This is about money. Nothing more.
Windows 7 x64 vs. windows 8.1
- Thread starter sashkris
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This is about money. Nothing more.
You do have a point about changing habits and information but I don't think that removes the arguments for the model used in Windows 95>7 it may indicate a need to change and enhance that model and that for some people that model may no longer be relevant. For many people though Windows 8 certainly isn't the answer to that.
I can't even remember the last time I looked at the start screen on my Windows 8 tablet - all that is on it is the desktop tile, alarms (which is occasionally useful and about the only thing not so easily replicated in the desktop) and a weather tile which I haven't really bothered with but is sometimes useful if I don't have my phone to hand.
I don't bother with push email/notifications myself, I'd rather find out when I choose to check my inbox, likewise for parcel tracking I click the link in my inbox from the email tab in my browser and/or send the relevant information to my phone if needed - I never track them from my desktop, weather would be useful but I'd rather that was just a live tile on the start menu which would fully fulfil my needs there and much better than moving entirely over to a start screen.
Netflix wise I often either pull the tab out my browser and have something on in the corner of my screen or on a 2nd screen or move entirely to a larger screen/projector away from any desktop environment.
You're making life hard for yourself, you should give it a try.
Opening up websites really is a faff, when theirs a far easier and better way of doing it.
And I can never understand the argument, of my phone does xyz, do you really put one device down and pick up the other, when pressing the windows key, brings all this up. It's just mindboggling, people say that. You aren't the only one, several have said they do that with emails, so aren't interested in email app. As well as it being far easier to read/wrote emails in large screens.
Opening up websites really is a faff, when theirs a far easier and better way of doing it.
And I can never understand the argument, of my phone does xyz, do you really put one device down and pick up the other, when pressing the windows key, brings all this up. It's just mindboggling, people say that. You aren't the only one, several have said they do that with emails, so aren't interested in email app. As well as it being far easier to read/wrote emails in large screens.
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Its always open as a tab in my browser and logged in until normal session expiry (usually months) no faff at all. (Aside from one account that is used for more critical stuff which I log into manually every time and that is done that way for a reason).
No, I have to agree with Glaucus here. Just because they're giving users options back because they complained loudly, doesn't mean they're gutting metro. The start page is still there, the live tiles are all there, and so on. All they've done is change how you access it. Metro is still metro, and it is still there - you can just avoid it easier now if you don't like it.
Doesn't fit the word 'gutting' at all.
Btw to say some of us are simply opposed to change is not accurate. I loved the jump lists and changes to the taskbar in 7 (pinning icons, no text, etc). It was a great change but not a major one.
Now I'm not going to say that the win7 UI couldn't be improved further, or that a completely new UI couldn't be better. What I am saying is that win8 isn't it. I don't dislike win8 because it's new and different, but because I found the new features to be worse than the features they replaced.
And I don't think the desktop needs "apps" like a mobile/tablet has. Why the heck you'd want a Facebook/Twitter app and a YouTube app for you desktop I have no idea. Just open your browser and you're pretty much there already. And why would you want those already useless apps to take up your entire screen is even more puzzling. I hardly run anything full screen! There's a good reason we've been able to move and resize windows for literally decades now - and yet they suddenly thought we'd give that up for Metro?
Now I'm not going to say that the win7 UI couldn't be improved further, or that a completely new UI couldn't be better. What I am saying is that win8 isn't it. I don't dislike win8 because it's new and different, but because I found the new features to be worse than the features they replaced.
And I don't think the desktop needs "apps" like a mobile/tablet has. Why the heck you'd want a Facebook/Twitter app and a YouTube app for you desktop I have no idea. Just open your browser and you're pretty much there already. And why would you want those already useless apps to take up your entire screen is even more puzzling. I hardly run anything full screen! There's a good reason we've been able to move and resize windows for literally decades now - and yet they suddenly thought we'd give that up for Metro?
