Gender Pay Gap

[Amp34]

I'm still at University but have got a years experience in the field, Civil Engineering, and at uni there seems to be a lot going on encourage girls to become engineers even to the point where they get extra grants and such not available to me and other men JUST because they are female.

Whilst we need to make sure no one is discouraged to take a subject, I don't think the right move is to encourage them like my University does.

Just wait until you get into employment. "Sorry, we are only hiring women at the moment". Unfortunately the "golden skirt" Is a reality in many larger companies in engineering and science disciplines. Unfortunately that trickles up and tars all women with the same brush. "Did that new girl get the job because she was as good as us/best person for the job, or because she was the best woman that applied...?

As mentioned, the issue needs to be dealt with at the early senior school level, to persuade girls to do more physical sciences at A-Level and subsequently STEM subjects at degree level. You're never going to have equal male and female graduates in jobs in certain subjects when only 1/5 of the graduates are women, although remarkably many larger companies do seem to have close to a 50:50 M:F ratio in their graduates...

 

[Scougar]

I think it's horrendous that male adult professionals do not get paid as much as their female counterparts, and even laying down on the job

 

[twist3d0n3]

awaits burnsy with his man feminism.

 

[MrMoonX]

There's a gender gap when it comes to maternity/paternity, the authority I work for will pay a women 90% salary for the first 9 weeks of maternity then 1/2 pay plus statutory maternity for the next 16wks then just the statutory pay. Men for example get two weeks paternity leave paid at statutory minimum, my wife is due any day now and am having to use annual leave as I can't afford to drop to £139pw for two weeks!

Luckily my manager is cool, but it's a very female workplace

 

[alx]

Just wait until you get into employment. "Sorry, we are only hiring women at the moment". Unfortunately the "golden skirt" Is a reality in many larger companies in engineering and science disciplines. Unfortunately that trickles up and tars all women with the same brush. "Did that new girl get the job because she was as good as us/best person for the job, or because she was the best woman that applied...?

As mentioned, the issue needs to be dealt with at the early senior school level, to persuade girls to do more physical sciences at A-Level and subsequently STEM subjects at degree level. You're never going to have equal male and female graduates in jobs in certain subjects when only 1/5 of the graduates are women, although remarkably many larger companies do seem to have close to a 50:50 M:F ratio in their graduates...

This, good post. And as per you're last post I've seen it in a couple of large companies where they hire the same amount of female and male engineering grads each year (multiple years in a row). Seems unlikely that they don't deliberately pick a 50:50 ratio considering how many more male applicants there will be.

 

[Tom0]

I'll just leave this here.

** I'll just remove it due to the swearing **

 

[traveyb]

This, good post. And as per you're last post I've seen it in a couple of large companies where they hire the same amount of female and male engineering grads each year (multiple years in a row). Seems unlikely that they don't deliberately pick a 50:50 ratio considering how many more male applicants there will be.

Completely agree.
I'm totally for a balanced pay and rights however there is a fine line where companies will recruit a woman to hit a target over a male who would be perfect for the job

 

[Diagro]

You can only compare pay between the same roles though.

Admins could be worth more than senior IT techs to the school (schools do seem to under value IT).

The correct comparison would be between a male admin and a female admin with the same resposnibility/role and seniority (assuming the school recognises pay scales).

No males that have applied for admin roles here have been successful.
And I have heard with my own ears why.... a man won't work well in the office full of women, they don't want to change their discussions because a man shouldn't hear them. So they go out of their way to make it so a man can't get the job.

also the silly admin staff are next to the hr and heads offices, so are always seen and very chummy. Where we it bods are in a poky office other side of the school, not seen or heard from unless they need something. And we get paid less for doing a more important job.

when I'm asked to do something I'm expected to have it done that day or within 30 mins.
yet when we ask the admin staff to find a document retaining to an it order it takes weeks. The last time I asked it was 3 months and I had to complain. Then I was given the wrong bloody one and was told I can't have the correct one as they don't have the time to find the right file cus they so busy.

I go down to ask what the hell and find them sitting in a huddle drinking tea and eating biscuits talking about the latest shoes! Like seriously!!!

 

[Blackjack Davy]

No males that have applied for admin roles here have been successful

Thats true, all of the schools I've worked at have female admin staff I've yet to see a male in the job. They're in charge and boy do they make sure you know it too.

 

[dowie]

Thats true, all of the schools I've worked at have female admin staff I've yet to see a male in the job. They're in charge and boy do they make sure you know it too.

you'll tend to find that in a lot of low status roles - if they temporarily have a tiny little bit of power over someone they'll milk it as much as possible

for example our old receptionist at work was super nice to the rest of us in the office - she was essentially the least senior employee, but she was given some responsibility to check up on the cleaners... the way she talked to them - she'd turn into a right little Nazi with them

 

[NickK]

I have no problem with equality.

Pay X + a specified maternity covering to both sexes should they take the time.

I like the say that sweden does it in this instance.

However having lots of kids and spending years away from work on a chain of children isn't productive or fair for the company either.

