Battlefield 3 thread - Server details in opening post -

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Tefal said:
the whole point of suppression is that if they pop out of cover you shoot them in the face so they stay in cover till you stop shooting at them, not that their eyes stop working for some bizarre reason.
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Its also there so that they are pinned in that spot so that your team mates can flank them unless they decide to fall back. If you have a rain of bullets falling at you shouldn't be able to pop up and simply shot the person focusing on you with a lmg so the suppression effect seems a nice compromise.

If you see that you are suppressed you know you need to fall back because people will be on you shortly or wait till someone shoots the one suppressing you.

Looks like a good addition in my opinion.
 
The problem with suppression purely been a deterrent to you popping out to try and shoot people is it NEVER works. It doesn't matter if they kill you (especially if they have a Medic who can revive you regardless of your injuries) so theres no reason not to try and shoot you first. Lets be honest, look at the Mounted Guns on BC2. They were worthless. If you jumped on 1 you might get a few kills at best before someone took your head off. Only Shielded MGs were ever worth the trouble.
 
Not when you have about 20 tickets left and 2 mcoms to destroy, the 3 or 4 of you trying to push in an arm against a whole team, that fodder is useful for breaking through!
 
Tefal said:
the whole point of suppression is that if they pop out of cover you shoot them in the face so they stay in cover till you stop shooting at them, not that their eyes stop working for some bizarre reason.
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The point of suppression is that you do not WANT to come out of cover, because you will die.

Have you every shot a gun? Or had a gun shot at you? I've been to a firing range and shot a variety of guns including an AK47, and there is no way in hell that I would be able to come out of cover when being shot at by any of those :s let alone come out of cover and pop off accurate shots.

If you have no fear of death (this is a computer game) then what's to stop you just poking your head out, picking them off, then getting shot.

In the real world, if your cover is being shot to **** then there is no way in hell you will get up, bullets whizzing over your head, fear of death, all the things that are hard to re-create in a game world.

Therefore they have added screen blur, jilted aim, bullet pops.

Id like to see you, in the real world, while taking fire, while being suppressed, to just pop up and shoot them in the face. (I find it hard enough to come out of cover in airsoft when under heavy fire, I cant even imagine doing that in real life!)

Go and play Darkest Hour (Red Orchestra mod).

Its a WW2 western front game, when getting shot at really does put the fear of god into you, your aim jumps, bullets pop and fly past your head, suppression really does work cause one wrong move and you're down. (your aim doesn't jump when you're actually solidly behind cover, but if you stick your head out it does)

It doesn't make you go "blind" as you so "accurately" said, but it does do a very good job of keeping your head down!

Go and watch the fault line video for BF3, when they are on the roof getting shot by the sniper, see the slight blur? Imagine that, but with a much higher rate of fire.

Oh and Tefal, they are stopping quick scoping, but long range sniping will be more skill-full, not impossible.
 
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Dave although u make some good points, this is a game so not being able to aim is frustrating - picture what happens when building collapses nearby in BC2 - just hope they have implemented it in a way that isnt too intrusive as it will create a new kind of camper.
 
I know not being able to aim is frustrating, but not being able to aim while being suppressed is intuitive and true to life.

And I think re-creates a very real battlefield tactic.

The whole point of a squad automatic weapon is to suppress, that's why they were invented.

A new kind of camper? How so?

Go and play Darkest Hour if you want to see suppression working well, and Red Orchestra 2 when it comes out in August
 
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Davepen makes a good point.

In BC2 the MGs do nothing that an MG would normaly be used for. Going back to DoD again the MGs in that are useless untill you deploy the bipod and then you can easily lockdown an area as the RoF and damage are so high nobody can pass through your cone of fire...like a real MG.

Adding supression is just another way to make people use the weapons properly, rather than as a high damage, more accurate, larger magazine assault rifle, like they are in BC2.
 
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For an idea of how to do a suppression effect properly, check out this vid of Darkest Hour:


Obviously this is a mod, Battlefield will have a much higher quality of effects, but it gives you an idea of how it works to get you to dive for cover
 
Davepen said:
Oh and Tefal, they are stopping quick scoping, but long range sniping will be more skill-full, not impossible.
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You clearly didn't understand anything he said on the subject. Most muppets who play Recon get kills 'now and then' and contribute next to nothing to the team. By making sniping harder to do, those Recons become even more useless (saying they'll change class is delusional). Playing as an assault Recon, quick-scope is necessary to have any hope of killing your opponent before he kills you.

The only thing I'd disagree with is that it renders the Recon useless at close range as there are other weapons, but a long range Recon is almost always less use than one pushing in. At least on BC2.
 
Evilsod said:
You clearly didn't understand anything he said on the subject. Most muppets who play Recon get kills 'now and then' and contribute next to nothing to the team. By making sniping harder to do, those Recons become even more useless (saying they'll change class is delusional). Playing as an assault Recon, quick-scope is necessary to have any hope of killing your opponent before he kills you.
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The only thing that has been confirmed is that quick scoping has been removed, as in it takes time to bring the scope to your eye, which is how it should be, a sniper is a sniper, not some sort of bunny hopping quick scoping assault class.

Altho I do agree that as a recon you should move forward, especially on rush mode, that does not mean you need to be able to stand on the front line, it means that you pick a vantage point behind the front line to provide overwatch/cover fire for your team moving up, then move forward as objectives are taken.

Removing quick scoping makes the class more like how its supposed to be, and I don't see how making you hold your breath for extra long range shots (from what I read it seems like medium range shots will be able to be taken without holding your breath(with a bit of skill), but for the extra long range shots you will) will make it any harder to score kills? It just makes it a bit more of a thoughtful process (in the same way bullet drop complicated sniping nicely in BC2)

I spend quite a bit of time as recon in BC2, and I dont often find myself having to "quick scope" as I am neither sat up on a hill far back, nor at the front line. (aren't pistols what close range kills are for??)

Also, with all the customization with the classes that they have promised, and the fact that the default US sniper rifle is the semi-auto m110 designated marksman rifle, couldn't you just whack an acog scope on it and get stuck in?

Acogs obviously wont require any sort of breath holding nor will have any issues with "quick scoping"

You should be able to customise the class as you like, 3 different attachment slots for each weapon remember? (barrel, sight, under barrel or ammo type)


Remember the games tag line is "Play it your way"
 
'thoughtful'. That is where your theory that it wouldn't have much effect fails. Most of the people who play Recon struggle to handle moving out of cover while scoped in to shoot someone camping, so they tend to stand there as a sitting duck for any opposing Recon watching. Adding an extra 'thoughtful process' to that will make them even worse.

In BC2, scopes took up the same 'perk' slot as Lightweight which made getting used to guns without scope mods very beneficial. It depends how it turns out as to whether you can change to another scope, or not, if they even let you on sniper rifles that is.
 
Davepen said:
For an idea of how to do a suppression effect properly, check out this vid of Darkest Hour:


Obviously this is a mod, Battlefield will have a much higher quality of effects, but it gives you an idea of how it works to get you to dive for cover
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I really hope suppression does NOT work like that
 
The suppression works similar to that. You can see it in the sp footage when the sniper is shooting on the rooftop, a momentary blur. Obviously with an mg firing it would be a more constant blur.
 
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