They are resisting being restrained though you can't really resist someone passing the tube because the action there is an involuntary reflex.
So why did he not just make a video about being held down - why go for the drama of the tube too?
Mos Def - force fed like Guantanamo detainees.
- Thread starter Hedge
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They are resisting being restrained though you can't really resist someone passing the tube because the action there is an involuntary reflex.
So why did he not just make a video about being held down - why go for the drama of the tube too?
Soldato
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Black on Both sides and Blackstar are amazing albums. I am not so much a fan of his more recent stuff.
Caporegime
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We force them down kids all day every day, they don't consent, they get held down and fight, but no-one makes a video about it. Why? It's for their own good, so it gets done.
Won't someone think of the children!!!!!!
Caporegime
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Dude should have tried standing on an ied and given us q report back how that felt.
Stupid video obviously acting like a girl but if you were being force fed and someone was essentially raping you with a food tube you might act something like that.
If they want to hunger strike and die so be it but you are not going to be released to commit further crimes so don't be a terrorist.But its not acceptable to force food down someone elses mouth either.Every human should have to right to have complete control over his own body and thier right to die.
Where do people get off thinking its ok to prolong someones life so they can be punished or controlling what someone can and cannot do with thier own body? There is just as much a place in hell for the force feeders and controllers who persist in making laws like this as there is a terrorist who kills other people.
If they want to hunger strike and die so be it but you are not going to be released to commit further crimes so don't be a terrorist.But its not acceptable to force food down someone elses mouth either.Every human should have to right to have complete control over his own body and thier right to die.
Where do people get off thinking its ok to prolong someones life so they can be punished or controlling what someone can and cannot do with thier own body? There is just as much a place in hell for the force feeders and controllers who persist in making laws like this as there is a terrorist who kills other people.
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Caporegime
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What about your average anorexic 14 year old? Some will die if you don't force feed them, but if you do then you can help them recover and some (not all) will go on to lead a normal life again and thank you for it.
What about an 8 month old girl with RSV?
He clearly doesn't have a clue what actually goes on. (Yes, I know I am deliberately leading it somewhere there)
Some of you need to think about what having something done against your will means and stop thinking of it as a normal procedure
If your GF came home and said she had been raped you wouldn't just tell her "man up people have sex all the time" which is pretty much what many of you are doing here ?
What happening in Guantanamo isn't all that different
If your GF came home and said she had been raped you wouldn't just tell her "man up people have sex all the time" which is pretty much what many of you are doing here ?
What happening in Guantanamo isn't all that different
What's this got to do with anything ?
You need to have a think about the big difference between:
Forcible sexual penetration
and
A 5mm tube passed down your nose so you don't die
Because actually it is a world of a difference and if you can't see that then ...
And the criticism in this thread is about someone who knew the procedure was going to take place with their consent having being given. It is the bloke people are being critical of.
Soldato
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Anorexia isn't a normal state of mind,
consciously buying a Casio watch and then looking shifty in a war zone, is.
Damn Islamists and their cheap but functional timepieces.
Why would you even bring something like that up and try to twist something just to start an arguement? A 14 year old who is not even an adult to make her own decisions is completely different than an 18+ year old who wants to die as he is being held in prison.Honestly i wish i could have the minute or so it took me to write this back.
And you still cant force another human against thier will.Its called oppression how would you like it if i forced you to do something with your own body you dont like? Its all fun and games until someone grabs you and holds you down and does something to you to prolong your suffering.
Bye
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Judge Fraser says he is right and you are wrong.
Mos Def gave consent.
Mental Health Act.
You should have kept that minute and got a clue what you were on about before posting ...
My post was not entirely on mos def learn to read please.
I said you cannot force feed someone when they do not want it.So you advocate it then by your post huh? In case you cannot read i said its different when it is a sick 14 year old who obviously needs help.But if that same 14 year old gets better and again wants to die who the hell are you to stand in thier way? Just because a judge says its ok to force feed someone does not mean its morally ok.there comes a point where you have to say ok enough is enough.
You do realise the only reason people are being force fed in Guantamo is because the USA does not want to let them die or get a bad reputation? Maybe the USA just does not want to give those terrorists and easy way out of thier punishment.And you actually have the guts to tell someone to get a clue.
You sound like a sick individual who delights in the torture of others.That is what you are advocating here pal.And that is what the USA are doing by force feeding a prisoner of war who just wants to die in peace.
