Tourists Banned From Dutch Cannabis Cafes
- Thread starter Tyron
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Yup - no doubt about it. Though undoubtedly once you tread water in that "dodgy" world, all sorts of other products would undoubtedly make themselves available.
Ok fair enough. I have had a few joints in my life - but it did little for me, and I didn't find the effects particularly enjoyable. I used to get more fun out of smoking (I know, I was a dirty smoker for a couple of years
), and later in life as sport became "my thing" even more pleasure out of that. I guess I'm just not compatible with what it can offer me, or my personality is so strong that I don't need it?
I'm not completely wet behind the ears or ignorant, I am however, ignorant of the concept of it being an enjoyable thing to do.
Sorry but you don't get to smoke cigs for years then bash on weed for being no fun LOL
Soldato
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i take it you dont drink alcohol or even drink coffee. as they can both change your perceptions....
i say each person should be allowed to do what they want if it doesnt harm anyone.
Man of Honour
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haha - yeah I'm good at taking people by surprise!
Thanks for the apology. Clearly I didn't make myself clear, and I just do not like being called an idiot and condescending etc... anyway, water under the bridge - pint?! My point was that I don't understand why people would want to use them above what your body does naturally. As I explained in a reply above, I have had a go several times in the past, and it did very little for me. I got and get more of a buzz out of jumping out a plane, or riding my motorbike, or having a good workout, or even eating some amazing food... or dare I say it, sex!
So it's possibly to get your kicks a different way, which makes you feel good without have to resort to drugs. For me actively taking a drugs is almost a dependence or a shortfall of being able to enjoy being yourself.
I don't care if people want to take them, however, claiming that they're completely harmless (Which I'm sure in small quantities they probably are, like alcohol is) or that they're needed, and so on I find unfathomable - and that's what I was driving at. Hence my comparison to what I enjoy - as it's the best thing I can draw a parallel to.
Yup - though I'm not really into the bodybuilding scene, I weightrain for fitness, strength and power - bodybuilders are generally after size and definition.
There are more bodybuilders that use drugs to enhance their growth than strength training people - however, a lot do still use them unfortunately. Funny thing is, lb for lb, I'm as strong if not stronger than some of the guys that use gear! 
Not bothered about how I look side by side, as they will look bigger and more defined.
Man of Honour
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Why not? I wasn't a 20 a day man - I smoked socially (even though it's a hugely antisocial thing to do.)
Surely, I have an understanding of what foreign ingestion of drugs can do to you?
Soldato
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And here we get back to the most sickening thing about prohibition. Drugs harm people, I dont mean the people who take them and dont get hurt...
...I mean the people who are involved from source, the workers who are treated like ****, the runners who are shot, and our armed forces who take bullets bought with criminal money.
Man of Honour
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I don't drink a huge amount of alcohol no. I do enjoy coffee and usually have one or two cups a week, and I have a couple of cups of tea a day.
I'm not saying people shouldn't be able to do what they want - I'm saying that I don't understand the need for ingested drugs taking.
I could quite easily drink decaf tea and coffee for the rest of my life - I just enjoy the taste more than anything, not bothered about the caffeine, and unfortunately the caffeine free versions don't taste the same.
I'm not saying that all people that smoke the occasional joint are the pariah of society, that would be hypocritical of me. What I don't understand is the vehement need for it and agonised reaction to a ban of a drug in a foreign country that people here are having.
Sure if people want to experiment with mind altering drugs, they can. Just not in such a way that it affects me... i.e. crime, driving a car, or being antisocial. And most well educated people like the people here on OcUK, will do it in the privacy of their own home, in peace and not affect anybody else. However, not everyone is at this level unfortunately.
Man of Honour
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Indeed.
Because cigs have literally no benefit, only negatives... disgusting things.
If you'd of said 'cannabis' instead of 'drugs' then I would have to say that it doesn't seem to be the case.
Soldato
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Why am I an idiot for not enjoying drugs and enjoying the endorphines, dopamine and seratonin releases that I get through keeping fit and eating good food?
Oh and it's "you're"
how many people have died recently from exercise.... how many from smoking pot?
i think he called you an idiot as you seem to think not going your route is wrong. yet it is arguably more dangerous. plus i know of many people who spend far too much time in the gym and not with family.
what if i asked for a ban on gym culture? how much does it cost the tax payer for all those torn muscles, broken limbs, how much does it cost in lost work days?
not that im saying they should be banned because what you do is your business. like what i do is mine
Soldato
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You are in beautiful country steeped in interesting history and architecture, sights to see, activities to take part in, a chance to culture yourself and you'd prefer to sit in cafe stoned
how many people in the UK go to the pub and not look at local history and landmarks?
Soldato
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Thing is, it's also a slippery slope when we start to think about a great many other things about western life. We live on the backs of the poor and ill treated.
Gold, coffee, dimonds, chocolate, electrical waste we ship off to child tips, clothes etc etc. So many 'legal' things that hurt so many people.
But the man who grows a plant to ingest for pain relief? No there's a real criminal
send that man down!
Man of Honour
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how many people have died recently from exercise.... how many from smoking pot?
i think he called you an idiot as you seem to think not going your route is wrong. yet it is arguably more dangerous. plus i know of many people who spend far too much time in the gym and not with family.
what if i asked for a ban on gym culture? how much does it cost the tax payer for all those torn muscles, broken limbs, how much does it cost in lost work days?
not that im saying they should be banned because what you do is your business. like what i do is mine
I never say to people they are wrong unless they're asking me something specific - having an opinion is never wrong, misguided and foolish perhaps, but never wrong. I'll be the first to admit that I'm not always right, but I do have an opinion on most things.
