Homeschooling - Thoughts as a parent or child with experience?

[LateX'Dog]

Maybe they were just expressing their creative freedom and refusing to be confined by the bounds of a dogmatic rigid educational process?

Thing is my wife loves that type of work. If someone comes at a project with a curve ball, she's talking about it for hours.

 

[Egon]

* They struggle socially:

This could be down to them being used to a different type of social structure. Being in a polite, non hectic life with more support, to be thrust into public school life is a shock.

* They struggle with the demands of an organised day & * They struggle with the demands of an A-level course.:

Home schooling isn't organised to the degree public schools are, this is quite a obvious problem. They are used to different less structured learning.

* They struggle massively with independence both on an academic and personal level:

This is a personal one i think, support from parents to self learn would help with independence in academia. With regards to personal independence i guess its how the parents raise their child.

Not implying its better, just offering an alternative perspective. You see it as a problem, yet it might actually be just different. I like Blue, you like Green.

My point on this topic is always the same. They would better if they experienced both. School teaching and good parental support at home. You shouldn't have one without the other unless there is a very good reason for it.

 

[LateX'Dog]

OK, so you're telling me...

The reports from these pupils (who have 4x A's at A-level, and even some with straight A's didn't get on!) were not up to the standard of the course requirements...?

4 x A's...arguably the most elite youngsters in the country...couldn't write a basic report that your wife, their teacher, set them? Call me insane, but maybe it has something to do with the teaching...?

My wife didn't teach them, just marked their work.

Yes the reports where not up to standard.

 

[zoomee]

Obvious troll but for the record it's this kind of attitude that is the biggest problem in my job. It's depressing how many parents I come across who don't care what goes on with their child's education. It's no coincidence that it is those kids who lack discipline and organisation.

Education starts in the home, not at school.

Whilst I agree with you bud - that there's parents out there that don't give a crap and should be ashamed of themselves. I'm also at the same time in awe at how much parents are expected to teach their child at home (it's homework basically) right from year 1 onwards.

What happened to allowing kids to be kids (I'm talking pressure applied unduly at a super young age) - their gunna spend most of their lives studying then working till death, its not fair on the poor little blighters.

Obviously it changes as they hit junior years onwards but at a young age theres too much pressure.

 

[zoomee]

My point on this topic is always the same. They would better if they experienced both. School teaching and good parental support at home. You shouldn't have one without the other unless there is a very good reason for it.

The average parent is forced to be out there giving it their all working working working - materialism mate - its gotta be funded somehow. In turn something's got to give. Unfortunatly its usually the time and attention parents can give their kids.

We buy them the latest toys/ipads to keep them busy then wonder why they have no social skills lol

 

[Nitefly]

2:2 is arguably classed as a fail.

That's nonsense.

 

[Xordium]

I never saw the scripts, she told me about them. Don't try and turn this around into some bull legal crap, every single academic I've met or spoke to all talk about it. So don't come to me pretending its some kind of neglect.

I never said you saw the papers I said and I quote;

allowing you access to work that you had no tangible reason for seeing or knowing about?.

So you backed up my assertion then got all uppity. I also never said it was neglect that is what you do to animals and in child protection cases. I said 'breach of confidentiality' and you've just admitted (again) she did it!

 

[anything I don't mind]

I think its easy to generalize but realy schools are massively different. Even schools down the road from each other can make or break your childs life. Its also easy to send your child to school over home schooling. Not only do you not have to teach them which is a lot of work and impossible to do if you both work. But when they fail and drop out and do nothing with their lives as a parent you can place the blame on the school system and everything else other than take responsibility. What unschooling does is put the responsibility on the child from a very young age, which is definitely not going to work for everyone especially in uk culture where parents often have no personal responsibility themselves.

In effect the modern school system has become an expensive day care that lasts up till the children are in their teens.

 

[Xordium]

That's nonsense.

2:2 Nitefly

 

[LateX'Dog]

I never said you saw the papers I said and I quote;



So you backed up my assertion then got all uppity. I also never said it was neglect that is what you do to animals and in child protection cases. I said 'breach of confidentiality' and you've just admitted (again) she did it!

And so does the entire university, why are you shocked by this?

Seriously, i've been at a meal with 6 other academics and they are all discussing the work they are marking and how bad it is.

I went to a wedding last year in Reading, where 2 of the worlds most prolific professors in their field where there. they where bitching like crazy about their students and the work they mark.

So don't come at me with the moral high ground. You know nothing.

 

[Skeptic]

I think its easy to generalize but realy schools are massively different. Even schools down the road from each other can make or break your childs life. Its also easy to send your child to school over home schooling. Not only do you not have to teach them which is a lot of work and impossible to do if you both work. But when they fail and drop out and do nothing with their lives as a parent you can place the blame on the school system and everything else other than take responsibility. What unschooling does is put the responsibility on the child from a very young age, which is definitely not going to work for everyone especially in uk culture where parents often have no personal responsibility themselves.

It is 'not going to work for everyone' because there are robust, established, evidence based, long-standing and 'proven' methods that, in the main, 'work' for children and young people engaged in learning. Not all - not by a long shot - but a very high percentage.

Unless you have a very specific reason to require alternative education, then it's generally unwise: unless, like has been mentioned before, you are a parent who is aware about all that is needed to fulfill a child's educational experience - those parents can make a good attempt at homeschooling.

Unschooling strikes me as suitable for those who are very rich or very naive: both of whom are unaware of the value of education in the typical way.

 

[Destination]

GD

Home of the UK's finest scholars.

I will take onboard the social concerns but how many of you have been home schooled?

