Brexit thread - what happens next

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joeyjojo said:
What I find really weird is that most on the (fiscal) right are happy with some of the big causes of wage stagnation, i.e. a more free labour market and de-unionisation, but then push back against the same free-market principals when it involves foreign workers, in the name of protecting British workers.

Presumably it's because at that point nationalism becomes the dominant force, but it still seems a bit mad to me.
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Because it's politically convenient yet pragmatically is never about shrinking 'the state' or creating a 'free-free' market.

Mr Jack said:
For goodness sake. You'd think that elected officials would have a little bit more awareness. It's a pretty crappy thing to post regardless, but after Jo Cox's murder it's downright crass.
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You haven't met many councillors across the spectrum then.
 
Mr Jack said:
This is worth a read: A Brexit post-mortem: 17 takeaways for a fallen David Cameron. "In an open memo to the outgoing British Prime Minister, former Canadian High Commissioner to the UK, Jeremy Kinsman, describes in detail just how badly the Remain campaign failed."
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If half these points had been put to people before hand ......

Then again, the Tory strategy over the previous 5+ years had been to blame anybody and everybody for the ills of the country, apart from the real culprits, the politicians. The EU was always going to be top of the hate list due to the far right of the Tory Party who seem to exist in a dream of what the UK was like and can never be again rather than what it is. Maybe this is the post colonial hangover as Churchill(iirc) said 'we have lost an Empire but have not found a role'.
 
joeyjojo said:
What I find really weird is that most on the (fiscal) right are happy with some of the big causes of wage stagnation, i.e. a more free labour market and de-unionisation, but then push back against the same free-market principals when it involves foreign workers, in the name of protecting British workers.

Presumably it's because at that point nationalism becomes the dominant force, but it still seems a bit mad to me.
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It's because the right needed a ploy to sell the idea of leaving the EU to the masses. The real agenda is the deregulation of the UK, giving businesses more power.

UKIP and Nigel Farage were fanatical proponents of leaving the EU long before immigration became a significant issue, but yet it's pretty much all they talked about during the referendum campaign.

Immigration will soon be forgotten about after a few token gestures.
 
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do_ron_ron said:
If half these points had been put to people before hand ......

Then again, the Tory strategy over the previous 5+ years had been to blame anybody and everybody for the ills of the country, apart from the real culprits, the politicians. The EU was always going to be top of the hate list due to the far right of the Tory Party who seem to exist in a dream of what the UK was like and can never be again rather than what it is. Maybe this is the post colonial hangover as Churchill(iirc) said 'we have lost an Empire but have not found a role'.
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That's always been my thoughts. For decades the EU has been blamed for things the British people didn't like when it was either a decision made by our elected government, not the EU or we could have veto'd it so then becomes very hard for those same people to say positive things about the EU.

Plus two major newspapers whose owners want out of the EU have made anti EU headlines and articles for years so people believe it.
 
do_ron_ron said:
If half these points had been put to people before hand ......

Then again, the Tory strategy over the previous 5+ years had been to blame anybody and everybody for the ills of the country, apart from the real culprits, the politicians. The EU was always going to be top of the hate list due to the far right of the Tory Party who seem to exist in a dream of what the UK was like and can never be again rather than what it is. Maybe this is the post colonial hangover as Churchill(iirc) said 'we have lost an Empire but have not found a role'.
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The problem for Tories in Conservatives In and BSE overall, was the initial reluctance to share campaigning resources, strategies and methods with erstwhile rivals. So, in a sense, they hobbled their own activists stuck between two HQs: one around the Government, one around the referendum's mission. It improved greatly towards the end but until the very last moment Dave wanted to minimise blows on his party, believing wrongly that such appeasement will work on his backbench headbangers and sceptic voters. Tactically, he should've advanced Labour as one of his predecessors managed to do rather well in the past, knowing full well that for as long as they were stuck under Jezza, they were unlikely to capitalise on any such political boon. Neither should he have played coy before the official campaign. Ah well, he's gone now.
 
