Forza 4

[Shimmyhill]

GT5 better physics model than F3? I have heard it all now.

The only thing flawed with F3 was the multiplayer. They can fix that in F4 and I will be one happy bunny. There also needs to be more penalty for using 4wd.

Until this thread i have never read a single person saying F3 as better physics, thats from all the reviews in the sim world, driver who race the compared cars and mag like car and driver who compared the games. Even T10 have said they want to surpass GT5 physics so even they must think they are better than F3

I have heard of loads of people who prefer playing F3 but thats not the same as having better physics...

 

[Mr Latte]

People will prefer what they have more fun playing, its as simple as that.

If they even put a 1/3 of the dev time into the Physics that Kinect is getting including whatever the collaboration with Pirelli brings then it should offer a distinct difference and upgrade over FM3.

Hopefully modelling various compounds and tyre wear in a more detailed or advanced way.

 

[squerble]

I'd love for a Mondeo ST220 to be in the car list!


I do hope for a physics model upgrade really, although I was overall quite happy with the gameplay etc in F3. In fact I still play it. Love thrashing a Focus ST/Civic Type R/Impr WRX STi around all over the shop.

 

[Mr Men]

People will prefer what they have more fun playing, its as simple as that.

If they even put a 1/3 of the dev time into the Physics that Kinect is getting including whatever the collaboration with Pirelli brings then it should offer a distinct difference and upgrade over FM3.

Hopefully modelling various compounds and tyre wear in a more detailed or advanced way.

Why are you under the impression that adding support for Kinect is time consuming and eats into development time?

 

[Mr Latte]

Why are you under the impression that adding support for Kinect is time consuming and eats into development time?

Why wouldnt it?
The shown videos prove that Kinect is a major componet to the games features. From controlling the car to the virtual showroom interaction.
Seemed to me this was a MAJOR KINECT "AAA" SHOWCASE TITLE.

Does it look to you that this isnt going to use a lot of development time and resources? Kinect will offer ZERO feedback regards car handling. I have no issues them being innovative opening to the family fun or motion gamers and the car exploration could be enjoyable.

Lets hope they put as much effort into further developing the game for racing fans and the hardcore fanbase they have accumulated.
$ales of Kinect may get more priorty and thats the concern some have.

 

[RuMp3l4$k1n]

Turn 10 apparently work on the basis of outsourcing a lot of car/track modeling etc.
So I can see it being likely that the core team will work on the parts they need to like the main physics/gfx engines and they will expand the team as needed with external suppliers to meet other areas such as kinect and modeling.
Its also possible that MS will bring in one of its Kinect focused teams to aid adding that support to the game.

I wouldn't worry about the team focusing on Kinect too much in terms of dev time. Though I expect you are right and this will be a showcase title.

 

[Mr Latte]

I dont have Kinect but would get it soley for this game. Head tracking which some will enjoy needs to be smooth and better implemented than GT5s which only worked in TT mode IIRC.

 

[Mr Men]

Why wouldnt it?

Why would it?

I have no idea how hard it is to implement Kinect, but you keep suggesting it will be eating up development time, so how do you know?

 

[Mr Latte]

Why would it?

I have no idea how hard it is to implement Kinect, but you keep suggesting it will be eating up development time, so how do you know?

Common Sense

Its new, has to be developed, incorporated, tested, refined and operate within the game at minimal GPU or system resources.

 

[Mr Men]

Common Sense

Its new, has to be developed, incorporated, tested, refined and operate within the game at minimal GPU or system resources.

But the video's are already showing it in game?

It's not really new anymore is it, teams had the development kits for it for a long time now. T10 already had it working in FM3 also..

What sort of GPU resources does it use? Would be interesting to know as Virtua Tennis uses Kinect at 1080p and 60FPS, same as the previous games without Kinect support....seems they managed it fine without killing the game and gimping it.....

 

[Mr Latte]

Okay your right, probably only took a couple of weeks.
The videos were mocks though and rehearsed.

 

[Mr Men]

Okay your right, probably only took a couple of weeks.
The videos were mocks though and rehearsed.

Maybe only took a couple of days or hours? I have no idea as already said, you are the one suggesting it eats into dev time Maybe Kinect is very easy to add to a game with the kits they have, it's just polling another controller really aint it?

 

[RuMp3l4$k1n]

Okay your right, probably only took a couple of weeks.
The videos were mocks though and rehearsed.

Stage demo may have been, however it's been in game since last years e3 at least.

 

[Mr Latte]

In my opinion it eats into dev time in various ways, one reason could be content related for the virtual garage feature. Not just about getting the functionality working. This will also be a very technical title and challenge as well, moreso than current Kinect titles.

Its fine showcasing a pre arranged tech demo. Thats different to how the final build of the game will be that has twice the amount of AI to handle over FM3 and a huge difference in polys going from 8 - 16 cars onscreen at once.

Good on T10 if they pull it off and dont hamper the games development in other ways or areas.

Can you guys talk about what else the game will have or do in advances over FM3 to confirm Kinect or its sales have no bearing or drawbacks for FM4s development and progress it in being the best console racing game?

Would most FM fans rather have the Kinect virtual garage and control over say, weather, night racing and more varied racing disiciplins?
Or like other developers FM4 is going to still have these following the current trend and also Kinect?

