Clapping Banned at Manchester University Student Union Events

[Mason-]

Err.... not quite, kid.
I presented a solution. You raised issue with my solution. I negated your issue, as it would still be present with or without my solution, while also presenting two additional solutions to your issue.
You somehow claim this negation and dismissal of your flawed quibbles as agreement, which it blatantly is not.


I didn't even know it was a problem until you brought it up... and you persisted in trying to challenge me with it, despite me already solving it twice in one sitting.


Jazz hands solve the deaf problem.


My overhead clapping solves the deaf and blind problem.


The subsequent adaptions do, though.


No-one is starred-off... here, there or in hypothetical land... Not unless you count yourself as the lone bastion of offense, in which case you're only starred-off because you want to be. Nothing to do with my actual assertion, which was actually about how you DARE to bring such hypocrisy to the conversation.


Already did that several posts back when I mentioned the app...
In fact, that pre-empts several other objections you might think to try, so feel free to make up some more objections for me to defeat...


You're absolutely right. Let's just do what we've always done, because it has worked for hundreds of years.... I therefore call you cowardly scum and demand satisfaction of you - Hampstead Heath at dawn for a duel, and bring your best Boxing Stance!!

I mean your rambling is pointless because you just came up with the gem "I didn't even know it was a problem" which if you'd actually read what the union said or where it's been parroted in loads of articles, the whole point of this is to stop loud noises for anxious people.

https://www.manchestereveningnews.c...ing-banned-jazz-hands-university-15223965.amp

The union say the loud noise created by clapping, including whooping and traditional applause, can pose an issue for students with disabilities such as anxiety or sensory issues.

So no, your solution solves nothing. As it will still trigger the fairies who apparently can't hear clapping without thinking they're in the middle of the blitz. Any solution without noise will upset blind people.

And so tying it back to what I said to yesterday:

"Stop trying to cater for absolutely everything because it's impossible and just go with the universally accepted thing that anyone who can hit something against something else can do, which is clap."

Unless you've got some magic solution which doesn't make noise but at the same time lets blind people know. Cheers. And maybe next time read about the subject at hand before so stridently making your assertions.

 

[ttaskmaster]

If it helps when I was at Manchester uni iirc the voter turn out for some of the student union elections was in the single figures. The rooms where they old these meetings wouldn't fit one class from one year of any of the major courses.

Thanks, but I'm afraid it doesn't help - It seems you don't need to be in a union to be a whackadoodle... and so long as you were at the right Uni, your mates will let you and your whackadoodle ideas join the upper management of our industry!!!

I mean your rambling is pointless because you just came up with the gem "I didn't even know it was a problem" which if you'd actually read what the union said or where it's been parroted in loads of articles, the whole point of this is to stop loud noises for anxious people.

Really?
Let's look at that then, shall we...?

"Students at University of Manchester will use 'jazz hands' to express their support rather than clapping, in line with British Sign Language (BSL), to make events more accessible to those with disabilities"

That first statement highlights the requirement to both comply with a certain standard, and to address multiple disabilities.

Now you may want to examine the plight of the particular subsection who experience anxiety from loud noises, but that immediately disregards those other disabilities and potentially excludes them, which contravenes the essence of the statement. But as is, you yourself were specifically addressing the hearing impaired in the particular quote I addressed in the first place, so you negate your own argument from both perspectives.

So no, your solution solves nothing. As it will still trigger the fairies who apparently can't hear clapping without thinking they're in the middle of the blitz. Any solution without noise will upset blind people.

It solves everything, because it's adaptable. Pay attention.

anyone who can hit something against something else can do, which is clap

Immediately excluding those who cannot hit something and perpetuating the problem. Again with the negation.

Unless you've got some magic solution which doesn't make noise but at the same time lets blind people know. Cheers.

I wouldn't say Android apps are magic... unless you really are stuck in the 18th Century?

And maybe next time read about the subject at hand before so stridently making your assertions.

No need - You don't read them either and ignore the responses in favour of the sound of your own voice... which is my general experience of the very students you seem so set against.... and, unsurprisingly, Labour Party supporters too!

