The Fiesta ST does the 0-60 sprint in the same time (8 secs) and it is by no means a hot hatch still.
New car purchased....
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The Fiesta ST does the 0-60 sprint in the same time (8 secs) and it is by no means a hot hatch still.
No it doesn't, then again the VTS isn't particularly quick in the grand scheme of things. I would also totally argue the fact that the status does change as the years progress, in terms of what people expect in power and handling.
Soldato
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The goal posts for hot hatch status have been shifted by the power race over the last five years
If its not up to and over 200BHP and dripping in body kit then its not a hot hatch
If its not up to and over 200BHP and dripping in body kit then its not a hot hatch
Wait, a Fiesta ST is not a 'hot hatch'? 
I take it we're using 'hot' to describe speed?
I see.
I iz confoozed.
I take it we're using 'hot' to describe speed?I see.
I iz confoozed.
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Soldato
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You'll be telling me a Fiesta Zetec-S is a hot hatch next. If you can't be bothered to put a decent argument as to why the C2 is a hot hatch, then why bother piping up at all?
Nearly every one of these threads ends up in a verbal willy waving contest - mostly with Fox being rude to the OP and then the usual suspects jumping in trying to show how clever they are. Then wittering about performance figures that mean very little in the real world.
The lad obviously likes his cars otherwise he would just buy something boring and faceless. He didn't want to keep the S3 as it costing him a fortune and would only get worse. He's talking about having a family soon - a drain like the S3 on his finances are just what he needs right now.
That little car is what he wanted and what suits him in his current circumstances and future plans. Give the lad a break.
The lad obviously likes his cars otherwise he would just buy something boring and faceless. He didn't want to keep the S3 as it costing him a fortune and would only get worse. He's talking about having a family soon - a drain like the S3 on his finances are just what he needs right now.
That little car is what he wanted and what suits him in his current circumstances and future plans. Give the lad a break.
I get what you're saying, but he obviously posted for a reason and well, everyone is entitled to their opinion. How you go about putting your opinion across is another thing though.
Soldato
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Ohh, the ironing.
Oh, wikipedia has the C2 listed as a hot hatch. That'll be why then.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hot_hatch
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hot_hatch
The old Zetec-S isn't really a hot hatch, no. It wasn't much more than a Fiesta with a body kit.
The C2, like many hot hatches had more than just a more powerful engine. Things like faster steering racks, short gears, stiffer and lower suspension, bigger ARBs, stiffer bushes and the like is all part of the development that makes many hot hatches such a hoot to drive.
To me, the things that made a hot hatch so popular in the first place were the things that made it truly fun; light, handling, chuckable all giving them an unquestionable ability to tear up the twisties and making you grin ear to ear, whilst remaining as practical as a hot hatch. Sure, a hot hatch should be reasonably quick but a C2 VTS is plenty fast enough to be fun.
If anything, a lot of power puts a damper on the fun - you get to silly speeds too quickly and backing off is not fun - going balls out is. This is why, despite the ST being better in every way, my VXR was much more fun to tear up B-roads with, why I've had some of the most fun I've had in a car in a slow old MK3 Golf with Raceland suspension and GTI ARBs and why many die-hard 205 GTi fans will tell you that they'd rather have a 1.6 than a 1.9.
In fact, on the previous paragraph, I'd go as far to say that a Fiesta ST is closer to a hot hatch in the traditional sense than the Focus ST is.
Have you driven a C2 VTS, or in fact any hot hatch?
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Soldato
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Fair points Edd, however...
I would argue that he has.
So a 2 door supermini is the way forward for a family?EddScott said:
Sounds like we have a different definition of a hot hatch. Your view is a tarted up version of the base model, mine is something that can be classed as genuinely fast rather than something like a Fiat Panda 100HP. But I am glad you at least offered some sort of explaination behind your views.
Yes I have driven 'hot hatches', all the Corsa VXR, Astra VXR and a Fiesta ST...
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Morning peeps,
Well I've had my S3 for 2.5 years now and as much as I love it, it's getting on a bit and although she's in good condition for 132k miles, it's only a matter of time before something else mechanical goes wrong. With previous repair bills being in the region of £500 and the car's value dropping quicker than a tarts knickers, I've decided to chop it in for something else.
I loved my 106GTi and always planned to buy another at some point, so thought now was as good a time as any! Thing is after looking around I realised that I've probably left it a bit late as most examples are getting on a bit now so I decided to steer clear and look for something similar; which is when I found just what I was after!
Same engine as the 106 but on an 06 plate with 25k miles. Picked it up for £4750 from the local Citroen dealer, comes with a years tax and MOT, 1yr manufacturers warranty and will be serviced before I collect it on Thursday. They gave me £3k for the S3, which is a bit less than I wanted but I've had it up for sale for 3 months now at £4k and I've had very little interest, not even a single viewing! I've got a buyer for the Starlet already @ £1000, so in total it's only costing me £750 to change.
Some of you might think it's bit of a strange swap for an S3 but it's great fun to drive and I've always really liked the styling of the C2 for some reason!
Will get some proper pics up when I collect her on Thursday (if it's not snowing too heavily!)
Ok, just a couple of things.
It's ugly, whoever wanted to poke forks in Mike's eyes appears to have practiced on you first. Being a Citroen it'll be back in the dealership within a month getting mended, then probably at least another 4 or 5 times within the warranty period.
in the first 9 months of ownership mines been back (also an 06, not a C2 though) having the following fixed:
1) Rattling windows and squealing brakes
2) Gear cable replacement
3) Front manifold heatshield replaced
4) Exhaust replaced
5) Spare tyre replaced (dealer sold the car with a bald one)
6) Battery problems (constantly going into power save mode)
7) Engine cutting out randomly
8) Power steering pump failed (still sitting in the dealers workshop waiting for parts)
So, good luck with it, I'd rather own a CityRover than another Citroen.
A 1.8L Focus is significantly slower, thirstier and in a (slightly) higher tax bracket than the C2. Other than perhaps build quality and just possibly rear seat space why would it be a better choice?
I think that having not owned any fast cars, you are overwhelmed by power rather than the other merits of the cars you drove.
I believe this is where our opinions split; I've had many fast cars and the problem with a fast car is that being fast is a novelty that wears of pretty quickly, where as being genuinely fun to drive does not.
Just look at Integra forums for an example of this. You see many people sell up and get something fast like an Evo, but so many end up back on the forum looking to part-ex/swap back to an Integra - a car that has the fun factor and raw handling ability as its main merit.
You really wouldn't.