The next Conservative Leader thread.

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Mr Jack said:
Norway would have to apply regulations applying to the e-cigs to e-cigs sold within their country so that German e-cig producers could sell e-cigs made to German standards in Norway but I don't think a ban would apply.
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OK so you're saying that Norway has to abide by EU regulations not only for what it exports to the EU, but also for products made by Norwegian manufacturers that are only sold to Norwegians?

I would have thought they would only have to abide by the EU rules for products being made in Norway destined for EU countries. I can't see why they would have to apply EU regulation on their own companies that sell within their pwn borders. Surely EU directives can't apply to non-EU members?

Let's stick with the e-cig example (because why not), let's say the EU restricted the amount of nicotine you could put in the liquid to 12% and Norway restricted it to, say, 20%. Why would Norway allowing Norwegian liquid makers to make liquid that was 20% that they only sold within their own borders, prevent German liquid makers from importing their 12% liquids into Norway for sale?
 
wildman said:
Technically yes, but then it depends on which parts of the EU legislation they have to actual implement. If the sub paragraph regarding vacuum cleaners was only an advisory to EEA only members and they could chose then they culd hapilly ignore it, if it was something they had to implement then they get no choice.

A good example is the legislation 2001/83EEC as amended which concerns the application and subsequent approval and distribution / marketing of pharmaceutical products for humans in the EU/EEA.

Norway had virtually no input or say in how that unfolded yet were obliged to implement it into national law if they wanted to continue accessing the single market for pharma products both for imports and exports.

So it depends entirely on what the actual legislation is as to whether they have to take it or not.
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Thanks, not so keen on EEA then, it sounds like in some areas at least that the EEA has to all but act by another EU member.

However it is important to note that if the UK joined the EEA, it would instantly massively increase the influence of the whole group and so I don't think it's unreasonable to expect some concessions from the EU in a new deal between the two blocs.
 
estebanrey said:
OK so you're saying that Norway has to abide by EU regulations not only for what it exports to the EU, but also for products made by Norwegian manufacturers that are only sold to Norwegians?

I would have thought they would only have to abide by the EU rules for products being made in Norway destined for EU countries. I can't see why they would have to apply EU regulation on their own companies that sell within their pwn borders. Surely EU directives can't apply to non-EU members?

Let's stick with the e-cig example (because why not), let's say the EU restricted the amount of nicotine you could put in the liquid to 12% and Norway restricted it to, say, 20%. Why would Norway allowing Norwegian liquid makers to make liquid that was 20% that they only sold within their own borders, prevent German liquid makers from importing their 12% liquids into Norway for sale?
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In the EEA and EU the goods have the same regs. The difference comes when selling outside the EU. In the EU the goods have to comply with the EU regs even though they are selling outside the EU. In the EEA they only have to comply with the country regs they are being sold to.

Switzerland who are not in the EU or EEA have a slightly different position on these regs. Their regs are frozen and only get more through negotiation. Typically Switzerland agree to the reg in return for more market access.
 
estebanrey said:
OK so you're saying that Norway has to abide by EU regulations not only for what it exports to the EU, but also for products made by Norwegian manufacturers that are only sold to Norwegians?
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That's how I understand it, yes.

I would have thought they would only have to abide by the EU rules for products being made in Norway destined for EU countries. I can't see why they would have to apply EU regulation on their own companies that sell within their pwn borders. Surely EU directives can't apply to non-EU members?
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Because if their manufacturers are able to make to different regulations then there isn't a level playing field for sales of products coming from the EU. The EEA isn't as tight as the EU but it's still a pretty tight coupling and unlike being in the EU, you don't have representation in the decision making systems.

What you seem to be talking about is closer to simply having tariff-free trade. In this case, there's no regulatory convergence so you just have to make stuff to the market you're selling to.
 
estebanrey said:
Thanks, not so keen on EEA then, it sounds like in some areas at least that the EEA has to all but act by another EU member.

