercard site...
Click to expand...

No - someone wrote software that 'hacks' the webserver. It adjusts the expected behaviour of the packets to forcibly change the behaviour of the webserver.

vonhelmet said:
They've certainly not "hacked the webserver / TCP stack" as Koalaboy said.
Click to expand...

So the webserver is working as expected, and not as they wanted ? Oh, wait...

They haven't changed the code.... They haven't gained unauthorised entry, but that doesn't mean it's not a hack.

Slow-Post is a much better example of a hack, but doesn't give the same visible impact as DDOS to most people.
 
Last edited:
Koalaboy said:
So Kevin Mitnick diving through dumpsters to retrieve systems operating manuals, or phoning internal numbers posing as an engineer to get password information wasn't hacking ?

Gosh.

Social Engineering is hacking. If you're using it to gain information regarding a computer system it's hacking.

As Tefal also pointed out, I'm pretty sure that using the Low Orbit Ion Cannon is construed as hacking, even though the individual users may not be reponsible for the tool itself.

You'll be disputing Angelina Jolie's role as Acid Burn next :D
Click to expand...

None of those things are hacking. Some are cracking, some are social engineering, but none are hacking. Hacking is programming.
 
Koalaboy said:
So the webserver is working as expected, and not as they wanted ? Oh, wait...

They haven't changed the code.... They haven't gained unauthorised entry, but that doesn't mean it's not a hack.
Click to expand...

Yes it does. It's not hacking, by definition. It's also not cracking, as they've not gained any entry, they've just prevented use through excessive demands.
 
vonhelmet said:
Yes it does. It's not hacking, by definition. It's also not cracking, as they've not gained any entry, they've just prevented use through excessive demands.
Click to expand...

It is hacking. They've changed behaviour via a quick non-intentional method using techical knowledge of the system.

Anyway, keep trying to blinker the definition... it really doesn't matter.
 
Koalaboy said:
It is hacking. They've changed behaviour via a quick non-intentional method using techical knowledge of the system.

Anyway, keep trying to blinker the definition... it really doesn't matter.
Click to expand...

"Hacking" has been re-defined by the media to mean what "cracking" originally meant. The new meaning is the incorrect one.

It is a semantic argument, though, so you're right about one thing.
 
vonhelmet said:
Hacking is programming.
Click to expand...

Umm... no. Software hacking is (generally) programming. Hacking is a much wider definition...

It is often mistaken for cracking. However it isn't (and never was) limited to programming (the definition has been used in hardware before software 'hacking' became prevalent).
 
Koalaboy said:
Umm... no. Software hacking is (generally) programming. Hacking is a much wider definition...

It is often mistaken for cracking. However it isn't (and never was) limited to programming (the definition has been used in hardware before software 'hacking' became prevalent).
Click to expand...

Hacking is legitimate use of a system. Cracking is not.
 
vonhelmet said:
Hacking is legitimate use of a system. Cracking is not.
Click to expand...

The legitimacy of the use of a system is irrelevant to Hacking, and also to this conversation.

Overloading a network with packets such that it stops functioning, is a quick 'hack' to change it's behaviour. It is hacking. SYN floods are another example - they're certainly not a good example of elegant hacking, but they subvert the system using an unplanned kludge.

I realise that trying to re-inforce the 'hacking=good, cracking=bad' thing but that misses the point.

Hacking is applying knowledge and intelligence to a system to change it, temporarily (or often permanently) without implementing a full re-design.

Cracking is breaking into something which you're not intended to.

Legality, whilst often involved, isn't implied by either.
 
dutycallsu.png


you knew it was coming
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top Bottom