**** Original Starcraft 2 Thread ****

mof said:
I'm a very new bronze league player.
I had a game recently where I'd rushed the other player right at the beginning and thought I'd won it but he lifted off and moved his base away. I stopped playing properly because I thought I'd won and I did such a bad job of scouting out where he'd gone that game lasted 1hr 10mins though I eventually won. I was so angry during the game and felt like surrendering but I kept playing.

Also I just had a game where at the beginning the other player said something I didn't understand and I just replied "gl" then he replied "don't need any, I'm farming".(http://www.gosugamers.net/starcraft2/news/15405-portrait-farmers-to-be-punished) I didn't know what this meant but I thought that maybe if he wasn't playing properly I could rush him with my marines and finish he game quickly. During the game he told me my tactics wrong and told me how you're supposed to play it. I eventually won the game. Afterwards I found out farming is where people from higher up leagues purposely let themselves drop down into the bronze league so they can win enough games to unlock portrait pictures. It felt good knowing I'd beaten someone who was from at least silver league who thought they'd have no trouble winning. (EDIT It's possible he meant he didn't care about winning because he was still trying to drop down the ladder.)
I really don't understand why people would want to farm but I don't really care if they do.
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It is a pain in the rear. Think about it, it affects your MMR. Yeah great you go up... but then you spend the next 3 games getting destroyed by even higher level players who aren't farming. So 1 step forwards, 3 steps back kind of thing.
 
welshdragon said:
I've almost finished reinstalling. I'm soo weak!
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No no! This is good! :D:D

mof said:
I really don't understand why people would want to farm but I don't really care if they do.
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There are some on the ladder that farm the portraits to then go on and sell the accounts, if you see a player with over 2000wins in a season when everyone around them is on around 100-200 then that is probably one of them.
 
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Speaking of nerfs what do people think of the new patch changes?
  • MULEs now harvest the same amount of minerals on both high yield minerals and normal minerals.
  • Snipe damage changed from 45 to 25 +25 Psionic
  • Phoenix now has a range upgrade at the Fleet Beacon
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The mules change is good, not sure about ghost.. but they do absolutely own zergs infestors/broods and ultras. No doubt in the actual patch there will be more buffs/nerfs other than the 3 mentioned. As a zerg, i love these changes :D
 
nex20 said:
The mules change is good, not sure about ghost.. but they do absolutely own zergs infestors/broods and ultras. No doubt in the actual patch there will be more buffs/nerfs other than the 3 mentioned. As a zerg, i love these changes :D
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But how will my queen army cope if they can't transfuse. :p
 
nex20 said:
The mules change is good, not sure about ghost.. but they do absolutely own zergs infestors/broods and ultras. No doubt in the actual patch there will be more buffs/nerfs other than the 3 mentioned. As a zerg, i love these changes :D
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The ghost change is absolutely stupid.
They can't be used to deal with low-tier units now, they should have just made it so that it's 50dmg(-25dmg to massive) so that broodlords and ultras aren't affected.
 
Phoenix change is a bit odd. It essentially means if I get Phoenixes I should pretty much be preventing zerg from going Mutalisk, but teching all the way towards Fleet Beacon just to upgrade a fairly early game unit is such a heavy investment that I doubt too many people will be doing it. And by late game I will usually have enough storms / blink stalkers to not worry about mutalisks anyway, as well as the fact late game zerg will probably be headed for Broodlords rather than any kind of heavy muta play.

It's just not an upgrade you'd be going for until you see a Spire, and even if you scout it while it's still building they'll have 10-20 mutalisks out before you have your fleet beacon ready to start researching, so they can still do a good deal of harrassment before pulling home and switching tech.

The idea of a Protoss unit being a hard counter to mutalisks is great, and it's even to a point where if I lose a single Phoenix to a muta ball I've probably handled it poorly, but with how much you have to invest into it and how easily the Zerg can just stop making mutas, it really doesn't seem worth it at all. Phoenixes I can still see being used a lot in the match up early on, but this upgrade is oriented towards the late game, and I just don't see any Protoss players using them as late-game units.

