The benefits received isn't as big an issue as the fact people have free movement. The latter is one of the main features of the EU system, and what is considered the biggest issue. Cameron got concessions on benefits, but people weren't happy with those (or, it appears, didn't know about it based on discussions in this thread).
Brexit thread - what happens next
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it's a shame you think this way but it is what we are told to believe. how can a fictitious dead entity with no life be sovereign? does not make sense.
Told to believe? It's the reality we live in. Want to self-govern as an individual? Good luck with not paying your taxes, not obeying laws, going anywhere you want regardless of ownership etc etc.
Yes it's possible to go 'off grid' in the UK, to an extent, but you still need to observe the laws of the land and pay any applicable taxes etc, or else you'll be yelling "I'm sovereign!!" from the comfort of a prison cell.
So unless you live on your own desert island you're not sovereign.
Please look up the meaning of sovereignty:
http://www.oxforddictionaries.com/definition/english/sovereignty
http://www.dictionary.com/browse/sovereignty
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sovereignty
This is the sovereignty we're talking about when saying Brexit will return sovereignty to the UK. It is not a personal thing. What you're talking about is something quite different, such as self-determination.
When has the working man and women every had sovereignty - get real!
Boris certainly did a good job brainwashing a lot of people
this is my original post, you claim otherwise and have changed the context not me.
He got minor concessions of which were time limited (Hee-haw), and even if they weren't, they would have been removed once a new treaty was on the etch-a-sketch of the EU Commision.
I haven't changed the context at all. This thread is about Brexit, so that's the context we must use the terms 'sovereign' and 'sovereignty' within.
I'm happy to have a more philosophical discussion about individual self determination, self-ownership, individual freedom or whatever you want to call it, but this is probably not the appropriate place.
He didnt really get any concession.
He got a gap of 4-7 years but as a one time thing and temporary.
Then after that period we'd be right back to square one
Soldato
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Yes of course, after the UK has completed the Article 50 negotiations, the UK is free to negotiate with everybody.
Nate
When has the working man and women every had sovereignty - get real!
Boris certainly did a good job brainwashing a lot of people
The EU does a good job of brain washing the masses.
There's some in this thread freaking out of fractions of a percentage economic performance here and there but there's something more deeply sinister going off that we aren't be told and are well away from imo.
If I wanted overall political control of Europe without another War creating the EU seems to me to be the perfect way of doing it.
The concept of free movement for instance, the perfect way to creating a cultural soup and dilution of national identity where a federal Europe is more likely to be voted for. The rush to assimilate basket case countries such as Romania makes me think that this must be the aim.
The constant propaganda, "Funded by the EU," and such like. Uhm no, the EU has told the Government what to spend it's money (Borrowed or otherwise.) on.
I don't want to be part of a federal Europe and I don't care what it costs. We fought 2 world wars and already paid the ultimate price ensuring that didn't happen, a few potential economic percentage points here and there isn't a big price to pay.
At all.
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Depends where it ends doesn't it, by that I mean we leave the EU which ultimately leads to Scotland leaving the union, that, will be one hell of a recession, they'll be no bouncing back from that quickly.
What did those evil Romanians do to you?
Why do people think the EU was created as some evil form of "New World Order"?
Bottom line is, we are all human, should all get along and stop being spiteful towards each other and trying to separate ourselves from the rest of the world.
Yes, we had 2 World Wars, people died to fight against evil and unit us all together for the future. Not to tell other countries to get lost because "you are not from around here" or "i want to keep my identity" We all have our own identities no matter where we come from.
Associate
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Look different countries have different cultures and different ways of doing things.
Until religion has vanished and we prove there is other intelligent life out there, your utopia of one big state will not work.
People living in the UK should dictate the direction this country is run.
Until religion has vanished and we prove there is other intelligent life out there, your utopia of one big state will not work.
People living in the UK should dictate the direction this country is run.
They have admitted the push for federalism. They aren't even hiding it anymore.
if you think it was created for the good of the people you are mistaken..
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