Like everything in life, it's a balance. A person spending more time in the gym than with family is poor judgement, however getting high in a family home with kids, for me, is reprehensible. At least the person going to the gym is in a fit state of mind to deal with the kids should something go wrong or if they need attention, whereas the home smoker would arguably not be. Same goes for smoking in general indoors with kids around - disgusting.
Anyway, that's not the point I'm sure. Ok, so yes people die of heart failure, but also people drive cars drunk and under the influence of drugs. People do just die unfortunately whether they are healthy or not - sometimes nothing can stop that.
I think your argument of gym vs drugs is just not germane to this debate. Had you said steroid user vs drug smoker then we'd have a better matched argument.
Oh of course, as an adult you are far too sophisticated for such behaviourGet over yourself
Yup, that would be it. You'll have to grow up one day.
Caporegime
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Which happens ONLY because they are illegal, a regulated, standardised legal drug would be manufactured where workers are subject to normal pay, and usual benefits of any job.
We CREATED an industry of crime by making drugs illegal, nothing more or less. The same America created an entire industry of crime around alcohol production till they made it legal again.
Making the drug legal would make it safer for end users as you wouldn't need to deal with criminals and would also have safe uncut unmixed products to use, and destroy the criminal empires that have been created by making drugs illegal.
it would also stop the worst drug addicts from needing to break into houses, rob and mug people to get money to pay for their habits as both the drug would be cheaper, available, legalised, the "morality" would disappear, finding a safe, free medical source controlled by a doctor so they could be weened off large amounts would be easy and far far more practicle than it is now.
LIkewise with the source controlled, you could simply prevent people buying enough to get into serious trouble. People go and buy X amount from a drug dealer because A, most people can't and won't meet a dealer every day, the risk is too high, etc, etc. So you buy an amount and drug addicts get into trouble. If you could walk to the local chemist and get a small amount no one would need nor get into taking large/dangerous amounts.
Its not quite that simple for most people. I would much rather be on a beach in Thailand, climbing in spain, doing some Muay Thai or playing hockey than getting high or most of the other things people do for enjoyment. Getting high is a different kind of enjoyment, its cheaper than a lot of things, doesn't depend on the weather or travelling.
I get the impression you see it as a substitute for other methods of enjoying yourself whereas I simply see it as another way of enjoying myself.
I find it strage that you see it as a weakness or personality disorder if you take drugs. We are not all sitting with sad faces waiting for the next high to feel good again!
Soldato
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Just have to pipe in and say that steve-h's heart is obviously in the right place. He might trip himself up with his youth every now and then but I'm sure he will be a force to be reckoned with when he is older.
I wish I held some of his pretty grown up views when I was his age anway
I wish I held some of his pretty grown up views when I was his age anway
Nah, his argument is sound. Many people work out to feel good about themselves and, like you mentioned, get high on the natural drugs our body makes. Equating those that do and hurt themselves to those that smoke dope and hurt themselves are compareable. I'ld be willing to suggest that more folk hurt themselves exercising than those that do smoking pot.
Yep. I hear you. I only with some of the powers that be would too. Meh, it's not the first time I've wondered if the only reason for prohabition is there is so much money in it they are being paid off to keep it so! xD
There is a massive history in taking/doing things that alter our bodies/consciousness. In fact most everyone does it in one form or another. Hell, even religion could be classed as it in some form.
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Yup - no doubt about it. Though undoubtedly once you tread water in that "dodgy" world, all sorts of other products would undoubtedly make themselves available.
Ok fair enough. I have had a few joints in my life - but it did little for me, and I didn't find the effects particularly enjoyable. I used to get more fun out of smoking (I know, I was a dirty smoker for a couple of years
I'm not completely wet behind the ears or ignorant, I am however, ignorant of the concept of it being an enjoyable thing to do.
Define a few joints? I only ask this because for most and including myself, the first joint wasn't enjoyable in the slightest (paranoia, greening out) but the day after I knew it was just my body reacting to this new chemical. I then tried it the next day in the comfort of my own home and got a completely different and pleasurable effect. Many people dismiss cannabis after they have tried it for the first time because the effect is foreign to them and their brain has a hard time coming to terms with the changes that are happening in your mind. Intelligence plays a huge part too with actually determining what you are experiencing and being in control.
I can agree with what you are saying about a persons personality being strong and/or eccentric that they don't need such a high and that some people are naturally high, but why can't you have both? It's a choice, right?
Man of Honour
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Couldn't agree more, and I don't understand why I ever did it...
Though nicotine does have a couple of benefits, but the other toxins within a cigarette are so overwhelming that it's beyond measure for any for/against argument. On that we are 100% agreed!Ok, so weed then - fine. I'm no experts on different types of crops or different genetic mutations of cannabis plants etc... however, from the little research and few items I have read, smoking it still hasn't been mitigated of any long term effects. Again, as I said most educated people are able to enjoy it from time to time with 0 effect to anyone or anything around them. Unfortunately, others get hooked on it and develop a dependence on it, just like alcohol. Except alcohol is legal and easily obtainable.
We already have enough of a problem of people drinking themselves into oblivion - it would be a shame to see society disappearing into a mess of being doped up.
Soldato
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Sad to see that you get a better and serious talk on drug policy on random forums than from the powers that be. Would be intresting to find out how much influence and funds drinks makers devote in keeping cannabis iliegal.