I suppose at my fairly low level of playing gold / platinum players a lot of them are probably so in love with Mutalisks that they won't ever stop making them, so it could work for me, but at a high level I don't see many pro Zergs being thwarted or many pro Protosses seeing it as a real buff.
 
PaddyMC89 said:
...by late game I will usually have enough storms / blink stalkers to not worry about mutalisks anyway...
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Yeeaaaaaaaaaaa that doesnt really work in my experience. Any reasonable zerg going mutas (with attack upgrades) will have you running your stalkers all over your base sniping pylons, assimilators, probes, units, anything they can get. Unless it's a really nice map with really close bases your stalkers will never have enough mobility to cover 3 bases against a decent muta harass, and they'll slow you down enough that by the time youwant to have your 'epic stalker ball' they'll have already annihilated you with their proper army.

So you're stuck on 2 full bases at best (losing money having to rebuild stuff all the time) while zerg's taking 5 bases worth of gas safely and switches to a hive tech fully upgraded brood lord infestor zergling/roach army or ultras if so inclined, with 2-3 full reinforcements worth of larva and resources saved up and more coming all the time..


Basically it's a pita :p


I imagine the phoenix change is supposed to make mid-late game phoenixes more viable, and as such make the early game opening more viable as a persistent tech choice through the game. Then as they properly mass up mutas the phoenixes become a strong counter. It's a pain that you basically have to open phoenixes every game to be safe from it though :(
 
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If the opponent has gone heavily into Muta there's no disadvantage of you keeping maybe 5-10 stalkers and a full energy templar in each base as his main army isn't going to be big enough to keep yours pinned in - supply-wise you can certainly sacrifice more than the zerg player to defend it, especially with cannons up. You're maybe over-estimating how easy a zerg finds it to constantly harrass, keep his mutas alive as well as macro back home. If you're at a low level like I am, your opponent isn't going to be on a Dimaga level and if he's obviously putting a lot of effort into his mutalisks, he's pretty much trying to win the game with them rather than keep expanding and taking a huge economical lead - for that you basically just don't move out and focus on nullifying every attack he makes with your main army. If you're at a high level you should know that it's pretty easy to keep tabs on where the muta ball is so you know where to have units and expand safely. I also have no problem with going crazy with cannons once I'm on 3 bases because they will do enough damage to his mutas to be economical.

I do sometimes struggle with mutalisks, but I don't like the idea of my mid-game tech being focused around phoenixes which will become absolutely useless if he just stops building the single unit I've made them for, especially since I'll have invested more money into them than he has the mutas, and while he can still tech towards an awesome Brood Lord / Infestor force, my only other option for having a fleet beacon at that point is the mothership. At least with templar and blink stalkers I have units that are just as useful against one build as another.

Most protoss players that can handle mutalisks don't need phoenixes, and I don't see them changing the way they play in this patch. If people want to play that way it's up to them, but for me it just seems an irrelevant buff.
 
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I argued with a friend whose in Bronze and plays Toss. He's having trouble with mass Mutas aswell and he refuses to do HT/Blink Stalkers. Anyone who thinks it doesn't work just doesn't have good enough micro.
 
Was having some good fun on this last night. I mass recalled about a dozen immortals into this guys base, damn they are strong, gg 10 seconds later YAY really enjoying random

Is the new patch live? I had osme phoenixes but coudln't find the range upgrade. Really enjoying phoenix harass too
 
did 2v2 yesterday (15 matches) and gone from 60th gold to 3rd gold in random 2v2.

Just wish you didn't get idiots zerg players who try to exp and then exp again without building a single unit apart from drones. Against 2 terran who were clearly rushing when scouted.

Nerfing the mules on gold bases is nothing major.
 
Kamwah said:
I argued with a friend whose in Bronze and plays Toss. He's having trouble with mass Mutas aswell and he refuses to do HT/Blink Stalkers. Anyone who thinks it doesn't work just doesn't have good enough micro.
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The reason hes struggling v mass muta is because hes not going ht/blink :D.


booyaka said:
Nerfing the mules on gold bases is nothing major.
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Lol, yes it is. A terran who calls down like 6/7 mules down onto a gold have pretty much more income than a zerg / protoss with 3 bases saturated.
 
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