Personally if I was running a company I would seriously come down on people like a ton of bricks for offering different pay based on if someone's sex. In the end - everyone with kids has todo things like make the school run or deal with those kid-based emergencies.

If you're into a power-infested macho 1980s organisation that doesn't value people - fine, those exist but for me having been around the block a bit I can see the value to people and the resulting value to the company by being more mature about it.

The age old question is this - does offering packages like this discriminate against people that don't have kids? Not really - it's likely that you (if you're in that bracket) may be tempted to focus on career anyway..

 

[balky12]

One of the biggest myths around.

Hell there isn't really 'equality' between men. In my industry underwriters can be paid from anything between ~£50k to well into the 3 figures. Hardly any job and/or person is the same, so how can there be 'equality'? You are paid ultimately what someone thinks you are worth.

Pay bands are ridiculous too. Something HR dremt up. Sooner HR divisions start shrinking and having less power the better.

I am an avid believer in equality, but looking at salaries with such a broad brush is not the way to go about it, or to prove a point.

 

[No1newts]

Salary bands are only adhered to when suits, it's embarassing. My place the band for the management position that I'm in could apparently not be exceeded. Just recruited a new guy with "right experience" on 15k more then the band top level. We only ever found out by mistake because the useless HR **** that keeps talking about pay brackets sent it in an email to everyone by mistake

 

[RDM]

I always see these campaigns to get more women into engineering or computer programming, which is fair enough, but I never see any campaigns to get more men into HR. Just a thought anyway.

You have a better chance of getting on to a Primary teaching course if you are male due to positive discrimination from the training providers.

 

[lafemmefatale]

I'll just leave this here.

Youtube Video

Swearing in video.

It's strange how Milo Yanopopoddoodulus and Gavin McInnes, two of the most obnoxious Katie Hopkins-esque MRA clickbait trolls are cited in this thread. Kinda makes me think another agenda is being pushed here.

FWIW, I work for myself so identity and workplace politics can go spit in the wind.

 

[CREATIVE!11]

woman get preferential treatment and later in life men with a work ethic and hustle take over them (or they get pregnant and take time off work which men also can't be blamed for)? Like student grants in engineering for only female students. How is that fair? lmao. I'm sick of this equality ******** when really it's the other way around I think some days....don't know any places I can get grants for being a man.

Then they complain and shout feminism.

Sounds about right.

There is NO gap, bunch of liberal soft-brained folk keep clinging to the idea because its not about equality its about social minority's being 'more equal'.

All the while ignoring the bigger bloody issue - wage depression by greedy dividend-focused corporations.

Also I wish to note that we need to change the rules regarding pregnancy, as right now you can get hired, have a child within the first bloody year... Really disingenuous to smaller companies, who would thus never bother hiring women ever.

This too. Sorry to offend but at the end of the day money doesn't grow in trees for some of smaller companies they cannot afford to take such a hit. Just because they decide well i'm bored now time to pop out a kid! you better cough up.

That is just not the way life works. I want to become a male stripper.... but I'm not good looking enough. DISCRIMINATION I TELL YOU!!!!! no? it's just the way it is. I don't have a 6pac and an 8 inch dong.

 

[Tom0]

Swearing in video.

It's strange how Milo Yanopopoddoodulus and Gavin McInnes, two of the most obnoxious Katie Hopkins-esque MRA clickbait trolls are cited in this thread. Kinda makes me think another agenda is being pushed here.

FWIW, I work for myself so identity and workplace politics can go spit in the wind.

It's easy just to call people trolls and akin to other people, then go onto mention agenda.

Ah the ironing, or not in this case.

 

[CREATIVE!11]

Secondly, it doesn't at all take a moment to understand how the economic downturn has psychologically effected gender types. Men for example -- stereotypically speaking -- tend to need to feel that they're useful or otherwise needed; it's part of masculinity. To be surplus to requirement, or unneeded (i.e. underemployed or unemployed) can be very psychologically damaging to a man's sense of well-being. Likewise, what about the support that women tend to receive versus men? Men tend to bottle up and are expected to get on with it, whereas women don't have such a pressure and support is more forthcoming. Furthermore, being underemployed can be really detrimental for a man's relationship chances. For women, it's less so.

It's nonsense.

Thoughts?

Men make up 80% of nearly all suicides. Wonder why this is? maybe it's because we don't get a pat on the back and told what a special ********* we are when times are tough. We're told to suck it up and nobody really cares because you don't have a vagina.

 

[Dr Who]

I believe the main reason for this is women leaving work to have raise a family and when coming back they accept lower pay. It is like they ignore all the pay rises they would have had over the last 5 or whatever years and accept marginally more than they were on when they left work. That is sufficient to pull the average down overall.

In addition to the reasons in the article about different jobs that is.

 

[RDM]

Men make up 80% of nearly all suicides. Wonder why this is? maybe it's because we don't get a pat on the back and told what a special ********* we are when times are tough. We're told to suck it up and nobody really cares because you don't have a vagina.

Alternatively it is because it isn't seen as masculine to talk about or show your feelings so men tend to bottle it all up. Those that do express feelings get called special ********** by those that can't.