 

[Tefal]

Thanks, but I'm afraid it doesn't help - It seems you don't need to be in a union to be a whackadoodle... and so long as you were at the right Uni, your mates will let you and your whackadoodle ideas join the upper management of our industry!!!

You're missing the point. These aren't the people who make friends with the types thst end up running industries.

These end up mates with the gender studies students, which doesn t really get you an in anywehre

 

[ttaskmaster]

You're missing the point. These aren't the people who make friends with the types thst end up running industries.

Then who are the very similar types with very similar ideas who do end up making friends with the industry runners...??!!
Because, much as your assertion would appear to make sense, we have an awful lot of these people messing with our work, here.

These end up mates with the gender studies students, which doesn t really get you an in anywehre

Oh them - The luvvies.... Yeah, they're all running our HR and H&S departments!!!!
Presumably being a drama queen doesn't actually get you an actual Drama Studies degree?

 

[Tefal]

Then who are the very similar types with very similar ideas who do end up making friends with the industry runners...??!!
Because, much as your assertion would appear to make sense, we have an awful lot of these people messing with our work, here.

They don't, industry does its not to try and meet quotas but I csnt day I've ever noticed any particular sjw push.

Oh them - The luvvies.... Yeah, they're all running our HR and H&S departments!!!!
Presumably being a drama queen doesn't actually get you an actual Drama Studies degree?

Nah hr and h&s tend to want competent people to solve problems not incompetents to cause problems.

 

[ttaskmaster]

They don't, industry does its not to try and meet quotas but I csnt day I've ever noticed any particular sjw push.

Then there seems to be an utterly amaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaayzing coincidence that most of our graduates 'just happen' to have come from the same university that our CEO and most of the EMT 'just happened' to attend, too.... and which uni that is 'just happened' to change every time we got a new CEO.
I'm sure that's also nothing to do with the 'utterly unfounded' rumours of insider dealings, brown envelopes, conflicts of interest and golden handshakes.... except for the last guy, who made absolutely no attempt to hide it and did everything quite blatantly in front of everyone.

Nah hr and h&s tend to want competent people to solve problems not incompetents to cause problems.

Yes, but those competent people don't actually work in HR or H&S. They're usually in the Standards department, who write all the policies and legal stuff that the HR/HS flowers then try to enforce without reading, or just interpret however suits them best.

 

[Tefal]

Then there seems to be an utterly amaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaayzing coincidence that most of our graduates 'just happen' to have come from the same university that our CEO and most of the EMT 'just happened' to attend, too.... and which uni that is 'just happened' to change every time we got a new CEO.
I'm sure that's also nothing to do with the 'utterly unfounded' rumours of insider dealings, brown envelopes, conflicts of interest and golden handshakes.... except for the last guy, who made absolutely no attempt to hide it and did everything quite blatantly in front of everyone.


Yes, but those competent people don't actually work in HR or H&S. They're usually in the Standards department, who write all the policies and legal stuff that the HR/HS flowers then try to enforce without reading, or just interpret however suits them best.

How tiny is your company that the ceo has anything to do with staffing?

As for all the criminal rumours you mention well if your company is corrupt and comming crimes then I dont think it can be used as a wider industry example.

 

[ttaskmaster]

How tiny is your company that the ceo has anything to do with staffing?

Only about 5,500 employees.
But as with everything, it's often not what you know, but who... and there's a strong smell of 'Old Boys Club' in certain areas of the business, especially those that have been around since long before privatisation.

As for all the criminal rumours you mention well if your company is corrupt and comming crimes then I dont think it can be used as a wider industry example.

Most of our current contractors, consultants and the like are former employees, who are employed by companies founded by former employees. People frequently get TUPE'd in/out, or transfer around following the demand for their skillsets. You also get a lot of headhunting, interchange and exchange between our 'opposite' companies in different areas.
It's actually quite a niche industry so gets rather incestuous, at times.

 

[Housey]

For me, an entire room full of people doing jazz hands in silence is much more likely to trigger an anxiety attack than people clapping. Quiet rooms full of people really creep me out.

