Would you buy an electric car ?

Participant · 28 Feb 2011 at 10:24

Mr Jack said:
The problem I'd have with an electric car is the lack of off-road parking. Don't really want to have to trail a lead across the pavement and hope one of the local oiks hasn't unplugged it when I need it.

If I had offroad parking, yeah, I'd go electric.

Lack of off road parking is solved by swapping the battery that has been charging in your house / place of work all day.

I'd love an electric car as the refinement on long journies would be unbeatable.

Dr Jack · 28 Feb 2011 at 10:27

Robbie G said:
Lack of off road parking is solved by swapping the battery that has been charging in your house / place of work all day.

Batteries are heavy, awkward things though. I don't really fancy lugging 'em in and out of my house everytime I want to drive somewhere.

Firestar_3x · 28 Feb 2011 at 10:29

Not at the moment, it's a range and price issue.

Glaucus · 28 Feb 2011 at 10:29

Mr Jack said:
Batteries are heavy, awkward things though. I don't really fancy lugging 'em in and out of my house everytime I want to drive somewhere.

When it takes of the chances are you will be able to do automated battery swaps in garages, or provisions for on street charging.

Participant · 28 Feb 2011 at 10:34

Mr Jack said:
Batteries are heavy, awkward things though. I don't really fancy lugging 'em in and out of my house everytime I want to drive somewhere.

Probably they'll be as light as the average briefcase full of paper by the time the tech is mainstream.

Either way, there'll be an acceptable solution for plebs, sorry people that only have on street parking. There has to be, or it won't work.

Dr Jack · 28 Feb 2011 at 10:45

Robbie G said:
Probably they'll be as light as the average briefcase full of paper by the time the tech is mainstream.

Either way, there'll be an acceptable solution for plebs, sorry people that only have on street parking. There has to be, or it won't work.

Oh yes, I'm sure there will be solutions - I was talking about the current situation.

Angilion · 28 Feb 2011 at 10:52

Mr Jack said:
Batteries are heavy, awkward things though. I don't really fancy lugging 'em in and out of my house everytime I want to drive somewhere.

Chances are that swapping and charging will take place in stations rather than at home, so from the driver's point of view it will be much the same as refueling now.

The charge to weight ratio and charge to volume ratios will have to increase a lot, though. Five times what they are now and it will start to become feasible. Ten times and it will be practical (a 50Kg battery the size of a briefcase).

It's going to have to be swapping because really fast charging requires far too much power, although home charging will be fine for most people with a garage in most cases. Plug it in when you get home in the evening, leave it to charge and cut itself off when it's done, unplug it in the morning. If the range is reasonable, it'll be enough for most people on most days.

It's feasible with much better batteries and much better power generation (using electric cars on a large scale will of course require a lot more electricity than is used today). Both of those things look possible in the near future.

Angilion · 28 Feb 2011 at 10:53

Mr Jack said:
Oh yes, I'm sure there will be solutions - I was talking about the current situation.

Given that a current battery that holds enough charge for a decent range weighs about 500Kg, I'd be very impressed if you could lug it in and out of your house

Participant · 28 Feb 2011 at 11:02

Maybe someone will soon master controlled nuclear fusion and we'll all have mini reactors in our cars

.

Angilion · 28 Feb 2011 at 11:04

AcidHell2 said:
The nissan leaf can be charged in 30mins anyway to 80% and in Japanese will be stations within 40miles.

30 minutes of charging (with a high-power charging station) for, under normal conditions, about 60 miles of driving. That's not dreadful, but it's not good.

EDIT: That's assuming there's a charging point available. You need about 40KW to charge the battery in a Leaf to 80% in 30 minutes. If most of the cars on the roads needed 30 minutes of recharging every 60 miles, there would need to be a lot of charging points. Powering them all at 40KW apiece won't be trivial either.

Jonnycoupe · 28 Feb 2011 at 11:06

tbz_ck said:
Hybrids are a waste of time.

The plugin hybrid is the most feasible thing that will cover 95% of journeys without burning fuel yet also allow 5 minute range refills..... along with +500 mile ranges.

Dr Jack · 28 Feb 2011 at 11:08

Angilion said:
Given that a current battery that holds enough charge for a decent range weighs about 500Kg, I'd be very impressed if you could lug it in and out of your house

Usually though, the battery is designed to be separable into pieces so you can lug it in parts.

lordrobs · 28 Feb 2011 at 11:10

Witor said:
Getting the (artificial) sound right is a consideration for me. Otherwise, and for many other reasons, no.

