Boris and the burka

Loves Love Island said:
Yes I was, it isn't difficult, I put forth an argument. I wasn't misrepresenting someone else's argument. This has already been pointed out to you twice now...



It isn't a straw man, I wasn't;'t countering an "argument", I made no reference to an argument - I put forwards an argument.



Could say the same thing about you tbh... you're a bit of a time waster who hasn't paid attention to the argument put forth and can't really respond to it so you've just gone off on a tangent.
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Blah, blah blah.
 
the_chicco said:
Why on earth am I going to go out of my way to 'educate' people for? I spent some of my youth learning about different faiths and religions from around the world, why don't you do the same?

The whole argument was something along the lines of nuns wear what they wear for religious purposes and women wearing burqas / nicabs don't. Of course they do. I don't need to prove you or anyone else wrong. The whole idea of wearing a headscarf, burqa or a nicab is borne out of the specific passages in the Qu'ran (and other religious text) talking about modesty. Some people have taken it quite literally and used their own interpretation of it. I'm not saying I agree with it, on the contrary. I think it should be banned.
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You made a statement its up prove your statement and "educate" where I and others are wrong, my current understanding of the texts is in 24:31 there is only a call for both men and women to dress modestly, nothing on the particulars and nothing about a full burqa or even a hicab.


PS I do think Boris was a insensitive ass on this one
 
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inogen said:
Why don't you start your another thread, go in it and argue with yourself?
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I'm happy to post in here thanks, you just quoted me with a rant, after quoting me a couple of times to deflect/start some side argument and then you quote me again to say "Blah, blah blah." - perhaps it is you who needs to "start your another thread" - I'm quite happy to actually discuss the issue here rather than behave childishly as you have.
 
Loves Love Island said:
I'm happy to post in here thanks, you just quoted me with a rant, after quoting me a couple of times to deflect/start some side argument and then you quote me again to say "Blah, blah blah." - perhaps it is you who needs to "start your another thread" - I'm quite happy to actually discuss the issue here rather than behave childishly as you have.
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Feel free, just please avoid using using the words, "strawman", "ad hominem" and "deflect". And try to add something to the discussion rather than making it all about you. :D
 
the_chicco said:
It's quite literally in the Qu'ran, do you want me to point you to the specific hadiths? It's the whole reason you know, that's there's a debate about interpretation / taking something literally. You're ignorance is astounding, stop making yourself look stupid.

*Edit* just seen you're other posts. Yup, I don't argue with ignoramus, blocked.
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Point it out in the koran please. Obviously u need educating.
 
inogen said:
Feel free, just please avoid using using the words, "strawman", "ad hominem" and "deflect". And try to add something to the discussion rather than making it all about you. :D
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It is you that has used that in this thread, I was discussing the subject at hand. If someone was to quote me and misrepresent my argument though I'd happily call that a straw man and likewise I'll call out an ad hominem too. you keep quoting me to engage in some sort of meta discussion though, I repeatedly get a notification from you and find I'm responding to yet more nonsense instead of the actual subject of the thread.
 
the_chicco said:
It's quite literally in the Qu'ran, do you want me to point you to the specific hadiths? It's the whole reason you know, that's there's a debate about interpretation / taking something literally. You're ignorance is astounding, stop making yourself look stupid.

*Edit* just seen you're other posts. Yup, I don't argue with ignoramus, blocked.
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As a Muslim I’d like to know where it says in the Quran that a woman needs to wear a burka please.

Do remember that I have read and studied the Quran myself. So yeh show me and others absolute proof where it says a woman must wear a burka. Those exact words please and not some other text that you can twist into what you want it to say ;).
 
Yas786 said:
As a Muslim I’d like to know where it says in the Quran that a woman needs to wear a burka please.

Do remember that I have read and studied the Quran myself. So yeh show me and others absolute proof where it says a woman must wear a burka. Those exact words please and not some other text that you can twist into what you want it to say ;).
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See the further post, he meant to just claim there are some Hadith justifying it (and I'll assume they're a bit vague on the subject).
 
Why don't we just hear the truth from an Islamic teacher?

Is it compulsory for a Muslim woman to wear a burqa instead of just a shalwar kameez?
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I wouldn’t say they look like bank robbers, more like potential terrorists.

Theres is no place for it in western culture in my opinion and I’m liberal. It’s intimidating and a security risk.
 
Loves Love Island said:
It is you that has used that in this thread, I was discussing the subject at hand. If someone was to quote me and misrepresent my argument though I'd happily call that a straw man and likewise I'll call out an ad hominem too. you keep quoting me to engage in some sort of meta discussion though, I repeatedly get a notification from you and find I'm responding to yet more nonsense instead of the actual subject of the thread.
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BINGO!

And no matter how many times you say it, someone calling your "argument" irrelevant is not misrepresenting it. It's just calling it irrelevant. Like builders are to what Boris Johnson said about muslim women wearing burkas.

That's all you've added. An irrelevance and a circular argument about semantics. Discussing the subject at hand? give me a break.
 
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inogen said:
That's all you've added. An irrelevance and a circular argument about semantics. Discussing the subject at hand? give me a break.
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Eh? I've posted several times discussing the subject itself, however whenever I get a notification from you it is yet again some meta discussion. I'm simply replying to the points you've raised when you've quoted me, which for the past few posts have been off on a tangent and just pure nonsesnse at times when you replayed with "blah blah blah". It's pathetic, do you want to try discussing the subject at hand instead of repeatedly quoting me and side tracking into some meta discussion?
 
D.P. said:
No one is saying people can't have an opinion, or Boris can;t express his opinion. Most people opn the left agree with basic arguments of Boris' opinion, i certainly do.

The problem is the immature and insensitive presentation of said opinion as a joke without a well reasoned and thoughtful response.
This does far more harm to the cause. An intelligent debate is possible about whther Burkas should be banned to help oppressed women or whether that infringes on women's religious rights and freedoms. But if you just resort to childish jokes then no debate can take place and you just give the religious zelots far more tools to further their agenda and you completely weaken the oposing sides reputation.
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I think people are looking too deep into this. It is his human right as well as anyone to free speech without prejudice .
 
Admiral Huddy said:
I think people are looking too deep into this. It is his human right as well as anyone to free speech without prejudice .
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I agree, but his position as maybe the highest profile MP in the country means that he should moderate his free speech in order to protect the reputation of the government and those that the government represent, ie the British people. He's not a man in the street.
 
inogen said:
I agree, but his position as maybe the highest profile MP in the country means that he should moderate his free speech in order to protect the reputation of the government and those that the government represent, ie the British people. He's not a man in the street.
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He is, he finally relinquished One Carlton Gardens a bit ago, although he was considered to be somewhat tardy handing over the keys ;)
 
inogen said:
I agree, but his position as maybe the highest profile MP in the country means that he should moderate his free speech in order to protect the reputation of the government and those that the government represent, ie the British people. He's not a man in the street.
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You're arguing that from the position that what he's said is wrong.
Many people have the conflicting opinion that it's entirely correct.
 
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