Pc graphics. No where near as good as consoles !

NirK · 18 Mar 2013 at 00:13

Yes you could buy a similar spec PC to PS4 for about £600 maybe but the thing is that a PC specced identical to a PS4 will not be as good as a PS4 for graphics due to various reasons....

£400 for the spec is not bad TBH but I am not sure what people expect? You physically could not fit much more and cool it as well in a small console box.... look at the size of cooler you need for a i7 at 4ghz and also look at the size of a GTX680....

NirK · 18 Mar 2013 at 00:14

Deific said:
Except you're still wrong. My rig which could probably be built for £400 has more grunt than a PS4, and once they start fully utilising PS4 power and my xfire 5850s start to fall behind, I'll be able to outpower it again with a relatively cheap card upgrade - my rig isn't even close to a 'top end gaming rig'.

If you actually factor in everything you would need... case, all components, controller etc etc. then I doubt you could build a PC which would equal the PS4 for the same price. (The PC would need to be more powefull than a PS4 to have similar performance)...

Also I doubt that your 5850's will run PS4 games on PC at good framerates etc. My 5870 is already struggling with games like tomb raider etc.

Skeeter · 18 Mar 2013 at 00:21

NirK said:
You physically could not fit much more and cool it as well in a small console box.... look at the size of cooler you need for a i7 at 4ghz and also look at the size of a GTX680....

Have you seen the insides of an original PS3? Its 50% heatsink!

NirK · 18 Mar 2013 at 00:29

Skeeter said:
Have you seen the insides of an original PS3? Its 50% heatsink!

And the Xbox 360 went through a load of revisions and problems with the "red ring of death" etc. due to basically the hardware overheating.....

I don't know why people seem to expect consoles to be as good as top end PC hardware when they are released.... The size of the box and the cooling are obviously going to mean that brand new hardware is not going to be possible...

Actually what I just said had nothing to do with the original topic sorry.

Skeeter · 18 Mar 2013 at 00:35

NirK said:
And the Xbox 360 went through a load of revisions and problems with the "red ring of death" etc. due to basically the hardware overheating.....

I don't know why people seem to expect consoles to be as good as top end PC hardware when they are released.... The size of the box and the cooling are obviously going to mean that brand new hardware is not going to be possible...

Actually what I just said had nothing to do with the original topic sorry.

Nobody who understand both thinks this. However I can fully understand why someone who knows nothing about PC gaming might think so. The only exposure they will have had is going to be some shoddy flash games on their work laptop or something. And if thats the case its hardly surprising they think consoles are better.

And thats just the people who don't PC game. Even for those who do, the majority of PC gamers for a long time after launch of the PS4 will be running machines that do not out perform it. While its possible to build PC's that outperform consoles (at launch of those consoles), the percentage of PC gamers who actually have that specification is tiny.

From the Steam survey, less than 3% of PC gamers currently have a graphics card that would be considered to outperform a 7850. If your in the other 97%, then yes, a PS4 will have better graphics than your PC.

NirK · 18 Mar 2013 at 00:56

You say "nobody who understands both thinks this" but every time a new console comes out there are literally millions of PC / console owners moaning about how it is "not as good as a current PC". So it seems that actually it is a minority that actually understands this...

Skeeter · 18 Mar 2013 at 01:06

Knowing that the pinnacle of PC gaming technology will always outperform a console has little impact on weather people will argue about it

4Play · 18 Mar 2013 at 10:08

Skeeter said:
From the Steam survey, less than 3% of PC gamers currently have a graphics card that would be considered to outperform a 7850. If your in the other 97%, then yes, a PS4 will have better graphics than your PC.

The problem with this information from steam is that many pc gamers have not felt the urgent need to upgrade their hardware due to console port limitations. I purchased a gtx 480 over two years ago and I have never not been able to fully max a game graphics. I have had the upgrade itch for a long time but their is simply no point right now. Now I have nothing against consoles but the fact still remains that after a year of them been out pc hardware will have moved on again and be once again far superior.

gigeorge · 18 Mar 2013 at 10:59

I suppose theyve got a point these console kids. THe amount of pc games which are shony console ports these days..

arknor · 18 Mar 2013 at 11:04

From the Steam survey, less than 3% of PC gamers currently have a graphics card that would be considered to outperform a 7850. If your in the other 97%, then yes, a PS4 will have better graphics than your PC.

steam survey isn't everything.
I cant remember having it pop up in years and I bet I'm not the only one, I also use my steam account on 2 laptops and I'd imagine a lot of people do the same.
If my steam survey is done without prompting me because of some setting I ticked then we can assume I'm skewing the stats already

the 7850 chip in the ps4 is probably down clocked as well where as a lot of 7850's in pc's will be around 1ghz and the 7850 is quickly becoming a low end card.
the ps4 chip isn't even equal to a 7850 anyway its in between a 7850 and a lower end card.

why consoles are waiting for next gen graphics some pc games have already started to have them

and it easily run on a 7850 with tons of AA

Woden · 18 Mar 2013 at 11:11

They are right though, for the vast majority of PCs, the graphics won't be as good as a console, and certainly not as good as the PS4 or NextBox.

