Insane and lethal modern car designs.....:(

[lemonade]

Reason why EPAS is more difficult to turn is because of the way those electric motor assist in turning, with hydraulics, you still have a much more purer mechanical system, which makes it tad easier.

Also EPAS was introduced to improve fuel efficiency, have a hydraulic pump running off the engine uses fuel and saps power, not very efficient. There are system that keep the hydraulic system but use electric motor in place of pump. But along with that epas is smaller, lighter, cheaper to make and in modern cars you can use software to control them for autonomous features.

If you thought epas was bad, wait for steer-by-wire systems to become the norm, Nissan have already developed it and it's in some of their Infiniti models, the steering has no physical connection to the wheel, although I beleive they have a fail safe system in place, still wouldn't trust it, knowing how easy electrics and software fail.

As a purist I prefer my hydraulic over electric, they simply don't have the steering feel and are not engaging, steering is your main physical connection to the operation of the car.

 

[GravyMonster]

I'm guessing it's fully electronic braking, not just assisted. Dumbest idea ever.

Full electronic braking... on a French car. That's suicidal.

 

[Nasher]

You do post absolute rubbish don't you.

If the battery dies in a modern car, things go crazy. In fact Toyota/Lexus did a recall relating to the accelerator thing.

And an electric handbrake is still the secondary braking system, as required by law. It can be activated and used to stop a vehicle when moving.

Yea? Have you tried pressing it when the car has no power then? I suggest you try disconnecting the battery and press it. Unlike with a leaver, there is no physical link between the button and the brakes. It needs power to function. Just like assisted brakes and steering.

 

[DXP55]

Nice to know my Focus has a catastrophic steering feature.

 

[mattyg]

No-one in here obviously drove a 2L Capri with 215 tyres without PAS back in the day.

But saying that. The cam belt snapped in my old Citroen xantia estate. That killed the engine and the PAS it took me by surprise and it took both arms to heave ho the steering so I cold pull over

 

[mrk]

My first car was a Metro, that had no power steering and felt like a tank to turn. Old school Rover steering.

It wasn't a big deal really.

Surely if power steering fails, you can still steer the car, just it is heavier to do so.

 

[bremen1874]

Older cars tended to have slower racks (and narrower tyres) which made things easier with or without PAS.

 

[Outcast]

No-one in here obviously drove a 2L Capri with 215 tyres without PAS back in the day.

But saying that. The cam belt snapped in my old Citroen xantia estate. That killed the engine and the PAS it took me by surprise and it took both arms to heave ho the steering so I cold pull over

No But I used to drive my 3.0s with the power steering disabled. The pulley wheel had seized and snapped the belt. New pulley wheel for 2.8i was about £12... 3.0s the git was nigh on £50. I drove it around until MOT and he told me it was a fail until I fixed it !

If you want "beefing Up" try driving a 38tonner for a week when the power steering hose had sprung a leak. Bejesus Be**** that makes you learn to reverse in one hit !

 

[bremen1874]

3.0 Capri would be on 185/70-R13 wouldn't it?

I know my 2.8 was virtually undrivable with the PAS belt off. The none PAS 2.0s I had before that was fine.

 

[Outcast]

That sounds about right size.

 

[Entai]

Are you sure something else didn't go wrong as well?

Exactly what I was thinking, are the front tyres at correct pressures ? are they heavily worn ? is all the geometry correct ? are there any front suspension components worn or broken ?

All these will effect weight of steering when assisted let alone when unassisted.

 

[Clarkey]

If the battery dies in a modern car, things go crazy. In fact Toyota/Lexus did a recall relating to the accelerator thing.

Toyota unintended acceleration recall was related to the floor mats, nothing to do with electronic control.

 

[Dis86]

Toyota unintended acceleration recall was related to the floor mats, nothing to do with electronic control.

I thought there was a second one?

 

[Nasher]

I thought there was a second one?

Toyota/Lexus have done a few recalls in recent years, including some airbag related ones. I was actually in a Toyota that got T-boned and the side airbag didn't deploy properly (one which wasn't recalled). I bashed my head on the side window. Luckily it was only about 30-35mph.

Makes you wonder what faults other manufacturer's cars have that most people don't notice until it's to late. Toyota are generally one of the most reliable and if they had problems, others will too. Especially since quite a few parts are actually shared.

 

[sigma]

Full electronic braking... on a French car. That's suicidal.

Lul

 

[Haggisman]

That's an apples to oranges comparison. ABS is a system that complements the brakes. Steering is it's own system. To have a redundant steering system would be like saying cars should have 5 wheels in case one of the wheels falls off!

You realise the "A" in PAS stands for the same thing as the "A" in ABS? Assisted - e.g. the system should work with them non functional, just not as efficiently. It's not about having a redundant system, it's having a system which still works when the assists fail.

I had the belt go in my old Galant when coming down one of the biggest hills in Bath... could still steer just about, but needed to put my full weight into it using both arms... that was a fun experience!!

 

[Clarkey]

You realise the "A" in PAS stands for the same thing as the "A" in ABS? Assisted - e.g. the system should work with them non functional, just not as efficiently. It's not about having a redundant system, it's having a system which still works when the assists fail.

I had the belt go in my old Galant when coming down one of the biggest hills in Bath... could still steer just about, but needed to put my full weight into it using both arms... that was a fun experience!!

Not sure if you're joking, but ABS stands for Anti-lock Braking System.

 

[SilverTongue]

Not sure if you're joking, but ABS stands for Anti-lock Braking System.

Think people are confusing ABS with Servo Assisted Braking.

As clarkey says ABS and PAS do different things. If you ABS fails it won't make it more difficult to brake, it just makes it more likely that you'll lock the wheels up and skid during an emergency stop.

 

[Lashout_UK]

Makes you wonder what faults other manufacturer's cars have that most people don't notice until it's to late. Toyota are generally one of the most reliable and if they had problems, others will too. Especially since quite a few parts are actually shared.

I discovered a catastrophic issue with the new (at the time) Suzuki Celerio, just before it went on sale - the issue being complete brake failure during an emergency stop.

Fortunately, I encountered it a few days before the car went on sale to the public (but not before the press events and a few cars having made their way into the wild): https://www.autocar.co.uk/car-news/new-cars/how-suzuki-celerio-was-fixed

Still baffles me that the flaw made it into production cars, though.

(Apologies for some of the slightly odd formatting in the article above - looks like some legacy stuff as it's an older story)

 

[Joe T]

You realise the "A" in PAS stands for the same thing as the "A" in ABS? Assisted -

No, no it doesnt.