not disagreeing as I imagine this probably is the case, but the Beeb article reported they responded in 6 minutes. On the back of the 2nd call.
M5 Coach crash arrest
- Thread starter Amp34
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not disagreeing as I imagine this probably is the case, but the Beeb article reported they responded in 6 minutes. On the back of the 2nd call.
![[TW]Fox](/data/man-of-honor/2009.png){kind=avatar}
This is a major point - everyone ignores these. Why? Because 90% of the time they are never removed until long after the event has cleared - most drivers gave up listening years ago after slowing down only to find there was nothing wrong every single time
If only they were removed as soon as it was cleared, people would take them seriously.
A couple things wrong with your suggestions.
1. Most modern buses are automatics so there may not have been a clutch to enable free wheeling and autos don't let you use the starter motor method of "jumping" forward
2. It has already been mentioned that the section of motorway may not have a hard shoulder to be used. Where should the bus go?
Soldato
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I saw he had been arrested, I guessed it was because he had the passengers sitting on the bus after the breakdown, but also wondered if the coach driver might have caused the breakdown by not ensuring that the coach had enough fuel? I wondered it he might have run out of diesel which cause the breakdown.
I drove past it going northbound yesterday morning. Raised a few hairs on the back of my neck, that is for sure.
Just from my brief look at the scene I thought I'd be surprised if everyone made it out of that alive, namely the truck driver.
Just from my brief look at the scene I thought I'd be surprised if everyone made it out of that alive, namely the truck driver.
Soldato
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The truck driver has died.
A perfect storm of bad events,
no safe runoff due to roadworks (chances are he couldn't get the coach there on momentum if there was other traffic on the inside lane, these things slow down pretty quickly without engine power),
brakes locked on due to engine stopped (you only get enough air for a couple of pumps and the air tanks are empty),
poor visibility due to weather conditions,
stopping in just the wrong place for the police to get to them in time.
****** situation in general.
no safe runoff due to roadworks (chances are he couldn't get the coach there on momentum if there was other traffic on the inside lane, these things slow down pretty quickly without engine power),
brakes locked on due to engine stopped (you only get enough air for a couple of pumps and the air tanks are empty),
poor visibility due to weather conditions,
stopping in just the wrong place for the police to get to them in time.
****** situation in general.
I agree with this ^^
Yes it would been very Highly likley the air Brakes on the bus would been locked on with no engine power
And nowhere to go as seem in this picture below
The thing that surprised me was the truck drivers age, 65!
Obviously im not saying this is the cause of the crash or anything like that, ill leave that to the experts. Just thought commercial truck drivers would be forced to retire/move away from driving at a younger age.
Obviously im not saying this is the cause of the crash or anything like that, ill leave that to the experts. Just thought commercial truck drivers would be forced to retire/move away from driving at a younger age.
That what i was thinking....
Looks like he was driving to fast in the poor visibility to stop in time from when he could see the broken down bus was blocking the road...
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Not to detract from his potential guilt but almost everyone drives way too fast for the weather conditions. People seem to have this "its not going to happen to me" mentality.
65 is not old at all for HGV drivers, I know many FAR older than that!
Travelling @ 20MPH on a motorway in fog is something in all probability that I doubt I or many other HGV drivers would do!* Why? because ,generally, most people don't do such speeds on motorways unfortunately ,regardless of conditions, thus, to be trundling along @20MPH is sadly asking for almost as much trouble as stopping in lane1 if you see what I mean! - I'm not saying this is the right/proper thing to do but its the reality as we all should know only too well.
I must say though, knowing the weight & construction of the average bus & the weight & construction of a six axle HGV (loaded or not), I would hazzard a guess that was not a particularly high speed collision at all.
Yes, the damage to the bus is extensive, yes, the HGV has ploughed into it, Imo had it been going at any great speed, the HGV would have made a much bigger mess than that of the bus, i.e. obliterated it! Busses are not particularly strong where your average Volvo FH artic is extremely well built, carrying an awful lot of weight & momentum, the bus's "body" may as well be cardboard (cast your mind back to the Top gear trucking scene where Clarkson smashes through a brick wall) it is a "David v Goliath" situation & "David" stands no chance!
You are indeed no expert, nor am I (although I do have an idea as to what happened here!) - what erks me is you assume the fault was the truckers, like many people automatically think with any HGV related incident.
I know all to well the HGV driver stood next to no chance of stopping in a situation like that in circumstances like that, just remember he's paid the ultimate price & wait for the experts to decide who was really at fault here, the trucker can't defend himself from a wooden box, I feel almost duty bound to try!
I would guess It was neither of the deceased fault in my humble but experienced opinion!
R.I.P.
*Subject to weather conditions conditions and a whole host of other factors.
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Its also the passengers fault for not evacuating the bus. The driver can't do jack about it if they were all responsible enough to consider their own safety and leave the vehicle. I'm not saying they deserved it but they all brought it upon themselves by actively deciding to do nothing.
I would expect in such a situation the driver to have some kind of duty of care toward his passengers (this is why I don't pull people, incidentally!
) - granted, if they refused to go, then fair enough. But this looks like they all sat in the bus for over 10minutes prior to the accident, not one got off? Surely that came from some form of instruction....The bus driver has not been arrested for breaking down, thats for certain!
''Never attempt to place a warning triangle on a motorway''
Odd that these rules differ per country, here it's required if your alarm lights don't work and generally advised even if they do, 30 meters in built up areas and 100m on the motorway. It's legally required in case of an accident or breakdown where you are causing an obstruction ( like when not on the hard shoulder).
''do not put yourself in danger by attempting even simple repairs''
I understand it's dangerous, but is the highway code enforceable ? I mean do you HAVE to follow this rule ? To hell with not attempting even simple repairs, I'm not gonna call the ANWB (RAC) if I just have to swap a tyre or re-attach my battery or fix a small leak of coolant or so.
As for this accident, this is exactly the reason I tried to get my dads car off the road ASAP when he broke down on a 70km/h road with dense fog and a draining battery, he was mad at me for steering him in the wrong direction but imho priority was to get the car the hell off the road, if you can't see very far then sitting still in the middle of a road is an accident waiting to happen.
Coach driver had bad luck with the coach, but as a professional driver he should have known that sitting on a motorway with dense fog is an accident waiting to happen, should have told the passengers to bugger off outside immediately due to the fog imho.
I love dense fog, even driving in it, I think the world looks pretty with fog, but, it's my nightmare to break down in dense fog, the most important in traffic is that others can see you, I'd be terrified immediately for someone to drive into me, especially if my fog lights weren't on and alarm lights were barely visible, and doing my absolute best to get (push) my vehicle somewhere safe asap, and failing that, myself and any passengers.
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