Easy to lock on to from 30000 feet mind

 

[Housey]

its a student union - they are full of idiots, always were.

Yip. Same as it ever was. Most will grow up....or join local government

 

[Malevolence]

Yip. Same as it ever was. Most will grow up....or join local government

Thing is, I can't remember it being this full of complete nutters though. Back when I was university it was mostly the crusty brigade, but at least you could actually sit and have a laugh over a few pints with them. This current bunch of headcases though, well they all seem to be mentally ill or something.

 

[Bar]

Thing is, I can't remember it being this full of complete nutters though. Back when I was university it was mostly the crusty brigade, but at least you could actually sit and have a laugh over a few pints with them. This currant bunch of headcases though, well they all seem to be mentally ill or something.

Sadly I believe its a genuine desire to live in a utopian world where no one is discriminated against and everyone is permanently happy. Reality is something that will come and show them the way in a bite the pillow type of way. Idealism is great and all that, but what frustrates me is that they dont celebrate differences, they almost seem to want that distopian reality where no one can say / do / think anything that offends anyone. The funniest thing is there complete hypocrisy they want everyone treated as an individual and equal, except if you are a heterosexual cisgender white male. Then you are the spawn of the devil and responsible for all evil in the world. Now if you are in this category and ask to be treated as an individual and not judged as a single group, well then you are just being completely unreasonable based on your self ingrained white priviledge.

I wonder what there views are on shouting warnings to people in danger, is it better for them to be run over by an unseen train, or should you risk instilling anxiety in someone by shouting a warning.... ah poo, by the time youve balanced all the pros and cons the person is now under the train...

 

[dowie]

Then there seems to be an utterly amaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaayzing coincidence that most of our graduates 'just happen' to have come from the same university that our CEO and most of the EMT 'just happened' to attend, too.... and which uni that is 'just happened' to change every time we got a new CEO.
I'm sure that's also nothing to do with the 'utterly unfounded' rumours of insider dealings, brown envelopes, conflicts of interest and golden handshakes.... except for the last guy, who made absolutely no attempt to hide it and did everything quite blatantly in front of everyone.

Well I doubt it would be anything to do the "brown envelopes", "conflicts of interest" etc...

A manger or managers having a rose tinted view of their old university isn't exactly uncommon, it certainly doesn't in itself imply some corruption etc.. not that you've substantiated how any of that would work?

Regardless, a company can choose to target a particular university or universities if they want. It is fairly standard for lots of companies to do so, whether it is a good idea to do so is another matter.

 

[BowdonUK]

There was probably too much clap at the university anyways.

 

[Skunkworks]

Well it's definitely not a lack of cultural enrichment in the Student's Union executive that's for damned sure...

https://manchesterstudentsunion.com/execteam

Nearly 100% 'diverse'.

 

[dowie]

Low turnouts and block voting from certain student societies can lead to rather distorted results... in some cases (at least in the past) it could be the case that some douche from the rugby team gets all his drinking buddies to make him Pres or sports officer for the next year, so that he can stay on after graduating in some paid sabbatical role and they all get to have more "top bants" with the "hurldog"... and extra funding.

I suspect that these days you're perhaps often going to get certain student Islamic societies taking a keen interest in the voting. And of course some of the more cringeworthy aspects of uni lad culture from the 00s have been restrained a bit these days.

 

[V F]

It was discussed last night.

54:41

 

[subbytna]

I'd so hate to be 18 again in so many respects.

100%

When I was 18 there were no mobile phones, no facebook, no social media and plenty of common sense (1994)

 

[antijoke]

Sadly I believe its a genuine desire to live in a utopian world where no one is discriminated against and everyone is permanently happy.

But they don't seemingly want that world, there seems to be an ever increasing split in unifying people as the human race that the utopia they want is unachievable. Everyone wants to split into their own little category of classification to be an individual and then they want special recognition for that classification.

 

[Bar]

But they don't seemingly want that world, there seems to be an ever increasing split in unifying people as the human race that the utopia they want is unachievable. Everyone wants to split into their own little category of classification to be an individual and then they want special recognition for that classification.

Fully agree thats the consequence of their actions, I just dont think they realise that.