Gay Marriage to be Illegal in the Church of England
- Thread starter dirtychinchilla
- Start date
Yea but god says its ok! Its what Jesus would do.
We literally have the opposite at the moment, the Queen is Supreme Governor of the Church of England
And when it comes down to it, the US is far more religious than the UK. Religion is almost invisible in British daily life.
i agree religion in the UK is non existent which is a good thing .. i would hate living in the good old USA where most people have a Jesus sticker on their cars ....... the less said about religion the better ...
however in this day and age where we have advanced as humanity but we still believe in thousands of old man made scriptures and perceive it as law .. its shocking ,,, religion has no standing in morality in this day and age
I think the OP has jumped the gun a bit here and is just realising that for himself.
The whole Gay Marriage issue has turned into a bit of a debacle tbh, it should simply be a single civil marriage law for everyone, if you want to get married then you can, if you want a civil partnership then you can do that instead irrespective of your sexual persuasion.
Each religious institution should able to make up their own minds on what definition they ascribe to marriage without State interference and it is then up to their respective synods and laities to either push for a more progressive reform or a more conservative position depending on the mood of their congregations.
The specific laws they are proposing are to forestall challenges under EU equality rules rather than addressing internal Church politics.
The whole Gay Marriage issue has turned into a bit of a debacle tbh, it should simply be a single civil marriage law for everyone, if you want to get married then you can, if you want a civil partnership then you can do that instead irrespective of your sexual persuasion.
Each religious institution should able to make up their own minds on what definition they ascribe to marriage without State interference and it is then up to their respective synods and laities to either push for a more progressive reform or a more conservative position depending on the mood of their congregations.
The specific laws they are proposing are to forestall challenges under EU equality rules rather than addressing internal Church politics.
Soldato
- Joined
- 27 Feb 2012
- Posts
- 6,586
We literally have the opposite at the moment, the Queen is Supreme Governor of the Church of England
And when it comes down to it, the US is far more religious than the UK. Religion is almost invisible in British daily life.
Yet 60% of the population attach themselves to Christian faith.
How many people do you think "lied" to themselves on the census, when in fact they're not religious, just decided to follow the grain and pick the ones they always pick?
Don't see a huge issue with religious organisations being allowed to opt in... it is a bit short sighted to specifically legislate the CofE out (IMO) as they may well decide to opt in in future (in which case they'd presumably require further legislation)
would be interesting to see if some gay muslim group manages to wangle a marriage in a mosque... now that would be brave... (has happened in Canada AFAIK)
would be interesting to see if some gay muslim group manages to wangle a marriage in a mosque... now that would be brave... (has happened in Canada AFAIK)
yes 60 percent maybe have said they are of Christian fate but do 60 percent actually believe in it .. i think not most people say they are of certain religious status because thats what there parents where or simply by stature , they perceive themselves as Christian yet they do not act like they are in a certain religion .. the simple matter of fact is most people do not give a **** about religion ...
I think it's the compromising of slots that the church have a problem with...
So the alternative is to discriminate against those who belief marriage is between a man and a woman? Remember there are a lot of people opposed to this who are not even remotely religious and within the Church there are those that support it...it is not as black and white as a Secular/Religious demarkation.
Re-defining something as fundamental as marriage in my opinion requires something more than a free vote in parliament...it requires a referendum to truly see what the will of the people is...none of the parties or their members were elected on a manifesto that included a statement on such a redefining of Marriage so they simply do not have a mandate.
And for the record I think anyone should be able to get married to whoever they want, wherever they want, whenever they want...just the declaration of the two (or more) parties involved and a signing of a legally binding vow should suffice IMO.
So the will of the people trumps basic liberty?
Sometimes you just have to do it, it isn't like government asks for consent on even mundane tasks like a certain treaty in the EU that we got no say on.
They only bother when its not particularly important to them.
Sometimes you just have to do it, it isn't like government asks for consent on even mundane tasks like a certain treaty in the EU that we got no say on.
They only bother when its not particularly important to them.
Soldato
- Joined
- 27 Feb 2012
- Posts
- 6,586
That's my point, it gives a false statistic.
The percentage is probably more inline with our secular EU Countries - or i hope it is.
Whatever it is, at least its not in your face like in 'merica
Soldato
- Joined
- 26 Dec 2009
- Posts
- 9,713
- Location
- North
Excellent decision, any religious institution should have a choice in who they marry
With this proposed law, the CofE don't have a choice.
Whose Liberty? One way or the other someone's liberty (as in a restriction imposed from a position authority) is going to be impacted....we do not live in a totally free society, neither is it practical. There should be effectively provision for all, which under law the current system technically provides albeit in a divisive and ultimately discriminatory way....a heterosexual couple are currently as discriminated against under the current system as homosexual couples and these proposals simply increase that discriminination albeit in a different way along religious and cultural lines instead of orientation ones.
I don't think there are any easy answers here, so let the people have their say and take it from there.....at the moment I wonder what the agenda in government is and to be honest thing that there are more important and immediate issues that should be taking up parliamentary time than questions on morality.
Soldato
- Joined
- 26 Dec 2009
- Posts
- 9,713
- Location
- North
"The Church of England is committed to the traditional understanding of the institution of marriage as being between one man and one woman."
Is that not thier position.
If gay people are so persecuted by religions, I have no idea why they'd want to be "married" in a "church" anyway.
The Abrahamic religions don't believe in gay relationships, so it's always confused me as to why people want to be involved with them but also be gay.
It might seem like an oversimplification, but to me it's like non-white people wanting to be members of the BNP.
The Abrahamic religions don't believe in gay relationships, so it's always confused me as to why people want to be involved with them but also be gay.
It might seem like an oversimplification, but to me it's like non-white people wanting to be members of the BNP.
Because they are a member of that religion? Christians that follow the teachings of Jesus and not the opinions of the churches leaders.
Yes, however under the proposals they would not be able to change that position without a change in the law. Unlike other religious institutions who would be able to choose on a case by case basis if they so wanted. It is effectively discriminating against the CofE ironically.
They still wouldn't want to get married in CoE or many other Christian denominations.
Well some would as a big **** you.