 

[Demon]

GT5 better physics model than F3? I have heard it all now.

The only thing flawed with F3 was the multiplayer. They can fix that in F4 and I will be one happy bunny. There also needs to be more penalty for using 4wd.

People blindly thinking GT5 physics are really complex and set some new standard? I've now also heard it all



Seriously, there is a lot of differences between both games approaches to Physics, you can't just say one game is better then the other in the Physics department because of this..

If your appraisal of Physics is the high level feeling of a car to a perceived reality of how that car behaves in general, then absolutely GT5, and no doubt NFS Shift 2 score really highly, I'd never argue against that..

But if you think that at the very low level of tyre behaviour/chassis behaviour etc, GT5 simply seems devoid of many things that FM3 seems to have (IMO).
FM3 models torque steer, it models the interaction with other cars, kerbs really well, it provides much more nuanced FFB because of this.. In those terms I'll stick by the 'I prefer it to GT5', but in terms of overall car 'feel', how loose it is, how it rotates when provoked etc, then I'd say GT5 easily beats it..

As a hotlapper, where you aren't ever sliding the car sideways shouting 'POOWWWAAAAHHHHH', and you are getting the few extra tenths through maximising corner speed and need to feel the tyres and what is going on, then I much prefer FM3..

This is half the problem, the 'range' of the term physics is huge, you have to be quite analytical when stating anything about the physics, especially to try and say as a blanket statement that GT5 is much better then FM3, when there are some clear and obvious differences.

To show how it's not always so straight cut

FFWD to 37 minutes,
Darin says "I like the physics a little better in GT5", Shaun is "On the fence" in general..

 

[Mr Men]

In my opinion it eats into dev time in various ways, one reason could be content related for the virtual garage feature. Not just about getting the functionality working. This will also be a very technical title and challenge as well, moreso than current Kinect titles.

Its fine showcasing a pre arranged tech demo. Thats different to how the final build of the game will be that has twice the amount of AI to handle over FM3 and a huge difference in polys going from 8 - 16 cars onscreen at once.

Good on T10 if they pull it off and dont hamper the games development in other ways or areas.

Can you guys talk about what else the game will have or do in advances over FM3 to confirm Kinect or its sales have no bearing or drawbacks for FM4s development and progress it in being the best console racing game?

Would most FM fans rather have the Kinect virtual garage and control over say, weather, night racing and more varied racing disiciplins?
Or like other developers FM4 is going to still have these following the current trend and also Kinect?

Seems you are just guessing a whole lot about things

FM3 is already better than the competition, so some tweaks, extra cars on tracks which proves Kinect is not gimping the game or putting stress on the system is fine by me. Not too fussed about rain weather as it's never done right and tends to look rather poor (see GT5), day to night transitions would be nice but again hardly really that exciting for most.

Go on PC sims and you will find the vast majority playing on dry tracks at 1pm, which shows most racers care little for weather, night etc and they tend to just be a novelty that soon wears off.

Better single player structure will probably be a given, but other than more cars, tracks, cars on track and refined physics (especially the tyres) will see the series easily ahead of rival console games What would be nice is for MS to open up the wheel support on their console but I guess that is out of T10's role.

I would doubt this game will make Kinect a must have purchase for anyone really, which is what you seem to keep focusing on for some reason....

 

[RuMp3l4$k1n]

One feature I would love to see come across is the open room/track day. Its a really cool way to hang out and tune up some cars or hotlap with your mates online.

 

[MagicBoy]

I'm with Demon and DreXel as regards the physics and feel. GT5 is technically impressive, but doesn't have the feel of FM3. That and the painting and in-depth tuning options keep me going back to Forza far more often.

 

[Mr Latte]

Seems you are just guessing a whole lot....

Seems actually that you are.
You are welcome to show me proof Kinect hasn't needed lots of dev time and directed resources from other areas the game could improve or develop further in. Don't make excuses about changing weather or time of day, EA, Codemasters and other PC titles like iracing or R-Factor 2 are all now going in that direction.

I'm not focusing on Kinect features being a must have reason to get Kinect. T10 and Microsoft are clearly focused on doing that. Or so it seems from as early as last year looking at the videos and that's maybe not what the majority of fans would necessarily want.

 

[Mr Men]

Seems actually that you are.
You are welcome to show me proof Kinect hasn't needed lots of dev time and directed resources from other areas the game could improve or develop further in. Don't make excuses about changing weather or time of day, EA, Codemasters and other PC titles like iracing or R-Factor 2 are all now going in that direction.

I'm not focusing on Kinect features being a must have reason to get Kinect. T10 and Microsoft are and that's maybe not what the majority of fans would want.

Sorry but I have said twice already I don't know about kinect development, it is you that is saying Kinect eats up time and focus, something you are just basing on pure guesswork. Kinect has been in the game for over a year now so I don't think you should be worrying about it, but it seems you are determined to suggest the game will suffer for having Kinect without any real foundation.

Rfactor already has night to day still as I said 99% of lobbies are ran in the day it's not an excuse just a fact. The games marketing has not even begun so how are you now claiming they are focusing on Kinect? another guess from you....

You really are still bitter about that decal in FM2 ain't you

It's a shame you vanished when GT5 was released, after your years of hype it would have been interesting to see you pick apart each and every flaw as you do with every Forza game.....shame we missed that