Most people aren't against the GUI changing - they are against changes that aren't an evolution of a model that is the optimal way to work with the OS for many users - Glaucus makes a valid point in that with the changes to the information age to some extent that model becomes outdated or irrelevant to some users but the the original reasons for that model haven't entirely gone away and in many cases are as true today as they were 20 years ago. So any OS that arbitrarily moves to a model that doesn't have some evolution of or facilitation for that model which is optimal for many users is a failure for many users even if it isn't for everyone.
I kind of hope the mockups someone did of "Windows 9" are somewhere close to the truth as it showed the start menu able to be scaled and customised all the way from a simple menu, to adding live information, scaling it up to take up more of the screen as needed i.e. tabbed simple apps like a calculator or even all the way upto the full fullscreen experience for those who wanted that and/or on tablets and maybe in the future phones. I kind of like the idea that in the future my phone could have the "start menu" scaled to fullscreen with phone like features and apps as used as a phone, plug it into a dock (with monitor, keyboard, mouse, etc.) and have it scale down to a start menu for the full desktop experience from the same device.
Its kind of funny that many OSes originated many decades ago in something that isn't that unlike metro - minus live tiles and some other technical constraints of the time - people seem to have forgotten the reasons why the start menu model evolved and that it didn't happen by accident or because MS suddenly decided one day to make it like that for some random reason.
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Failure is relative to user in question,end of the day every OS comes and goes regardless of good or bad OS,the key thing for Microsoft is to try and improve a modern OS like Win8 that allows users to use all their hardware,Win7 was probably the last desktop OS IMHO,making a desktop OS is a lot easier then making a hybrid OS that covers it all from scratch like with Win8 so give them time.
As to Start Menu,probably best option it to give users both,Linux still has some of the best Start Menus for desktop OS IMHO.
Regardless in what they do you always get some users not liking this or that or hating something,one thing I've learned a long time again since DOS days.
I can see why Microsoft wanted a new modern OS,to be honest Win95 to Win7 OS and GUI is a very dated design,you can argue it works great for you but it does not work great for all hardware or even all people hence a new OS was needed.
I feel Win8 is like a new Win95 ie going to take awhile to evolve again ,users can be impatient and a lot don't like change they want that perfect OS or something they are used to now.
Let me know when you find that perfect OS because I have yet to find it even on my favourite Linux distros.
Kind of ironic me defending Microsoft being a Linux fan,only PC gaming keeps me on Windows.
Anyway Win9 should be mk2 of hybrid OS for Windows,so only way is up for them to keep improving a good OS like Win8.
Having said all that I've used Microsoft since DOS days and hated Windows back then but grown to like it from Win95 to 8(except WinME),Win9 will be no different for me because end of the day they are all simple to use,sure redesign here change there but something I see all the time on Linux.
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Is Windows 8.1 really worth the bother....my experience.
Wanted to update my wife's XP desktop and my superb but mechanically failed FS Vista gaming laptop.
Wanted Windows 7 but my PC builder insisted/persuaded us to have Windows 8.1.
We went for two desktops as we are both gamers and we do have a small Windows 7 laptop for mobile use.
Collected them both and spent a couple of casual days setting them up and adding the many programmes that we use.
A printer and a scanner only have 'Basic Drivers' but it's not too much of a problem.
After a month we are both perfectly happy with our machines (aren't SSDs fantastic!).
If I was a lot younger I could have set them up in a couple of hours be we are both well over 70 so life is a bit slower nowadays
Wanted to update my wife's XP desktop and my superb but mechanically failed FS Vista gaming laptop.
Wanted Windows 7 but my PC builder insisted/persuaded us to have Windows 8.1.
We went for two desktops as we are both gamers and we do have a small Windows 7 laptop for mobile use.
Collected them both and spent a couple of casual days setting them up and adding the many programmes that we use.
A printer and a scanner only have 'Basic Drivers' but it's not too much of a problem.
