I've been over 17st at 5'6 which while not quite 30st is still pretty obese, once I'd decided it was time to do something about it I don't think I ever done that.
Tongue-sewn diet patch makes eating painful
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I've been over 17st at 5'6 which while not quite 30st is still pretty obese, once I'd decided it was time to do something about it I don't think I ever done that.
Not everyone is the same though mate. Not every fat person will get depression but a good majority of them do. Not all of them comfort eat but most do.
ive seen it happen many times. and sorry, not to downplay your achievements but being 17 stone is an entirely different league to being 25+ and having a long history of obesity which most of these people do.
Do you have a photo of yourself at that weight?
If you could point out specifically what's wrong in the content of my posts then please do.
Otherwise leave your childish personal attacks at the door.
It's nice to know that when challenged on an issue you resort to name calling.Bang on. I think he may be controlled by aliens, and has forgotten to wear his tin foil hat.
But since I have no free will that cannot be an insult since it's just the way I'm wired up obviously
It's good to know what level you work on - but don't worry, I don't blame you for being the way you are - you can't help it.
Mostly fair post & correct overall, but if you could point out the hyperbolic statements or where exactly I'm "going nuts in retaliation" as so you say I'd be interested in seeing it.The thing is, he's not entirely wrong -- but when the likes of Freefaller are actually agreeing with him, but on a less hyperbolic plane, he's going nuts in retaliation.
Almost everybody here is agreeing the same thing, but at different levels of vehemence -- and that in turn is becoming one big fight as though the points were complete polar opposites.
Heck, even those who began with the "calories in < calories out - simples!" mantra have agreed that it's not that simple. That was the original point -- there are FAR more factors to weight loss (especially HEALTHY weight loss) than just telling someone to cut their calories if they want to lose weight. As I mentioned early on, a stupid person could take that literally, cut their intake to 800kcal/day and end up in cardiac arrest.
Education, assistance, and coaching are much more successful than saying "eat less, fat stuff".
Everyone in GD just loves an argument, though, but it's distinctly hilarious that in here is going mad over varying degrees of the the exact same outlook, for the most part anyway. There are of course still a few who seem to think it's perfectly alright for someone to just stop eating in order to lose weight, actual health be damned. For them I just feel rather sorry (and anyone who listens to their advice).
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Man of Honour
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The thing is, he's not entirely wrong -- but when the likes of Freefaller are actually agreeing with him, but on a less hyperbolic plane, he's going nuts in retaliation.
Almost everybody here is agreeing the same thing, but at different levels of vehemence -- and that in turn is becoming one big fight as though the points were complete polar opposites.
Heck, even those who began with the "calories in < calories out - simples!" mantra have agreed that it's not that simple. That was the original point -- there are FAR more factors to weight loss (especially HEALTHY weight loss) than just telling someone to cut their calories if they want to lose weight. As I mentioned early on, a stupid person could take that literally, cut their intake to 800kcal/day and end up in cardiac arrest.
Education, assistance, and coaching are much more successful than saying "eat less, fat stuff".
Everyone in GD just loves an argument, though, but it's distinctly hilarious that in here is going mad over varying degrees of the the exact same outlook, for the most part anyway. There are of course still a few who seem to think it's perfectly alright for someone to just stop eating in order to lose weight, actual health be damned. For them I just feel rather sorry (and anyone who listens to their advice).
It's just the extraordinary lengths he's going to, to pick a totally irrelevant part of the basics that have been posted. Bar specific psychological issues everyone has the ability to change, following the general principles outlined, self control, exercise, and improving their dietary behaviours. It really is that simple. Granted for the exeptional few that make the rule, this wont apply but stating that this is the norm is just stupid frankly.
Well, looks like I've been told
And my childish attacks are just how I am, I'm hard wired this way. You of all people should know this. I have no other choice in the matter
Elmarko - where does your view on 'free will' come from? Sam Harris, Bruce Hood etc? If so, have you considered the rebuttals (Dan Dennet). Are you aware that the science relating to free-will/determinism is not exactly concrete?