I said you cannot force feed someone when they do not want it.So you advocate it then by your post huh? In case you cannot read i said its different when it is a sick 14 year old who obviously needs help.But if that same 14 year old gets better and again wants to die who the hell are you to stand in thier way? Just because a judge says its ok to force feed someone does not mean its morally ok.there comes a point where you have to say ok enough is enough.
You do realise the only reason people are being force fed in Guantamo is because the USA does not want to let them die or get a bad reputation? Maybe the USA just does not want to give those terrorists and easy way out of thier punishment.And you actually have the guts to tell someone to get a clue.
You sound like a sick individual who delights in the torture of others.That is what you are advocating here pal.And that is what the USA are doing by force feeding a prisoner of war who just wants to die in peace.
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And yet below you instantly bring in a caveat undermining immediately your point.
The people who have the capacity to fully understand the consequences. ReW proves this - she was against - she was overruled - as she became older she quite clearly stated she was glad treatment went ahead against her wishes. The same would apply over there.
Actually it is especially when said judge can at least tell the difference between morals and ethics ... unlike you.
Hmm ... really?
Strange that ...
Well it's quite clear you don't have a clue.
Why thank you. I would offer some witty retort but no personal insults eh!
And as everyone is on about Mos Def and the portrayal about him rather than that little rant you've had - anything to say about that at all?
As usual when someone is butt hurt on a forum why is it they always post in the same manner? A long line of quotes with a few words of nonsense in between both.Is there an internet term for these kind of responses as obviously you struggle to put a full coherant paragraph togeather on your feelings on the issues.You also lack the intelligence to comprehend what i have now written twice i believe.
I said before you even came into this arguement that force feeding a sick 14 year old was ok as they are ill and need help.But force feeding someone who is not ill and is a prisoner is wrong wrong wrong.
She was force fed while sick she was clearly not feeling better and did not choose to starve herself to death again once she was healed.that is exactly what i said i did not have a problem with but you have failed to understand again so here is my quote on the issue.
Keyword here in my own quote is better which the girl obviously wasnt! If she is better an decides she wants to die why should she not have the freedom to die? Wanting to die is mental illness now is it? there are perfectly rational and sane people who want to die for various reasons.Judging by your response and obvious morals on the issues i honestly cannot blame people for wanting a quick exit from humanity at times.You cannot even offer up a response about force feeding prisoners which is what im talking about and not a sick little 14 year old girl.All you have done is dodge the question and offered up this gem of a quote.
What does this even mean? Is it supposed to be an answer or something lol? Could you please state a response to the reason why the USA are force feeding prisoners? If it is not punishment then i do not know what is.they want to keep them on this earth so they can rot in jail.How can you even argue that fact? And stop dodging the question and dragging the discussion to a little girl thanks.
I said before you even came into this arguement that force feeding a sick 14 year old was ok as they are ill and need help.But force feeding someone who is not ill and is a prisoner is wrong wrong wrong.
She was force fed while sick she was clearly not feeling better and did not choose to starve herself to death again once she was healed.that is exactly what i said i did not have a problem with but you have failed to understand again so here is my quote on the issue.
Keyword here in my own quote is better which the girl obviously wasnt! If she is better an decides she wants to die why should she not have the freedom to die? Wanting to die is mental illness now is it? there are perfectly rational and sane people who want to die for various reasons.Judging by your response and obvious morals on the issues i honestly cannot blame people for wanting a quick exit from humanity at times.You cannot even offer up a response about force feeding prisoners which is what im talking about and not a sick little 14 year old girl.All you have done is dodge the question and offered up this gem of a quote.
What does this even mean? Is it supposed to be an answer or something lol? Could you please state a response to the reason why the USA are force feeding prisoners? If it is not punishment then i do not know what is.they want to keep them on this earth so they can rot in jail.How can you even argue that fact? And stop dodging the question and dragging the discussion to a little girl thanks.
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Oh you like paragraphs. Fine here we go. In your first sentence you immediately attempt a personal attack rather than make a valid point. Not a good start.
You reply by quoting my post: specifically the part about ReW. You said she was force fed when sick - she was not. She had treatment against her will. Why are you talking about force feeding in a case that it was not involved in? The pertinence of that case was in testing the rights of the individual against the obligations of the state when it is unclear whether the individual has the full capacity to make their own decisions. Same as for the Judge Fraser ruling which you also misapplied.
People should have the freedom to die - I strongly believe this - but only when they have made the decision with a sound and open mind and with the full knowledge of possibility. Something that can not be said for mental health patients, children who fail the Fraser threshold, etc.
