Airbags and MOT

Admiral Huddy

Admiral Huddy

Admiral Huddy

Man of Honour
Joined
17 Feb 2003
Posts
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Location
Chelmsford
We bought an old Renault Clio from a local car dealer for my daughter’s first car just to get her started. It was sold with a new MOT, mechanical checks to confirm the car was in safe condition and a 3 month mech warranty. The HP check came back clean so all seemed good. Putting faith in the dealer, I thought this would be safer bet than going private. For the interest of my daughters safety, I got the cambelt, brakes and tyres replaced at my own choice.

A few weeks later, the car broke down which happens and fair enough it wasn't anything serious but we noticed the airbag light had come on. The RAC guy said we should get that checked so I took it in to reputable local garage that ran a diagnostic check which came up that the car had been involved in an accident, so it maybe the airbag light comes on and off intermittently.
The garage said it shouldn't have passed the MOT as according to new laws. If a car is fitted with an air bag then it must be in fully working order otherwise it will fail.

Question, would an MOT pick up a failed airbag even if the airbag warning light was off? i.e would they have run a diagnostic check as standard.?
In which case, would an MOT advise that the car had been in any incident which caused the airbag to be replaced at some point?


So as it stands the car isn't roadworthy and will cost Around £600-£800 to replace the airbag circuity.

Thanks
 
Pretty sure the MOT basically only checks if the airbag light comes on and then goes off correctly when the ignition is switched on, they don't conduct any thorough investigation.

If it's within 3 months however, it should be covered by both the 3 month warranty and SOGA.
 
The MOT test would fail if the airbag warning light was on, or if the airbag is clearly missing. If the warning light isn't on (and it comes on and goes off as part of the startup test), and the dashboard / steering wheel looks intact, then it'll appear fine to the tester.
 
Haggisman said:
If it's within 3 months however, it should be covered by both the 3 month warranty and SOGA.
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The warranty should cover the airbag fault you're right, but I'm not sure the OP would have much comeback under the SOGA.

Essentially for the first 6 months the onus is on the trader to prove that the fault didn't exist when the car was sold. With something like the airbag which has a warning light, and the fact the MOT checks that the warning light as part of the test, the trader can quite easily prove that the fault wasn't there when they sold the car.
 
scratch said:
The warranty should cover the airbag fault you're right, but I'm not sure the OP would have much comeback under the SOGA.

Essentially for the first 6 months the onus is on the trader to prove that the fault didn't exist when the car was sold. With something like the airbag which has a warning light, and the fact the MOT checks that the warning light as part of the test, the trader can quite easily prove that the fault wasn't there when they sold the car.
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I would think the opposite. If it's true that the car has been involved in an accident prior to the OP purchasing it then it's quite likely that this is what caused the intermittent airbag fault.

In this case it's pretty obvious that the fault WAS present when the car was sold.
 
What about the fact the OP wasnt made aware of the history of the car? And due to the previous accident this fault is present?
 
Do you have the details of the fault causing the airbag light to come on ? A lot of older cars are going to have some form of accident repair it doesn't mean it is causing the airbag fault.

Clio's aren't exactly known for quality electrics it is a common fault for wiring faults under the seats causing the airbag light to come on.
 
Some good info there chaps . thanks. Tis helps a lot..


Haggisman said:
I would think the opposite. If it's true that the car has been involved in an accident prior to the OP purchasing it then it's quite likely that this is what caused the intermittent airbag fault.

In this case it's pretty obvious that the fault WAS present when the car was sold.
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When I had the car serviced the day after we picked it it, up we got a free MOT as part of the service. He wrote down the air bag light was goimg on as an advisory and that is was nothing to worry about. Again, why would i not trust his judgement given i know nothing about cars..

It was only when we got a second opinion and after the RAC took a look that we realised this wasn't the case. So we have written down that the light was "on" the day after we she picked it up.


Diagro said:
What about the fact the OP wasnt made aware of the history of the car? And due to the previous accident this fault is present?
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He'll protest this until he's blue in the face.. we just wanted to make sure we get our fact together before making the trip to see him.

is it worth contacting VOSA or DVSA as it is now?


I feel pretty **** right now that i've let my daughter down and i should have done more.


I friend of mine is a car nut and said, tbh, he probably wouldn't have done anything different than what i already did..


I appreciate the help guys. thanks

edit

Dangerous Dave said:
Do you have the details of the fault causing the airbag light to come on ? A lot of older cars are going to have some form of accident repair it doesn't mean it is causing the airbag fault.

Clio's aren't exactly known for quality electrics it is a common fault for wiring faults under the seats causing the airbag light to come on.
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I don't no. As far as i know, it just failed the diagnostic check and said they would normally replace the whole motherboard circuitry as standard.
 
