Latest immigration figures.

LOL remember when the arguments from the no-borders lunatics were all about how people were scare-mongering about the number of people who were going to come over here, whether it was the dodgy study that said only 13k Poles a year would come here, and not that many Bulgarians and Romanians would come because they don't have any ties to the UK like Polish people do.

Why can't you no-borders lunatics admit that you were wrong about the numbers of immigrants and that you're wrong about the benefits of immigration?
 
scorza said:
LOL remember when the arguments from the no-borders lunatics were all about how people were scare-mongering about the number of people who were going to come over here, whether it was the dodgy study that said only 13k Poles a year would come here, and not that many Bulgarians and Romanians would come because they don't have any ties to the UK like Polish people do.

Why can't you no-borders lunatics admit that you were wrong about the numbers of immigrants and that you're wrong about the benefits of immigration?
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It is wrong to suggest it has no benefits, it is correct however to question who it benefits.
 
balky12 said:
I don't feel like that is a pretty fair comparison. However I am looking to be enlightened more than anything.

Say someone from Texas going to New York (two most different states I am aware of (through generalisations)). Is that really that much f a culture shock. Americans are very much 'MERICA!!! trumps all. Extremely patriotic.

I just don't think you can compare that to Estonians, Romanians, Slovenians coming to the UK.

Could be wrong though.
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yes and no

the main difference is cultural... which is why I think a lot of this is rooted in xenophobia

I mean we've still got controlled immigration as far as people from outside the EU are concerned, I don't see uncontrolled immigration within the EU as being too different to uncontrolled immigration within the US... only in the case of the EU there are larger cultural differences - the daily mail readers get all precious about 'their' low skilled jobs being taken and Polish food appearing in the local Tesco
 
Stretch said:
The US doesn't have the internal wealth/opportunity disparity that exists within the EU.
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yes it does

you head of a place called Detroit?

how about New Orleans?

Baltimore? Camden?...


they've got big chunks of the population with barely any access to healthcare aside form the odd community resource and emergency treatment
 
dowie said:
yes and no

the main difference is cultural... which is why I think a lot of this is rooted in xenophobia

I mean we've still got controlled immigration as far as people from outside the EU are concerned
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*Unless they marry a non British EU citizen ;)
 
CREATIVE!11 said:
Yup.

Nail meet head.
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nope...

hjv7jvi.jpg.png
 
balky12 said:
GD hasn't quite grasped there is a middle ground in this. Voicing concerns over immigration doesn't make you a racist. Singing praise about immigration doesn't mean you are a clueless liberal.... but crack on guys!
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This 100%

Having concerns that people of other cultures and backgrounds might impact existing society does not make you racist. The problem is that the media don't want to discuss it like grown ups which is ridiculous because we can easily solve these problems as our rich history has previously shown.
 
dowie said:
yes it does

you head of a place called Detroit?

how about New Orleans?

Baltimore? Camden?...


they've got big chunks of the population with barely any access to healthcare aside form the odd community resource and emergency treatment
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I see where you are coming from. But again I think it might be a slightly uneven comparison. Detroit, your most populous example is ~700,000.

Now let's take the population of any country in the EU that has a big influx into the UK...
 
dowie said:
you head of a place called Detroit?

how about New Orleans?

Baltimore? Camden?...


they've got big chunks of the population with barely any access to healthcare aside form the odd community resource and emergency treatment
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We all know why those places are how they are..
 
The whole debate feels like it's been polarized into an immigration must be good/bad issue.

Immigration effects everyone differently, and while it's net effects might be positive, at a personal level, it depends entirely on your individual circumstances and vested interests.

My personal opinion is immigration has a positive effect on my life, but I can also see how others rightly feel threatened by it, and for perfectly valid reasons in some cases.

I also feel that some aspects of UK life have become overly dependent not just on migration, but a limitless supply of fresh migrants. Clearly this isn't healthy.
 
Moses said:
Make it even better by stopping the ones who aren't a net benefit/make a negligible benefit/whatever (outside of when we want workers to fill worker shortages etc, where there's value there), whilst keeping the super positive migrants. Scoop up the cream of the international worker pool. That'd be even better, right?
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Unlikely. There's three major problems with it: (1) we gain the enormous benefit of free right to live and work in Europe only because of a reciprocal arrangement; (2) it's based on the false premise that people contribute in a constant manner when, in fact, the amount everyone contributes varies with time; and (3) making this country more hostile to immigration is likely to deter beneficial immigrants as well.
 
OldCoals said:
It is wrong to suggest it has no benefits, it is correct however to question who it benefits.
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I don't claim that there are no benefits to immigration, just that the no-borders lunatics are wrong about them e.g. it's pointless saying immigrants are a net gain now when they're working if you ignore the costs of hosting them when they cease to be of useful working age.
 
scorza said:
LOL remember when the arguments from the no-borders lunatics were all about how people were scare-mongering about the number of people who were going to come over here, whether it was the dodgy study that said only 13k Poles a year would come here, and not that many Bulgarians and Romanians would come because they don't have any ties to the UK like Polish people do.

Why can't you no-borders lunatics admit that you were wrong about the numbers of immigrants and that you're wrong about the benefits of immigration?
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Yup.

Like I said.

Sat waiting patiently for it to blow up spectacularly.

dowie said:
yes and no

the main difference is cultural... which is why I think a lot of this is rooted in xenophobia

I mean we've still got controlled immigration as far as people from outside the EU are concerned, I don't see uncontrolled immigration within the EU as being too different to uncontrolled immigration within the US... only in the case of the EU there are larger cultural differences - the daily mail readers get all precious about 'their' low skilled jobs being taken and Polish food appearing in the local Tesco
Click to expand...

Don't you live in Devon in the middle of the sticks or something? goes on about xenophobia but again it doesn't affect you really. You are not a low paid worker living in the inner city. There are not enough low skilled jobs to go around and we have enough people to fill those spots.

It's always classic case of pointing fingers, easy to do when it's not you getting shafted lmao.
 
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CREATIVE!11 said:
You are not a low paid worker living in the inner city. There are not enough low skilled jobs to go around and we have enough people to fill those spots.
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strange how people can come from far off places in the EU and find work then whereas some groups of natives won't even look as far as the next town...

'Get on your bike' as Norman Tebbit said...

there have been plenty of 'immigrants' where I've worked too... only they've tended to be from France, Germany the US etc.. I don't feel threatened by them
 
CREATIVE!11 said:
goes on about xenophobia but again it doesn't affect you really. You are not a low paid worker living in the inner city. There are not enough low skilled jobs to go around and we have enough people to fill those spots.
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Immigration has either no effect on unemployment or a slight positive effect according to the best research. This shouldn't surprise anyone: unemployment rates don't track with population size. On average each person creates enough economic activity to support another person.
 
dowie said:
strange how people can come from far off places in the EU and find work then whereas some groups of natives won't even look as far as the next town...

'Get on your bike' as Norman Tebbit said...
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I'm glad you speak for every British native, are you running for the next election dowie?
 
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