ISIL, ISIS, Daesh discussion thread.

Combat squirrel said:
1) They said there were WMD's as an excuse to start a war - there were non.
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Well there was an obvious intent, project Babylon and the development of chemical and biological weapons, some of which were used against Iran and the Kurds.

Iran is next, as soon as they secretly progress on making a nuclear weapon, they are going to be wiped out.
2) All control of Eastern oil in wartorn areas is in the hands of western companies.
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Are we supposed to sit around while those oil reserves are used to buy more weapons, or to build stupid holiday homes in the sand?
Sorry but if those cultures don't show any signs of advancement then those resources might as well get used by someone else.
 
bitslice said:
Well there was an obvious intent, project Babylon and the development of chemical and biological weapons, some of which were used against Iran and the Kurds.

Iran is next, as soon as they secretly progress on making a nuclear weapon, they are going to be wiped out.
Are we supposed to sit around while those oil reserves are used to buy more weapons, or to build stupid holiday homes in the sand?
Sorry but if those cultures don't show any signs of advancement then those resources might as well get used by someone else.
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1) Iran/kurds etc have used them for decades and one day they said it was a WMD, out the blue, its horrible yeah but not a WMD, the weapons of the area remains the same now as before.

2) The issue isn't 'them' getting the oil, the issue is those who are now making billions off it are those that gave the order to go to war - Bush et al ........... the family basically used the US military to capture the oil fields for their personal profits..............so messed up, countless have died, the wests civilians paid for it and Bush et al (many powerful families) now extract and sell the oil..........thats just basically an invasion, but as we live in a 'democracy' they had to come up with any excuse to do it otherwise it would just be all out war for no reason *which it was*, they gave no hoots about WMD's, dictators or innocent lives, they just wanted what they now have........
 
Finally some sense from Corbyn as Labour MPs to get free vote on extending UK air strikes against IS into Syria!
 
Buddy said:
This is floating around so I can't verify it's accuracy.
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Utter rubbish fir two reasons. "they always calculate it wrong.
They always calculate like people wouldn't be paid and equipment purchased anyway, which obviously they are.
The extra cost is things like deployment pay, increased ammo cost.
Not starting from scratch and buying everything.

Secondly the money wouldn't go elsewhere. It would just be less borrowing.
 
Glaucus said:
Utter rubbish fir two reasons. "they always calculate it wrong.
They always calculate like people wouldn't be paid and equipment purchased anyway, which obviously they are.
The extra cost is things like deployment pay, increased ammo cost.
Not starting from scratch and buying everything.

Secondly the money wouldn't go elsewhere. It would just be less borrowing.
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But in your own words that equipment still needs replacing once used and we are still talking in the 100 thousands
+
Public cuts are still being made..
 
Combat squirrel said:
I mean really, answer me that, not an insult, not digging at any individual on this forum, but how come no one is answer the following facts:

1) They said there were WMD's as an excuse to start a war - there were non.
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unfortunately they don't have a crystal ball - Saddam was a threat to the region - of course some neo cons simply wanted regime change, it appeared he was developing WMDs still which was enough to make less hawkish politicians convinced that removing him was worth it

at least he was developing WMDs and did have WMDs after then end of the first gulf war and had been happy to use chemical weapons in the past on the Kurds, marsh arabs, Iranians etc.. at some point though he seemingly stopped his weapons program. Relatively few chemical weapons were found in the end, his previous stockpile was suspected to have been shipped to Syria.

2) All control of Eastern oil in wartorn areas is in the hands of western companies.
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no it isn't, this is just one of the standard myths people seem to believe

in fact China buys up half of Iraq's oil, Russia has interests in some fields too, the US interest is small in comparison... yet people still try to pedal the idea that the US invaded to take control of the oil
 
Buddy said:
But in your own words that equipment still needs replacing once used and we are still talking in the 100 thousands
+
Public cuts are still being made..
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That depends on cost of ammunition, they also would still be used in training and most ammunition has a shelf live. So it doesn't automatically mean your buying more, it depends on use rate, compared to peace time training. Now I have no idea what we use, but it doesn't have t be 100,000s per munition. GBU-10 laser guided is more like $20k

And what have public cuts got to do with it? It's wouldn't come from that budget and not doing it would in no way reduce those cuts.