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Darujhistan said:
Exactly what millions of people were worried about and still are.

1 million on the council house waiting list.

Where is everyone going to live?

I don't think housing was addressed at all in the campaign.
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The problem with lack of housing stems back to Thatcher selling off the council housing and forbidding councils to build anymore and successive Govts carrying on the same policy. Tory Govt and Boris in London have diluted or done away with the rule that new housing developments had to contain some social housing. Nothing to do with immigrants directly although any new people are exacerbating an existing problem.
 
do_ron_ron said:
The problem with lack of housing stems back to Thatcher selling off the council housing and forbidding councils to build anymore and successive Govts carrying on the same policy. Tory Govt and Boris in London have diluted or done away with the rule that new housing developments had to contain some social housing. Nothing to do with immigrants directly although any new people are exacerbating an existing problem.
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Didn't that particular philosophy include cities like Liverpool being allowed to collapse and die? Paper wealth also does little for people not linked to profits from speculative markets, but does need skilled labour. Hence awkwardness of shot infrastructure, poor housing stock and division by design.
 
enigma27 said:
So it seems one of the so called 'experts' we should have listened to about brexit has now back tracked and said our economy is not all doom and gloom.

just goes to show people who have a vested interest in the outcome of such votes will tell you whatever they need to sway people one way or another

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...itish-economy-grow-faster-Germany-France.html

P.S i know is a daily fail article but still..
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Except we have not left yet, we are still part of the EU. We have not even pressed the button(Article 50). So far we are like an adolescent teenager 'telling his parents he hate them and he is going to leave home'
 
Greebo said:
i wouldnt saying "tanking". I work in the construction industry and in the two quarters prior to the referendum, the industry was technically in recession as we had had two consecutive quarters of negative growth but it was only something like 0.25% each quarter.
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Can't find the figures, but the quarter to end of June was down something like 3%.
 
johnloo said:
Its funny that why I always say the majority of experts are not experts, there are only a handful.

FTSE 100 smashes 6,700 and pound breaks $1.31 as Bank of England survey shows 'no clear evidence' of sharp Brexit slowdown
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FTSE casino gamblers work on an minute by minute basis and as yet we are still part of the EU. As for the £ vs $, so £ was averaging $1.46 and went up to $1.50 before Referendum and is now $1.31.
 
datalol-jack said:
The problem for Tories in Conservatives In and BSE overall, was the initial reluctance to share campaigning resources, strategies and methods with erstwhile rivals. So, in a sense, they hobbled their own activists stuck between two HQs: one around the Government, one around the referendum's mission. It improved greatly towards the end but until the very last moment Dave wanted to minimise blows on his party, believing wrongly that such appeasement will work on his backbench headbangers and sceptic voters. Tactically, he should've advanced Labour as one of his predecessors managed to do rather well in the past, knowing full well that for as long as they were stuck under Jezza, they were unlikely to capitalise on any such political boon. Neither should he have played coy before the official campaign. Ah well, he's gone now.
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Honestly, Cameron lost the campaign before it started. He was so confident he'd win that he hamstrung his entire campaign. He should have started putting out pro-EU messaging from the moment he was cornered into promising the referendum, instead he carried on using the EU as a scapegoat and marched up with his silly re-negotiation, and then having said he would leave the EU over these minor compromises he then had to double back and say it was really important we didn't leave. Shockingly, no-one believed him.
 
Jokester said:
Aye, just seen her on the news as well, looked and sounded good.
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She's not going to take any prisoners by the looks of it, I'm not a fan (or wasn't) but she was head and shoulders above anyone else in that room. Hard as nails and I think she might be quite good for us ::confused:
 
do_ron_ron said:
Remember Dave went over to India not that long ago and promised to make it easier for Indians to come to Britain while saying we need to cut immigration when in the UK.
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Guess which story we peddle to the Chinese?:D Plus anyone with capital is always welcome, them rules are for the lower orders, domestic help and families you see. Still makes people who engage in such trade and diplomatic gymnastics look like complete tools when their jig is up and they have to face the media music.
 
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