Is this disabled parking space official?

.Lethal said:
In this thread it's rightfully so.

It is clear and as the vast majority have said - parking right in front of a disabled sign is wrong.

White lines on the road or not :rolleyes:
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You are wrong and I really can't see how you can argue the point.
There were no lines until the council painted them on Wednesday and putting a sign up does not mean you can't park in front of it if there is no explanation.

DavidMarq said:
You could try a letter of complaint to the council, I know of one case where this has worked in the past but don't expect too much as they have your money and will be reluctant to return it.
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I can't be bothered to be honest but thanks for your insight and you've put my faith back in Solicitors (I work with Solicitors all day).
I'm glad that nobody else will be caught out now that they've corrected the lines.
They still need to paint lines in for the rest of the road though and the double yellows are only just visible.
 
DavidMarq said:
What utter tripe.

The upright sign was unlawful.
The markings on the road were unlawful.
The PCN arguably does not comply with the regulations and is arguably unlawful.
The Traffic Order very likely has issues.
The CEO is obliged under the extant legislation to be trained to a sufficient level to recognise the signing defects and report them, rather than issue a PCN.

It is patently apparent that a contravention did not occur and had the OP not paid he could have appealed and won.
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In Will Gills defense he didn't know that the Council had repainted the lines on Wednesday therefore admitting it was wrong.
 
DavidMarq said:
And for the sign to be enforceable it must be a legally prescribed traffic sign. It is not and thus it has no force in law...

Your point?
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My point is that he felt the sign applied to the whole road. In that case nobody should have parked there, so it's rather odd that he did.
 
sigma said:
My point is that he felt the sign applied to the whole road. In that case nobody should have parked there, so it's rather odd that he did.
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How do you work that one out?
The sign says 'Disabled Badge Holders Only Free Parking' which means I have to pay but badge holders don't.
And I did pay and there were no lines on the road.
 
sigma said:
My point is that he felt the sign applied to the whole road. In that case nobody should have parked there, so it's rather odd that he did.
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Had the sign been as prescribed there would have been no room for confusion.

The statutory provisions that allow for civil enforcement apply to the council as well as to the motorist. If the council wish to enforce then they must also be prepared to abide.
 
dmpoole said:
How do you work that one out?
The sign says 'Disabled Badge Holders Only Free Parking' which means I have to pay but badge holders don't.
And I did pay and there were no lines on the road.
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I can't really reply to that without offending you so I won't.

DavidMarq said:
Had the sign been as prescribed there would have been no room for confusion.

The statutory provisions that allow for civil enforcement apply to the council as well as to the motorist. If the council wish to enforce then they must also be prepared to abide.
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That's fair enough, I'm not disputing the law.
 
DavidMarq said:
And for the sign to be enforceable it must be a legally prescribed traffic sign. It is not and thus it has no force in law...

Your point?
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Legally enforceable it may not have been but there is a difference between enforceable and 'what is clearly intended to be the case'.

I certainly wouldn't see a sign like that, assume it applied to a whole street and park bang in front of it, whether there were box lines there or not. It would be exceptionally odd and I can't think of any other time i'd have encountered such a restriction compared to seeing such signs next to disabled bays. On that basis alone I wouldn't go about parking directly in front of it.
 
sigma said:
I can't really reply to that without offending you so I won't.
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I give you permission to offend me but bare in mind before you say something there are no lines in the street (you can see this on the picture).
There is a sign giving absolutely no indication that you can't park in front of it.
Give it your best shot but also remember that Stoke Council have been up there and decided exactly the same thing and so have got the white paint out.
 
dmpoole said:
You are wrong and I really can't see how you can argue the point.
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Then don't pay the fine and fight it.

Otherwise, I don't get why you still think you're right. Because a guy you know works for the council isn't a reason, or the fact that lines had been painted since you're ticket.

I can see why you're annoyed with the whole ordeal but at the end of the day, you're still in the wrong. Put it down to experience.
 
.Lethal said:
Then don't pay the fine and fight it.

Otherwise, I don't get why you still think you're right. Because a guy you know works for the council isn't a reason, or the fact that lines had been painted since you're ticket.

I can see why you're annoyed with the whole ordeal but at the end of the day, you're still in the wrong. Put it down to experience.
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You haven't read a single word I've wrote.

1) I paid the fine as soon as I got home last Saturday, please keep up.

2) My mate who works at the Council went in and told 'whoever' who then sent 'whoever' up to the where the supposed parking spot is and they 100% agreed it was wrong and then sent out workmen to paint lines on Wednesday just gone. Its got nothing to do with what my mate thinks but what the Highways Council Man (or woman) thought. So if you're going to have a go why not have a go at the person whose job it actually is and tell them they are wrong to have put it right? I'd love to hear that conversation. (Apparently the sign is still wrong though)

3) According to DavidMarq I stand little chance of getting my money back because of a Council loophole of me not going through the correct channels of fighting it.

If you had stood there last saturday with the other 9 of us you would had seen exactly what we saw AND THE COUNCIL SAW IT ALSO AND AMENDED IT.
Now do you get it?
 
I don't understand the antagonism against the OP in this thread when the council have quite clearly failed in their statuary duty to sign the parking restriction in accordance with the law. Ergo there is no parking restriction in place.

The council have also failed in their statutory duty to sufficiently train their CEO to recognise the unlawful sign and the unlawfully marked bay. A competent CEO would not have issued a PCN, but would have recognised that there was no extant disabled parking space to enforce and reported such upstream.

Even now that the lines on the road have been painted there is still not an enforceable disabled bay in existence as there is not a lawful traffic sign in place to convey the restriction to the motorist.

The OP may have been slightly naive to have been misled by the unlawful obstruction on the highway that purports to be a traffic sign, but the root cause here is multiple statutory failures by a typically incompetent council with respect to civil enforcement.

If the intention of the council is to provide a disabled parking space then they need to pull their finger out and actually provide one...
 
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