So lose the attitude and the personal insults, stop quoting cases out of context they were presented in or are relevant for, etc ... also Mos Def his reaction - any opinion or just more rant?
You reply by quoting my post: specifically the part about ReW. You said she was force fed when sick - she was not. She had treatment against her will. Why are you talking about force feeding in a case that it was not involved in? The pertinence of that case was in testing the rights of the individual against the obligations of the state when it is unclear whether the individual has the full capacity to make their own decisions. Same as for the Judge Fraser ruling which you also misapplied.
People should have the freedom to die - I strongly believe this - but only when they have made the decision with a sound and open mind and with the full knowledge of possibility. Something that can not be said for mental health patients, children who fail the Fraser threshold, etc.
So lose the attitude and the personal insults, stop quoting cases out of context they were presented in or are relevant for, etc ... also Mos Def his reaction - any opinion or just more rant?
What case no one has mentioned a case here the only mention of the little girl was from Minstadave asking about a 14 year old anorexic.I am taking it this is from some other part of the forum and you are quoting a real life case of some little girl who was force fed or something.
You jumped in and started on about someone called Judge frasier who i have no idea who the hell that is or this little girl if she is real or fake.you have literally started talking about this little girl from no where when i told you my views on the topic and told you not to discuss it again as it has nothing to do with Mos def or the Guantamo issue.And i did state my views on the video actually if you take the time to read again thanks.And i hardly call it a rant when i stated my views on something linked to the mos def video.Why else did mos def make the video then? Oh yea he made the video so people could talk about his reaction, no he made the video to highlight the issues of force feeding prisoners which i stated in my rant as you like to call it.
Now you have jumped back on this little girl again and how she was force fed or something honestly mate you are frying my head and are making no sense at all.I already stated my views on force feeding a little girl and its so off topic that im just going to stop replying.Everything you asked of me is in my previous posts.
I agreed with this before your last post so again just what the hell are you talking about? the thread is about guantamo not some jibberish about frasier acts or a little girl.im stopping here BTW as you make no sense to me and i think you are just out to troll on purpose.If there was an ignore function on OCUK you would be the first person in maybe ten years or more of using OCUK that i would want to put on that list.Infact i probably wont visit the forum for a month after this discussion.I came in here and gave a decent reply on why force feeding in guantamo was wrong and managed to get sucked into an arguement about some little girl by yourself and that other person.Honestly i think i might actually start starving myself thats how much of a downer you have put me on with your confusing mish-mash of an arguement.And you still have not answered my question about force feeding a prisoner and the reasons behind it in Guantamo?
#headfrying
You jumped in and started on about someone called Judge frasier who i have no idea who the hell that is or this little girl if she is real or fake.you have literally started talking about this little girl from no where when i told you my views on the topic and told you not to discuss it again as it has nothing to do with Mos def or the Guantamo issue.And i did state my views on the video actually if you take the time to read again thanks.And i hardly call it a rant when i stated my views on something linked to the mos def video.Why else did mos def make the video then? Oh yea he made the video so people could talk about his reaction, no he made the video to highlight the issues of force feeding prisoners which i stated in my rant as you like to call it.
Now you have jumped back on this little girl again and how she was force fed or something honestly mate you are frying my head and are making no sense at all.I already stated my views on force feeding a little girl and its so off topic that im just going to stop replying.Everything you asked of me is in my previous posts.
I agreed with this before your last post so again just what the hell are you talking about? the thread is about guantamo not some jibberish about frasier acts or a little girl.im stopping here BTW as you make no sense to me and i think you are just out to troll on purpose.If there was an ignore function on OCUK you would be the first person in maybe ten years or more of using OCUK that i would want to put on that list.Infact i probably wont visit the forum for a month after this discussion.I came in here and gave a decent reply on why force feeding in guantamo was wrong and managed to get sucked into an arguement about some little girl by yourself and that other person.Honestly i think i might actually start starving myself thats how much of a downer you have put me on with your confusing mish-mash of an arguement.And you still have not answered my question about force feeding a prisoner and the reasons behind it in Guantamo?
#headfrying
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Then I suggest you stop as you quite clearly have issues: anxiety, flight of thought, etc. I think you should be worried about your state of mind, if I were you, than prisoners who are 1000's of miles away.
In future if you don't understand something don't presume - ask - people may explain it to you. Insulting people never really helps. But seriously see your GP.