Vote for no confidence.

[Glaucus]

Well I signed I think the tuition fees increase will be a disaster for higher education in this country, government finances, and for students.

Why? Nothing has really changed.
Students get full loan so can still go to uni if they want.
So country will still have enough graduates.
Government get the money back eventually. Even low paid will pay it back due to inflation.

 

[NathanE]

Exactly he's just told us his stance but not really offered any insight as to why. Convince us of your point of view!

The web page does describe it. But unfortunately it can be succinctly summarised as:

We don't like change.

 

[scorza]

Why? Nothing has really changed.
Students get full loan so can still go to uni if they want.
So country will still have enough graduates.
Government get the money back eventually. Even low paid will pay it back due to inflation.

A three year degree will cost £27k in tuition fees as opposed to the £10k it costs now. So that's something that has changed wouldn't you say?

The government incredibly expected £9000 a year tuition fees to be the exception rather than the norm. As government has to fund the tuition fee loans, it can't actually afford to do so with so many universities charging £8.5-9k, and the government doesn't even start to get repaid until three years after they are introduced. The government have made a big song and dance about how this system is fairer because you don't start paying the loan back until you earn a higher income than in the current system. However as you have to pay back more, you'll be paying it back for longer and there are reasonable scenarios where the value of the loan is never paid back. Quite simply the sums don't add up, the plan is not realistic and it's a reasonable assumption that it will be changed to the detriment of students a few years after its introduction.

The number of UK students applying for degrees at foreign universities such as Maastricht (who are actually targeting UK under grads - they even run courses in English) is sky-rocketing and will only get higher as tuition fees go up. I imagine a significant percentage of British graduates at Maastricht will end up staying in The Netherlands after they have graduated. For info, the tuition fee at Maastricht is approximately £1.5k a year.

All in all, it's a shambles.

 

[arknor]

You can tell who didn't go to uni

MW

you can tell who cant afford to go but believe they are entitled to it..

did you get this atitude from your parents who are entitled to claim benefits and watch jeremy kyle all day?


if you want something earn it dont whinge that the goverment should provide everything

 

[RDM]

Well I signed I think the tuition fees increase will be a disaster for higher education in this country, government finances, and for students.

Wasn't the same said about the introduction of tuition fees in the first place?

 

[Glaucus]

Are you really trying to say that a high proportion are going to go abroad. It might be skyrocketing, but it's still a small percentage.
The fact is to many people are going to rubbish UNIs or rubbish courses (me included). When they should have gone straight into a job or an apprenticeships. Years ago apprenticeships where highly regarded. Now uni is the defacto way after a levels.

 

[drunkenmaster]

exactly, those who do useful degrees and work hard will be fine, those who want to doss about for 3 years won't , perfect

Yes they will, the whole point of the new loans is, if you do nothing for 3 years, walk out of uni and never get a good job ever, you'll never pay it back. THe richest people in the best jobs pay the most back.

The system is built to subsidise the poorest who end up in the worst jobs after uni, while making those who get the best jobs pay a crapload of money back.


Conservatives, a lot of good policies, seriously rubbish PR, who the hell do they pay to write their speeches and policy language.

It doesn't help that anything the conservatives do Labour just go around quite literally lying about the policies to make everyone simply believe they are pro rich and anti poor.

Conservative's + Labours spin doctors = a country that might actually work, if the country was full of slightly less moronic idiots who believe everything Labour say and automatically assume rich people benefit from everything the conservatives do would go a long way aswell.

 

[Freakbro]

exactly, those who do useful degrees and work hard will be fine, those who want to doss about for 3 years won't , perfect

Yes they will, the whole point of the new loans is, if you do nothing for 3 years, walk out of uni and never get a good job ever, you'll never pay it back. The richest people in the best jobs pay the most back.

So even people advocating the new system don't fully understand it

 

[Glaucus]

So even people advocating the new system don't fully understand it

what Rotty said is correct. People who don't get the grades or want to do a joke degree are much less likely to go to uni, due to debt.

 

[Tunney]

I'm really glad I went to university when I did. I can't imagine coming out of university with £27,000+ of debt and then think about saving for a house. The middle are going to get screwed by this change.

There's a strong link between education and GDP. Even graduates who don't end up in jobs that require a degree will still gain worthwhile skills.

 

[arknor]

but they can go on an apprenticeship instead and end up in a well paying job no one forces uni upon you

 

[Glaucus]

I'm really glad I went to university when I did. I can't imagine coming out of university with £27,000+ of debt and then think about saving for a house. The middle are going to get screwed by this change.

They pay back less and therefore are in a better position to save for a mortgage compared to the old student loans.
New loan 9% above £21k, old loan 9% above £15k

 

[Aod]

<edit>
Ooops, Doublepost - please delete if a passing mod sees this

 

[Aod]

I've just graduated from uni and my response is still

Get a job

Me too.

 

[Alpherah]

The government incredibly expected £9000 a year tuition fees to be the exception rather than the norm. As government has to fund the tuition fee loans, it can't actually afford to do so with so many universities charging £8.5-9k, and the government doesn't even start to get repaid until three years after they are introduced. The government have made a big song and dance about how this system is fairer because you don't start paying the loan back until you earn a higher income than in the current system. However as you have to pay back more, you'll be paying it back for longer and there are reasonable scenarios where the value of the loan is never paid back. Quite simply the sums don't add up, the plan is not realistic and it's a reasonable assumption that it will be changed to the detriment of students a few years after its introduction.

This (especially the bold part), im glad im finished next year.

 

[Richdog]

Going to uni when I did was the biggest mistake I ever made, but if you work hard and do a degree in a respectable field you want to work in then you will generally rise faster and earn more than people who do not have a degree.

 

[Dugganator]

Get a job

 

[Destination]

Amazing that folks expected to now pay more are not confident in that policy.

Will their be similar gas oil and electric motions?
How about no confidence in bread also?

 

[Freakbro]

what Rotty said is correct. People who don't get the grades or want to do a joke degree are much less likely to go to uni, due to debt.

The whole point to the new system was the overall level of debt was irrelevant, that you only pay back what you can afford - thus making it more affordable to everyone than the current system

You cannot now turn that around now and say that large amounts of debt will put people off

And the point still stands, if you do a "joke" degree, err why do we offer things like this anyway , or do you just mean ones you dont think are important, and they leave Uni and either a) dont get a job or b) get a low-paid job - they wont pay anything back, thus getting their full "3 doss years of a joke degree" for free & paid for by the tax payer.

 

[Morbius]

The government incredibly expected £9000 a year tuition fees to be the exception rather than the norm.

The stupid thing is that we had exactly the same thing from the last government with top-up fees. They expected £3000 to be the exception rather than the rule, but every university charged £3000. It beggars belief that the current governemnt thought things would be different this time.