Want to know where all the money went?

[Jokester]

We contend that for a nation to tax itself into prosperity is like a man standing in a bucket and trying to lift himself up by the handle.

Sir Winston Leonard Spencer Churchill (1874-1965)

A beautiful analogy, thanks for the source, was going to ask who said it.

 

[RomanNose]

You need to bear in mind that the government have the make the UK an attractive proposition for very wealthy individuals. Being very hard on tax make living/working in this country much less attractive.

Yep, there isn't an easy solution to sort this out.

 

[Derek W]

I've been saying this all along, it's all the fat cats()that have skimmed the money out of the economy. Can't really add much more as it's pretty obvious.

well done you

 

[jsmoke]

You do realise that the money isn't just sitting there in vast piles in a bank vault? It is used by the bank to invest in stocks / shares / bonds and as loans etc.,

They will give the depositors a certain percentage of their profit for investing it in their bank and the rest will be profit for the bank itself. Fairly simplistic description but that is how all banks work.

As long as the initial money is legally gained and isn't as a result of illegal tax evasion rather than legal tax reduction then there isn't anything wrong with it.

So your saying there are no detrimental effects of using these tax havens?
I may have jumped the gun a bit here. The money still exists for the banks to lend just these rich are getting better returns by using these havens. I get that.

 

[elmarko]

First person to say 'fair share of tax' gets shot umkay

Fairness isn't the issue.

It's enough tax to keep the economy going to continue cyclic consumption to allow the money to retain its value.

Some of the right wing cliches in this thread are hilarious.

"TAX IS THEFT TROLOLOL" - ahem.

A beautiful analogy, thanks for the source, was going to ask who said it.

It's a shame it's utterly flawed as one.

 

[Hatter The Mad]

Fairness isn't the issue.

It gets banded around so much, but it is such a meaningless phrase - people use it as an absolute 'they should pay their fair share of tax' or 'as long as they pay their fair share'. No one knows or can agree on what that is.

It's so ****ing meaningless.

 

[Hatter The Mad]

A beautiful analogy, thanks for the source, was going to ask who said it.

It's beautiful like a piece of art. Ultimately useless and not quite representative of reality, though.

 

[Jokester]

It's a shame it's utterly flawed as one.

You don't increase prosperity by increasing taxes. It's quite apt.

 

[elmarko]

It gets banded around so much, but it is such a meaningless phrase - people use it as an absolute 'they should pay their fair share of tax' or 'as long as they pay their fair share'. No one knows or can agree on what that is.

It's so ****ing meaningless.

Oh I agree.

I have my own views on taxation & "fair" levels, but it's subjective so pointless to use in debates.

What isn't subjective is that the entire global economy is falling apart due to short term greed & the fact certain groups ignore long term sustainability in order to get incredibly wealthy.

 

[elmarko]

You don't increase prosperity by increasing taxes. It's quite apt.

It depends on what you spend the tax on.

Improvements in infrastructure most definitely encourage economic growth.

If we lived in the capitalist dystopia those strongly aligned to the right crave, the middle/working class would erode to the point demand for goods & services would hit rock bottom - unemployment would skyrocket & crime would go through the roof.

The standard of living in the UK would greatly diminish & our economic growth would flatline.

If you want to use the "Tax is theft" line.

Then by the same standard "Profit is theft".

 

[Hatter The Mad]

You don't increase prosperity by increasing taxes. It's quite apt.

Well, that's fundamentally wrong not least because you're not defining scope and starting point - increase from what? What to tax? What is prosperity?

If the government taxed just 1% from the economy and didn't provide universally free education, and then increased tax to 2% in order to provide it, prosperity would increase.

More realistically, the government increased taxes in order to better fund research-focused universities, then prosperity would probably increase.

 

[robgmun]

Tax avoidance is the duty of every person. Every person should pay what the law demands and not a penny more. The government is not entitled to a single penny from anyone, despite what they would have you think.

When the government stops wasting millions and millions on complete ******** then i will support a fair tax system. Until then i completely agree with you whole heartedly

 

[King Damager]

We contend that for a nation to tax itself into prosperity is like a man standing in a bucket and trying to lift himself up by the handle.

Sir Winston Leonard Spencer Churchill (1874-1965)

Scandinavia being the exception that proves the rule.

So very very true though.

kd

 

[Hatter The Mad]

When the government stops wasting millions and millions on complete ******** then i will support a fair tax system. Until then i completely agree with you whole heartedly

What makes the tax you pay more part of the 'wasted' than say, mine? Or do you include funding the NHS or education system as waste too?

 

[Kotu]

Most of that money shouldn't be going straight to the tax man, it should be paying employees much more, none of these super-rich made the money from just their effort, there is an army of greatly underpaid employees supporting them. If everyone was paid more (except for the CEOs) then it would generate more tax while also adding a great deal more to the economy (everyone can spend more!).

Profit just for the sake of storing the excess money is pretty evil, they should be expanding/reducing prices/increasing pay.

 

[robgmun]

What makes the tax you pay more part of the 'wasted' than say, mine? Or do you include funding the NHS or education system as waste too?

If you don't know then go educate yourself on the waste

 

[Destination]

The law doesn't necessarily say what is right and wrong, tax avoidance on a huge scale is not morally right in my book.

You would almost think the people of the country might have the sence to vote for someone who would change the 'morally' unfair system, but oh look, cor thirty years we have voted labour, then cons, then labour, then cons.... And oh yes, it hasn't changed.

 

[sanaxe1]

Where has this idea that rich people create jobs come from? Demand creates jobs.

 

[Mickie]

the longer this goes on the more money will disappear from the country and more often will the bank have to print money as it so obviously is disappearing..

seems like a big problem to me, probably too big to fix, i dont believe anyone could stop them or tell them to change their ways..

i'd imagine it like telling a king from the middle ages to step down, he wouldnt unless you chopped off his head. the world would have to change at the same time to stop these people hording money out of their own country or they'd have to be killed..

 

[Mickie]

Where has this idea that rich people create jobs come from? Demand creates jobs.

people thinking they spend all their money on thousands of cars and houses when they dont..

thinking they have thousands of businesses when they most likely dont, maybe just a couple of good ones