And more importantly, how about just doing it as a global responsibility to humanity.
 
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Glaucus said:
Utter rubbish fir two reasons. "they always calculate it wrong.
They always calculate like people wouldn't be paid and equipment purchased anyway, which obviously they are.
The extra cost is things like deployment pay, increased ammo cost.
Not starting from scratch and buying everything.

Secondly the money wouldn't go elsewhere. It would just be less borrowing.
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The cost sounds roughly correct though. The figures we were given was that for us to be in the air it was about £1000 per min. That was without dropping anything.
 
Dis86 said:
The cost sounds roughly correct though. The figures we were given was that for us to be in the air it was about £1000 per min. That was without dropping anything.
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Yes but planes don't just sit there doing nothing, they replace a lot of the training. so the cost is irrelevant, it's the cost over peace time activity that is the figure you need,
 
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this is brilliant reading

There's something that needs to be mentioned here; Syria.

Look at Syria before this ****** war started. Syria was a very self sufficient country and economy. I don't think they had any debt even. A very fertile country. Their people were very hard working. Their government, though I think were corrupt, gave the people free education, from preschool to university. Their government also always made sure everyone had shelter and food. There was almost no homeless nor starving person. They had equality. People from different backgrounds were allowed to study and work anywhere and even become government officials. Their prices were cheap; from food to clothing to whatever; just not the imported products though, as they wanted their people to not depend on imports and try create everything within. Self sufficient, self sustained. They had great tourism.

All this went to **** right after it was publicized that Syria had substantial amount of Natural Gas, and the government refused a pipeline deal that was supposed to go through Syria from Qatar to Europe or something along them lines. The Syrians from what I read/heard have struck a deal with Russia. The west was neglected. Then what happened? War.

Oh man, what a coincidence.

Look at Syria now. Torn to shreds by the likes of lunatics who call themselves Muslims, and other countries' armies. The death toll has reached over 250,000 people, 30,000 of them children. THIRTY THOUSAND ******G CHILDREN. From ONE country. No one ever heard of these kids. Not one of you heard of them. But it's not your child, so it's ok. No global mass media constantly and repeatedly cries about them. Syria was an extremely safe place. 100+ innocent lives in Paris die and the cries and flags raised everywhere, and governments screaming death to Syria! Governments want to bomb Syrians ever harder. Why no equal treatment there? Murdered innocent civvies are murdered innocent civvies everywhere. Murdered civilians in a specific country doesn't make them any more privileged. A life is a life anywhere.

The hypocrisy is through the stratosphere. The mass media and the world should denounce EVERY crime, not find biased reasons to justify them.

And the refugee numbers? 9 million +. That is a scary number. 9 million people have left their war-torn used-to-be-safe country in a few years. These people left and are leaving horrific scenery for a reason. They want life, not death. These people would much rather have stayed were they were if this war hasn't erupted. They were forced out. And now seeking shelter in safe countries, they are faced with rejection. They can't live in their bloody country, and they're not accepted elsewhere. Where are they supposed to go?

Before any smartass says "Send them to their Arab brothers huehuehue!", there many many of them all over Arab lands. There's around 1 million in tiny Lebanon, another million + in Jordan, more in the Arabian gulf, Egypt, Sudan, Libya, etc. Then there are the ones wanting Europe.

This is just a post in a thread in a forum lost in the internet ocean. And this is just an extremely tiny glimpse, if any, on Syria. I'd want each and everyone of you to try imagine all this, and rid yourself of selective sympathy from the comfort of your couch.

And this is only Syria btw. Now go figure trying to imagine the tons of other countries with ****** situations and innocent people murdered in cold blood and mistreated from the Americas to Europe to Africa to Asia to Oceania. So much to take in; overwhelming and extremely complicated than a simple response to a post.
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