Admiral Huddy said:
When I had the car serviced the day after we picked it it, up we got a free MOT as part of the service. He wrote down the air bag light was goimg on as an advisory and that is was nothing to worry about. Again, why would i not trust his judgement given i know nothing about cars..
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Is the fact the airbag light is going on actually on the MOT certificate as an advisory?! Pretty sure that should be a failure.(I may be wrong here)

If it is on the MOT certificate, then IMO you have a pretty watertight case against the dealer with regards to the fault being present at the time of purchase, and in fact the tester should possibly be reported to VOSA if the car should have failed the MOT.
 
Diagro said:
What about the fact the OP wasnt made aware of the history of the car? And due to the previous accident this fault is present?
Click to expand...

Unless the OP specifically asked if the car had been in an accident before purchase, there is no requirement for the trader to reveal that information. The trader may not even have been aware.
 
An airbag light will be illuminated when there is a fault and will normally extinguish itself if the fault disappears. Airbag lights coming on intermittently will almost certainly be a loose connection somewhere and/or an exposed wire shorting.

When I bought my car it had an airbag light come on and off and since I had the proper diagnostic software I was able to narrow it down that the fault appeared when I opened the drivers door, the side airbags. I had a look at the wad of cabling running coming out of the door and to the car and found one cable had a very small exposed part which was touching the body work and shorting when I opened the door causing the fault. Bit of electrical tape and I've never seen it again.

Other common airbag loose connections are under the front seats. Give stuff a fiddle and if you can't track it down get the fault codes read to see which airbag is causing the fault.
 
Haggisman said:
Is the fact the airbag light is going on actually on the MOT certificate as an advisory?! Pretty sure that should be a failure.(I may be wrong here)

If it is on the MOT certificate, then IMO you have a pretty watertight case against the dealer with regards to the fault being present at the time of purchase, and in fact the tester should possibly be reported to VOSA if the car should have failed the MOT.
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Googling around at some articles I've been reading, it's a fairly new law and is causing some confusion with testers it seems.

scratch said:
Unless the OP specifically asked if the car had been in an accident before purchase, there is no requirement for the trader to reveal that information. The trader may not even have been aware.
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Agreed and hence my question in the OP.

It might be his fault but the car was supplied with a new MOT which may have not been valid.


This is quite useful.

9. If the vehicle you sell is not of 'satisfactory quality', the customer is legally entitled to a number of possible remedies, which may include a full refund or a repair or replacement vehicle.
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from SOGA.
 
My old clio (03) reg that I've just recently sold had a dodgy airbag light that came on intermittently and like others above have mentioned it is common place for the fault to be from the under the passenger seat and a block of connectors.
Mine would come on and could randomly go back off again from knocking a pot hole however other times it would stay on until I wiggled some of said connectors. Although the light could come on at least once every week at one point it then could also not come on for months. This can link to how I read that it can become more troublesome if someone has recently been moving the seat and especially for 3 door variants.

I found online and was told by me local Indy that the family has used for years that the plastic plugs can be replaced cheaply or you can just cut them out, solder and heat shrink. I'm pretty sure I was also told rather than read it that the other airbags would still fire if they were found to need to just that one may not.
 
In this case the dianostic check found a fault with the unit itself.



Anyway, thanks for the advice guys. Was all very helpful. Long story short.. we took the car back to the dealer who gave us a full refund.
 
Lazy said:
My old clio (03) reg that I've just recently sold had a dodgy airbag light that came on intermittently and like others above have mentioned it is common place for the fault to be from the under the passenger seat and a block of connectors.
Mine would come on and could randomly go back off again from knocking a pot hole however other times it would stay on until I wiggled some of said connectors. Although the light could come on at least once every week at one point it then could also not come on for months. This can link to how I read that it can become more troublesome if someone has recently been moving the seat and especially for 3 door variants.

I found online and was told by me local Indy that the family has used for years that the plastic plugs can be replaced cheaply or you can just cut them out, solder and heat shrink. I'm pretty sure I was also told rather than read it that the other airbags would still fire if they were found to need to just that one may not.
Click to expand...

My 52 plate Clio had the exact same issue, dodgy air bag light, would come on intermittently (usually when the passenger seat was moved/adjusted). Did some googling and found it was a loose connection under the passenger seat, giving the wires a wiggle would turn it off.
 
Orangest said:
My 52 plate Clio had the exact same issue, dodgy air bag light, would come on intermittently (usually when the passenger seat was moved/adjusted). Did some googling and found it was a loose connection under the passenger seat, giving the wires a wiggle would turn it off.
Click to expand...

As above Mr Huddy - Check the wiring under the two front seats. My 54 plated clio had exactly the same problem. Connection cleaned up and it never came on again.
 
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