Well quite. I missed the word ‘annually’...
The 'ship them back to their own country' mentality
- Thread starter mrochester
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Well quite. I missed the word ‘annually’...
None so blind as those who choose not to see.
Not sure how you figure that one. They're building hundreds of thousands of houses in Cornwall, and it isn't because we're breeding like rabbits. Services are stretched because whilst building all those new houses, they are continuing to *close* hospitals and GP surgeries. It's barmy.
We have quite the influx of foreigners from across the Tamar, you know.
This argument about poor planning is totally invalid. How are the government supposed to plan for a figure which they are unable to account for until it takes place?
Not only that but how are you supposed to pay for these services? You have to tax the native population. If an immigrant arrives he hasn’t paid anything in to the system and is already drawing on it the moment they use any public infrastructure.
So essentially you suggest the native population should be taxed higher, so that the government can build suitable large scale infrastructure beyond the current populations requirements, to ensure that the system can support an undefined number of immigrants over an undefinable period of time. Right.
Not only that but how are you supposed to pay for these services? You have to tax the native population. If an immigrant arrives he hasn’t paid anything in to the system and is already drawing on it the moment they use any public infrastructure.
So essentially you suggest the native population should be taxed higher, so that the government can build suitable large scale infrastructure beyond the current populations requirements, to ensure that the system can support an undefined number of immigrants over an undefinable period of time. Right.
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You keep saying they don't know but they don't it's a city the size of Birmingham every year?
Also, the Tories haven't controlled immigration from outside the EU since 2010 at all, so I'm bemused why anyone thinks they'll do it properly now. That's before we even get to the point that it is unlikely FOM will be stopped as we'll be staying in the SM/CU - there is no other way to solve the Irish Border issue
It’s variable, ergo quite difficult to plan for in any suitable way.
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But if you know it's approximately that size, you know the number at least reasonably accurately. So to say you don't know at all is rubbish.
Any response to the second point?
Still a totally flawed argument. You can only make an assumption. Like Labour did when they thought the population of non EU nationals would double from 1997 to 2004 but we’re off by about a million people.
What’s the second point got to do with it? They haven’t stopped it because they’ve lacked the political will to implement it properly. That’s like saying, well it’s quite difficult so why bother at all?
Soldato
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With this attitude, how do you plan in advance for anything...
Well an immigrant that has come here of working age comes here and starts paying tax at the point in their life that is cheapest. Schooling, healthcare during childhood, infrastructure used during childhood ,policing their neighbourhood through their childhood are all bills you have not had to pay for. Really if you look at it this way, it is the immigrant taxpayer which has costed you less compared to a native of the same age.[/QUOTE]
What people are suggesting is for government to manage infrastructure to accommodate for the likely migration trends while taking into account the net benefit of a low cost migrant tax payer. For them to make use of things such as being able to claim healthcare costs back from other EU countries, rather than just blaming 'dem foreigners'. For our government to put restrictions in the housing market that prevents current homeowners from snapping up more houses from first time buyers when they neither need them nor can afford them without another mortgage.
There are arguments for limiting migration but the ones you name miss the mark. The problems you name are more to do with poor management and governing rather than anything else.
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That's rubbish. There is no solution, why do you think the Government is keeping us in the SM/CU in all but name?
Do you believe the Tories - or anyone else for that matter - will restrict immigration any time soon? Or do you think they’ll just make a song and dance about it while doing nothing?
Goes to show how little I care about where you come from. Migration to Cornwall is defined as people coming into the area who weren't born here.
Doesn't matter if that's from Poland or Brum or Laaandaaan.
Unsustainable pressure is being put on our roads, schools and hospitals by people coming down here to retire and grow old.
Caporegime
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That's another possible distinction, with various different words used. Hard/soft, strong/weak, explicit/implicit, etc.
I read an interesting linguistic argument about the correct meaning of the word "atheist", which rests on the order in which the root words are combined. 'a' + ('theos' + 'ism') or ('a' + 'theos') + 'ism'? The former loosely translates to "no ideology of gods" and the latter loosely translates to "ideology of no gods", so the order in which the roots are combined is the core of the two different meanings. Interesting, but not definitive. Words don't have to follow consistent rules or have their literal meaning or retain their original meaning. Atheism originally referred to not being a follower of the ancient Greek religion, so if we were to retain the original meaning almost everyone would be an atheist today.
I prefer to emphasise the distinction between knowledge and belief, so my preferred split is this:
Agnostic Atheist: I don't assert that something is true without sufficient objective evidence to justify that assertion, so I don't claim to know the objective truth about the existence or non-existence of gods. I don't believe in any gods.
Agnostic Theist: I don't assert that something is true without sufficient objective evidence to justify that assertion, so I don't claim to know the objective truth the existence or non-existence of gods. I believe in a god or gods.
Gnostic Atheist: I know that there are no gods. Objective evidence isn't needed.
Gnostic Theist: I know that the god or gods I believe in are real. Objective evidence isn't needed.
That has its own flaws, notably that "gnostic" already has a different meaning in a religious context, but I think it's the most useful distinction between different positions.
Why are you so down on the Tories? They are merely the vessels of the "will of the people". And the will of the people is evidently to strike bold new trade deals with India etc. that may require some freedom of movement to grease the wheels. But still, will of the people and all that.
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You understand correctly, immigration issues involving horrific violence has reared its ugly head again very recently with mass protests on the streets by Swedish women. The officer that declined to go into the full horror of one of the gang rapes obviously felt that telling that the rapists poured petrol on a teenage girls vagina and then set her ablaze was too much. This is what some elements in Sweden wish to brush under the carpet :
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-5197675/Hundreds-protest-Sweden-series-gang-rapes.html
Hundreds took to the streets of Malmo in southern Sweden to protest after three teenage girls were brutally gang raped - and police told women to stay indoors.
The most recent incident involved a 17-year-old girl who was raped by an unknown number of assailants in a children's playground in the early hours of Saturday.
The following day, Malmo police issued a warning to local women not to go outside alone at night, and to walk in pairs or use taxis.
Saturday's rape took place just a few streets away in Sofielund, and saw the 17-year-old attacked by a group of men in a playground.
'This is a horrible, particularly severe crime with exceedingly brutal violence,' Andy Roberts, head of area police in North Malmo told Helsinborg's Dagblad.
He would not give the newspaper details of the violence the victim was subjected to, but added: 'There are limits, even for me, as an old experienced police officer.'
Soldato
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I went to that with open mind, but I see nothing to confirm or deny they were immigrants, seeing as the police arent saying they are related, or not, is there info missing from that article thats well known or is it assumptions being made as to ethnicity?
Or has assange sneaked out of the embassy?
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This is the crux of my post and the matter, they are deliberately hiding the ethnicity of the miscreants. It's probably an attempt by their liberal government to pretend all is well whilst 17 year old girls are gang raped and their private parts set alight.
Soldato
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Ah ok, so its a cover up. **hands some tin foil over**
It could have been assange out on his xmas party then