Graphics on PCss can be far, far better than consoles. We all know that, but our PC's are hardly the norm. Most people pick up their PCs off the highstreet rather than build their own and spend less on the whole system than we might on the GPU alone.

arknor · 18 Mar 2013 at 11:15

Woden said:
They are right though, for the vast majority of PCs, the graphics won't be as good as a console, and certainly not as good as the PS4 or NextBox.

Graphics on PCss can be far, far better than consoles. We all know that, but our PC's are hardly the norm. Most people pick up their PCs off the highstreet rather than build their own and spend less on the whole system than we might on the GPU alone.

and most people don't play real games on them either just facebook games and flash games

You can't really call them pc gamers

ince · 18 Mar 2013 at 11:17

they are for most people aren't they

arknor · 18 Mar 2013 at 11:20

ince said:
they are for most people aren't they

okay then lets stick anyone who plays flash games on a mobile phone or a tablet in with pc gamers , infact we can add anyone who plays anything thats like a browser game into the pc gamers catagory.....

When someone says PC game you don't imagine people playing angry birds or some browser based tower defence game

francky · 18 Mar 2013 at 12:01

Also lets not forget PC gaming is usually played at 60fps +, where as console is limited to 30fps is it not?

Most PC gamers would find 30 fps as a slide show.

You cant inherently say a PC will have better graphics than a console, because if the spec of the PC is an old dog, then it wont be with onboard graphics etc.

PC's are just more customisable, allowing people to put in hardware that far surpasses consoles and thus obtain a better IQ and far better framerates, should they have the desire and the capital to do so.

kedge · 18 Mar 2013 at 12:09

Isn't this all just "pie in the sky" unless game devs start to put some more concerted effort into proper thought out pc game development or pc centric titles and assets?, Crysis3 is probably the only single player game on pc recentley that pushes things in favour of the windows platform, aren't most games developed on the lowest common denominator then extras bolted on during the port overs?. I still think Red Dead Redemption was quite a remarkable effort on the console and surpassed some pc games imho. A gaming PC with state of the art technology is of course way better than any gaming console is likely to ever be, but what use is spending a ton of cash on building a great pc gaming rig if the games aren't built to match it?.

mrbios · 18 Mar 2013 at 12:10

I'm going to add a disclaimer to this post: Information may not be true, remember reading about this years ago but thought it was worth mentioning....

Basically, you can't compare a 7850 in a PC to a 7850 in a console, consoles all being the exact same hardware have games specially coded to run for that specific hardware, which means (this is the bit that i hope I'm right on but...) everythings coded to the hardware with no driver limitations holding back the performance, and everything is specially optimised to make use of the specific instructions within that console hardware. Whereas on a PC everything has to be able to run on drivers and frameworks that all sit between the hardware and the OS to ensure compatibility greatly reducing potential performance.

So all this talk of comparing the two directly, assuming I'm right, is completely ridiculous. Maybe someone else can expand on that but that's the way I see it as working.

arknor · 18 Mar 2013 at 12:15

ps4 is x86
its not a 7850 its somewhere between a 7850 and a lower end 7xxx card.
it's down clocked a lot the same as the amd cpu they are using.

Ports should run a lot better than older generations of console games did it also means it's easy to port pc games to them so some devs might start making more effort with pc games

the gpu still needs a driver to tell is what to do anyway? they still run an os just not as bloated as a pc OS but consoles aren't solely for games anymore either so they still have some stuff slowing them down with all the integrated gaming crap they now have

francky · 18 Mar 2013 at 12:17

mrbios said:
I'm going to add a disclaimer to this post: Information may not be true, remember reading about this years ago but thought it was worth mentioning....

Basically, you can't compare a 7850 in a PC to a 7850 in a console, consoles all being the exact same hardware have games specially coded to run for that specific hardware, which means (this is the bit that i hope I'm right on but...) everythings coded to the hardware with no driver limitations holding back the performance, and everything is specially optimised to make use of the specific instructions within that console hardware. Whereas on a PC everything has to be able to run on drivers and frameworks that all sit between the hardware and the OS to ensure compatibility greatly reducing potential performance.

So all this talk of comparing the two directly, assuming I'm right, is completely ridiculous. Maybe someone else can expand on that but that's the way I see it as working.

Most definetely....Consoles are far more efficient as gaming machines, as games are designed to run on them from the core up.....which is why after 7 years the games are still looking pretty good on them.

PC's arent just gaming machines and there are so many different possbible specs that its hard for them to be as efficient.

Doomedspeed · 18 Mar 2013 at 12:23

francky said:
Most definetely....Consoles are far more efficient as gaming machines, as games are designed to run on them from the core up.....which is why after 7 years the games are still looking pretty good on them.

PC's arent just gaming machines and there are so many different possbible specs that its hard for them to be as efficient.

I see where you are coming from, i don't see why efficency comes into the equation though..

The games played on a console and on a PC are different in design anyway.. PS3 and Xbox 360 run at 720p and PC games run a 1080p and higher.. (apart from Dark souls)