However it is important to note that if the UK joined the EEA, it would instantly massively increase the influence of the whole group and so I don't think it's unreasonable to expect some concessions from the EU in a new deal between the two blocs.
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yes, but those concessions would not be any of the 4 main pillars i.e free movement of goods, services, people and capital. So other than some potential wiggle room around some other legislation I don't think the prognosis is that great. Some of the key legislated areas such as data protection, medicines for humans will never be on the table as concessions for example.
 
estebanrey said:
Thanks, not so keen on EEA then, it sounds like in some areas at least that the EEA has to all but act by another EU member.

However it is important to note that if the UK joined the EEA, it would instantly massively increase the influence of the whole group and so I don't think it's unreasonable to expect some concessions from the EU in a new deal between the two blocs.
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Interestingly it's why Norway et al don't wan't us in it -- we would be a disproportionately larger country, relative to the others, and our economies aren't at all alike in scale and focus; hence they might get regulated more because of us, as a for instance. How they plan to amend and harmonise the EEA agreement will be interesting too see (given we go that way).
 
You really have to smile at the gullibility of the great British electorate. They thought/assumed that if they voted to come out of the EU then the drawbridge would be pulled up the very next day, immigration would be a thing of the past and we would be making our own decisions.

In fact what is likely to happen now is that the UK will become a poorer society (financially) because of Brexit and yet nothing much will change. We will still carry on dealing with the EU, have to accept EU legislation and yet will have had no input into the decision making process and we will still have immigration.

Has anyone noticed how quiet the Brexiteers camp has gone since the vote. They have absolutely no plan for life outside the EU whatsoever.

Perhaps we need a Chilcot type of investigation into Brexit?
 
Billies Bangers said:
You really have to smile at the gullibility of the great British electorate. They thought/assumed that if they voted to come out of the EU then the drawbridge would be pulled up the very next day, immigration would be a thing of the past and we would be making our own decisions.

In fact what is likely to happen now is that the UK will become a poorer society (financially) because of Brexit and yet nothing much will change. We will still carry on dealing with the EU, have to accept EU legislation and yet will have had no input into the decision making process and we will still have immigration.

Has anyone noticed how quiet the Brexiteers camp has gone since the vote. They have absolutely no plan for life outside the EU whatsoever.

Perhaps we need a Chilcot type of investigation into Brexit?
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You do know that there's an election for the Brexit Prime Minister going on that will then shape the plan. What's the point making a plan until that happens. Also when you say going quiet - should there be victory parades in the streets or was there something else you were expecting. I think you will find the exit camp are quietly waiting for things to progress which if you read in the news, wont start until the end of the year. In the mean time - the constant circular arguments are pointless
 
estebanrey said:
However it is important to note that if the UK joined the EEA, it would instantly massively increase the influence of the whole group and so I don't think it's unreasonable to expect some concessions from the EU in a new deal between the two blocs.
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Perhaps if we are really good at negotiating and lucky it will elevate the influence of the whole group to that of an actual EU member...If only we could join the actual EU instead of changing a lesser group into the EU, OR..... :p
 
LOAM said:
Perhaps if we are really good at negotiating and lucky it will elevate the influence of the whole group to that of an actual EU member...If only we could join the actual EU instead of changing a lesser group into the EU, OR..... :p
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This is more likely. They would have to have an EEA seat at the table if the EU want to change the arrangements with EU. This isn't even being discussed as far as I am aware. It probably won't happen but if it did a seat would be needed.
 
Billies Bangers said:
You really have to smile at the gullibility of the great British electorate. They thought/assumed that if they voted to come out of the EU then the drawbridge would be pulled up the very next day, immigration would be a thing of the past and we would be making our own decisions.

In fact what is likely to happen now is that the UK will become a poorer society (financially) because of Brexit and yet nothing much will change. We will still carry on dealing with the EU, have to accept EU legislation and yet will have had no input into the decision making process and we will still have immigration.

Has anyone noticed how quiet the Brexiteers camp has gone since the vote. They have absolutely no plan for life outside the EU whatsoever.

Perhaps we need a Chilcot type of investigation into Brexit?
Click to expand...

Perhaps their quiet because they won? The only people who are making noise are the remainers who are having problems accepting the result.
 
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