We can debate it, and I think it might be fun, but I hope that your certainty of the subject comes from actually researching it, rather than sensationalist news articles or BBC's horizon!
We can debate it, and I think it might be fun, but I hope that your certainty of the subject comes from actually researching it, rather than sensationalist news articles or BBC's horizon!
here come the lifters, brilliant5*s
Not sure how that is relevant or of any importance, many people on this forum who are 'lifters' have been obese in some fashion, or skeletal thin, so they are aware of what is needed to lose weight or gain weight.
Man of Honour
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Yeah I'm pretty fick innit. And as you say I can't help it, just like you can't help being stubborn and slightly on the autistic scale in terms of social behaviour/understanding. However as you say it's just the way you are.
You started by being derogatory towards my posts, don't throw stones in glass houses.
I think we will just not agree, so I will agree to disagree and hope that you continue to live a happy and fulfilled life, whether out of your choice or whatever you believe.
I shall fortunately be in a situation to make my free will choices, as I'm fortunate to be in that position.
Take care and all the best. I genuinely have no issue with you, I just think you're over complicating things that are a lot more simple than you think.
If ever we happen to be in the same place/time I should be happy to buy you a beer over a sophisticated discussion on free will or whatever, your free will chooses to discuss with me.
What part specifically, if you are going to make ridiculous accusations then be specific.
What a massive flawed assumption.
It's simple on paper, in reality obtaining the self control, the motivation to exercise & changing hard-learned dietary behaviours is an incredibly complex subject.
How many times do I have to repeat this point.
I'm not talking about statistical anomalies, I'm talking about general human motivation issues & self control which impact on weight management (with some of the complex underline causes of those) - hardly "out there" ideas, it's basic stuff.
Don't start off a post being rude, childish & insulting then pretend to be a gentleman at the end.Yeah I'm pretty fick innit. And as you say I can't help it, just like you can't help being stubborn and slightly on the autistic scale in terms of social behaviour/understanding. However as you say it's just the way you are.
You started by being derogatory towards my posts, don't throw stones in glass houses.
I think we will just not agree, so I will agree to disagree and hope that you continue to live a happy and fulfilled life, whether out of your choice or whatever you believe.
I shall fortunately be in a situation to make my free will choices, as I'm fortunate to be in that position.
Take care and all the best. I genuinely have no issue with you, I just think you're over complicating things that are a lot more simple than you think.
If ever we happen to be in the same place/time I should be happy to buy you a beer over a sophisticated discussion on free will or whatever, your free will chooses to discuss with me.
"Man of honour" - what a joke.
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While most are aware of the nutritional and exercise needs, most are unaware or lack understanding of the psychological issues involved.
I know it's not concrete, it was just another aspect of the debate & a rebuttal (at least in theory) to the suggestion that people just need to choose to diet/exercise - while ignoring the complexities of the subject matter.
I'm a keen reader on the subject & other associated fields.
From my reading on the subject I tend to find myself swayed towards the arguments of Sam Harris, with real world examples lending supporting evidence to the theory (in that people make objectively poor choices against their best interests on a vast array of different subjects) - the fact we have people who hate themselves, who they are & what they - yet continue destructive behaviour also lends favour towards the idea (in my opinion).
But it's a little OT, perhaps a new thread in speakers corner (higher standard of debate there anyway).
No, not at all. (not that it would make any difference anyway).
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Considering Anorexia runs in my family, I'm pretty clued up, as are many others.
Soldato
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Most still are BMI obese...damn fatties!
Dear God, don't start on BMI. That's the last thing we need in here!
Soldato
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I'm not unaware of them. I just refuse to believe psychological issues are the over riding factor that stops the majority of overweight people losing weight. In my experience of people around me, it's just sheer laziness.
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Wow. I'm slightly speechless as I was being genuine. I'm sorry you feel that way. Thanks again for being rude. I'm sure you don't mean to be, but it seems to be an acceptable double standard for you. Don't worry I shall not be polite or rude again as I have no longer any interest in speaking with you, but my offer still stands, despite being a joke to you.
and your experience with morbid obesity?
do you disagree with the statement that most 'lifters' have not experienced morbid obesity?