I am aware of four familes who have home schooled their children, some have many children( at least seven and still breeding), one family has just two. They are for the most part assertive children, and indeed distinctly odd. Its a bizarre mix of emotional return from them. Several utterly incapable of seeing blood without collapsing, proper psychological issues, most unable to sit for periods of time.
Quite happy to question anything out to them, which in some circles might be admirable, but timing and appropriateness is completely lacking.

It might be the families involved, but oddness emminates from them.

 

[Xordium]

And so does the entire university, why are you shocked by this?

Seriously, i've been at a meal with 6 other academics and they are all discussing the work they are marking and how bad it is.

I went to a wedding last year in Reading, where 2 of the worlds most prolific professors in their field where there. they where bitching like crazy about their students and the work they mark.

So don't come at me with the moral high ground. You know nothing.

I am sorry you feel that way but I think most people on here would say I know rather a lot - they may also say I am an annoying **** - but they'd be right on that one too.

I would also point out that poor practice is poor practice whether it is widely occurring or not. And for the record when I lectured at university I never discussed a student's papers outside of the circle that was responsible for them because talk like that (in closed shops) is unfair and potentially leads to poor judgement and prejudice against whole year groups or individuals.

And more so when it is just to a partner who then blurts it onto the internet because if what you are saying is true we could narrow down your wife's course quite quickly and then we could easily find the requisite group - hardly rocket science if we were so inclined.

 

[Xordium]

Don't say that! Now he's going to wheel out his 'one mark off a first ' story .

I was only joking - from Nitefly's posts I would always wager him a 1st student and if he wasn't I would be sure he could give us some good stories about what he was doing other than studying.

 

[LateX'Dog]

I would also point out that poor practice is poor practice whether it is widely occurring or not. And for the record when I lectured at university I never discussed a student's papers outside of the circle that was responsible for them because talk like that (in closed shops) is unfair and potentially leads to poor judgement and prejudice against whole year groups or individuals.

Then you must have been the best lecturer. Well done

 

[Egon]

Whilst I agree with you bud - that there's parents out there that don't give a crap and should be ashamed of themselves. I'm also at the same time in awe at how much parents are expected to teach their child at home (it's homework basically) right from year 1 onwards.

What happened to allowing kids to be kids (I'm talking pressure applied unduly at a super young age) - their gunna spend most of their lives studying then working till death, its not fair on the poor little blighters.

Obviously it changes as they hit junior years onwards but at a young age theres too much pressure.

Oh, you are absolutely right. But that's another problem entirely and not one that is going to change any time soon either. At that age learning should be all about having fun, kids love learning at that age. Fortunately they are blissfully unaware of all the bull**** assessment that is going on around them.

The average parent is forced to be out there giving it their all working working working - materialism mate - its gotta be funded somehow. In turn something's got to give. Unfortunatly its usually the time and attention parents can give their kids.

We buy them the latest toys/ipads to keep them busy then wonder why they have no social skills lol

I understand that, it's not the average parent that is the problem. It's those that carry the title of parent but fail to understand its meaning.

 

[LateX'Dog]

I understand that, it's not the average parent that is the problem. It's those that carry the title of parent but fail to understand its meaning.

Very powerful statement that. Completely agree with it.

 

[Xordium]

Then you must have been the best lecturer. Well done

No sarcasm needed, I was merely following the obligations I signed when I took on the role. I suspect your wife did the same. What is her excuse for breaching the confidentiality of her students and did she give you permission to put that detail on such a public forum. Moreover, did she consider the possibility that there may be a student (from such a non-generic course and therefore identifiable) on these forums that may have felt being tarred with that brush was both unfair and unrepresentative of their personal work?

 

[anything I don't mind]

It is 'not going to work for everyone' because there are robust, established, evidence based, long-standing and 'proven' methods that, in the main, 'work' for children and young people engaged in learning. Not all - not by a long shot - but a very high percentage.

Unless you have a very specific reason to require alternative education, then it's generally unwise: unless, like has been mentioned before, you are a parent who is aware about all that is needed to fulfill a child's educational experience - those parents can make a good attempt at homeschooling.

Unschooling strikes me as suitable for those who are very rich or very naive: both of whom are unaware of the value of education in the typical way.

Education has value, it is because education has value that people home school their children. Usually people that home school their children want more for their children than what is available to them in the school system. (well that is their justification for it, even if it turns out not to be the case) Sure there are going to be some people who bring up their children and don't teach them near as much as they should, because they are christian for example and only taught them about the bible. There is that risk to say society as a whole. But i think they give home schooling a bad name in general. When i think of home school child i used to think of over shielded and geeky children with no social skills but that does not have to be the case. If the parents are a bit odd and they home school their child and don't expose them to more people then they are going to be odd like that.

What do children learn coming out of school though? They are certainly taught at school, well the claim is that they are taught at school all the content that is required for them to pass the year. I find that is rarely the case any way, I remember some teachers i had would sometimes not bother teaching us anything as we were just too restless and would not listen. We would go in to tests with only a few lessons on the subjects. I don't know if that is the same for more people? I did have some good teachers and did learn at school. But i said it depends on the school a lot. I think i would end up moving house to near a good school if i was unable to homeschool. Maybe even a combination of private tutor home school and high school or something like that.

 

[[FnG]magnolia]

This might not be a route we want to go down. Whilst I find LateX'Dog's views of the world at odds with my own and his reliance on his wife's achievements and capabilities self-belittling and jarring, they are after all just his opinion.

Should his wife be sharing this level of detail with him? No.

Let's get back to the larger discussion, gents.

e: should have quoted. This was in response to post #204