After a month we are both perfectly happy with our machines (aren't SSDs fantastic!).
If I was a lot younger I could have set them up in a couple of hours be we are both well over 70 so life is a bit slower nowadays
Man of Honour
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Over 70 and gamers? Now that's impressive...
I'm interested in what types of games you play?
Whats impressive is 70 year olds more open and learning to adapt than some teenagers/20/30 year olds who freak out from change. Who are still whining and bitching about it nearly two years down the road.
Appears the older generation have more of the mindset of a true younger generation. Yet the generation today are acting like cranky lazy miserable people. The too long didn't read generation of today.
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We both play 1st person shooters.
Never play online.
J started around Tomb Raider 1 (Plus some of 'my' games) and she has played them all, started TR 2013 a few days ago.
I play COD, all the Half Life versions, Far Cry, MOH and many others...currently playing 'Alice Madness returns'. American McGee's Alice was one of my first games.
Because we are older and patient (!) we tend to wait a year or two before buying...this means plenty of reviews, bug fixes and one third the price...or less.
We still have our original Vic 20
All your post is really saying is "I like Win8 and I think everyone else should too."
At least the anti-8 crowd are being more reasonable. We have no problem that some people like win8, but there are a number of reasons why we don't.
To sum it all up as being "anti-change" is to utterly ignore everything people have been saying in this thread and others.
Caporegime
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Indeed. It's very autistic in here.
Considering I'm on OS X 99.9% of the time and use Windows 7 from time to time. Then occasionally dual boot to Windows 8. As well as another computer using Windows 8.
I don't see whats so hard being adaptable.
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Man of Honour
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And that is your problem. You don't see things from other people's perspective. I can accept some like Windows 8, what I don't accept is some idiots who preach to other people that because they don't like it they are inadaptable to change and there is something very wrong with them.
It's pathetic.
We both play 1st person shooters.
Never play online.
J started around Tomb Raider 1 (Plus some of 'my' games) and she has played them all, started TR 2013 a few days ago.
I play COD, all the Half Life versions, Far Cry, MOH and many others...currently playing 'Alice Madness returns'. American McGee's Alice was one of my first games.
Because we are older and patient (!) we tend to wait a year or two before buying...this means plenty of reviews, bug fixes and one third the price...or less.
We still have our original Vic 20
First person shooters eh? Nice choice.
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It's funny I have heard this since XP days when 2K fans argued over WinXP(many threads on that back then in other forums),times don't change much do they?
Also take into account some Win8 fans are ex Win7 users like myself,I also enjoyed Win7,Vista,XP etc so where does that leave me?
You can bet Win9 will get some stick for some of those same users.
At least Linux users are more mature and open minded IMHO.
Roll on Win9 looking forward to that and some of the crappy remarks from some users
.For many its not about adapting - I understood how to use and was comfortable functioning with Windows 8 within minutes of picking it up but Windows 7 is still more suited to how I use the OS and provides for a more efficient experience for me - that start menu model didn't happen by accident or stick around so long by accident.
If you look at really early versions of Windows, Amiga OS, common *nix desktops/WMs, etc. many were originally closer to Windows 8 in style than Windows 95, if you look at popular 3rd party modifications for Windows 3.xx, later versions of Amiga OS, RISC OS and linux distros, etc. around the time leading upto Windows 95 you will find horizontal taskbars, start type menus, etc. were becoming a leading feature before Windows 95 was even released.
And while things have moved on and maybe for an increasing number of users that model is no long adequate or just boring also for many users that is exactly what they want and need from an OS, or an evolution of that and anything else is irrelevant.
I started back then on Commodore 64/Amiga ,Sinclair Spectrum etc,my first Microsoft OS was DOS (which I liked)and I hated Windows ,I really did,but when DOS was phased out decades ago out I accepted it and adapted to Windows and moved on,so it works both ways.