See for me the engine sound isn't an issue. As with most of us I love the sound that a nice V8,10,12 makes but for me it is all about the mechanical goings on coupled with a tuned exhaust to make that noise. Faking it through a speaker in my mind is simply... wrong.

Spunkey said:
As a commuter car, yes. But only when they have improved from the current crop (ie. range is > 300 miles and the performace is better than walking pace).

However would I only own electric cars? No.

You have a commute of more than 300 miles?

The plugin hybrid is the most feasible thing that will cover 95% of journeys without burning fuel yet also allow 5 minute range refills..... along with +500 mile ranges.

Exactly my thoughts on them. I could happily live with a plug in hybrid. My driving is mixed but this week for example I would only end up firing up the IC engine once even if I chose to drive to work every day.

Glaucus · 28 Feb 2011 at 11:24

Angilion said:
30 minutes of charging (with a high-power charging station) for, under normal conditions, about 60 miles of driving. That's not dreadful, but it's not good.

EDIT: That's assuming there's a charging point available. You need about 40KW to charge the battery in a Leaf to 80% in 30 minutes. If most of the cars on the roads needed 30 minutes of recharging every 60 miles, there would need to be a lot of charging points. Powering them all at 40KW apiece won't be trivial either.

Nissan in Japane are building one with in 40miles over the entire country and selling the equipment to others as well. Remember this is the first real car, it is the car that will start the trend and start building the infastructure. America is building 10thousand in 12 key cities. It's the first real contender so of course it will be expensive and have many cobstraints. Look at power, speed and distance of early petrol vehicals. Tankfully research and development times are much much shorter these days.

tbz_ck · 28 Feb 2011 at 11:34

Jonnycoupe said:
The plugin hybrid is the most feasible thing that will cover 95% of journeys without burning fuel yet also allow 5 minute range refills..... along with +500 mile ranges.

Most hybrids rarely run solely on battery even for low speeds and short trips and are therefore not really what I would class as an electric car. If researchers had spent the time and energy they have so far on hybrid cars on battery technology for example then we might be closer to feasible electric cars.

Hydrogen or pure electric. Anything else is a compromise that has no long term future imo

Glaucus · 28 Feb 2011 at 11:39

Hybrids are far heavier, far more complicated so cost more and more to maintain. As well as less effeciency. Battery swap stations + fastchargers(like shop/multistorie car parks) + slow home/work charging is the way forward.

Jonnycoupe · 28 Feb 2011 at 11:40

tbz_ck said:
Most hybrids rarely run solely on battery even for low speeds and short trips and are therefore not really what I would class as an electric car. If researchers had spent the time and energy they have so far on hybrid cars on battery technology for example then we might be closer to feasible electric cars.

Hydrogen or pure electric. Anything else is a compromise that has no long term future imo

Thats why i said plug-in hybrid. I dont understand why people berate things like the Honda hybrids as they dont 'drive only in electric mode' due to the simpler system. Fact is with current hybrids that DO NOT feature plug in charging there is no point giving a large battery for ENERGY, they are sized to give the required POWER. The energy can only come from the fuel in the tank with several energy conversion steps rather than the prefered national grid supply, the only merit is a smaller engine and capturing some brake energy rather than using it to heat the crake disks up.

A plugin like the many concepts..... C-Max, Range-e, Chevy Volt, Volvo V60, Jag CX-75. Allow 20-50miles in pure EV mode. The battery is sized for ENERGY and then by definition is able to give much higher power for sustained use in EV at motorway speeds.

Hybrids are the stepping stone, a VAST amount of technologies for production has been developed aswell as the rather complex issue of multi cell battery pack mangement and balancing, we're just in the upscaling phase of the EV side for plugins whilst the ICE units are in the downsizing phase.

To close:

A Hydrogen fuel cell car IS a hybrid.

Jonnycoupe · 28 Feb 2011 at 11:42

AcidHell2 said:
Hybrids are far heavier, far more complicated so cost more and more to maintain.

Than what?

Post lacking context is lacking.

Ultimately we have a range of cars that suit customers requirements. Hybrids are already there, particularly the cost and range, to appeal to more people than pure BEVs.

Glaucus · 28 Feb 2011 at 11:46

They are a stop gap, we'll not even that. More like a marketing ploy. Nothing more. Why electric and petrol/gas engine.

Get battery swap stations and you have unlimited range, nice simple reliable electric motors and no complications.

Skidder · 28 Feb 2011 at 11:49

Electric cars will be brilliant when sorted. Once I can get performance in line with my existing car (or better) and the prices are aright and they've been around for a few years so someone else can take the depreciation hit, I'll defo have one.