I appreciate your approach, but I guess we'll have to agree to disagree on this one. I don't think you can compare the same process and way of thinking.
We're all organ doners now...
- Thread starter MrWhippy
- Start date
What about those that do not know about this new policy and for personal reasons Beliefs do not wish to have there body cut up.
People that wish to share their body parts can opt in rather than opt out.
I really don't care if you take this badly, are insulted or think anything about me - those that are opting out of the system are the lowest of the low.
The very same people wanting to be at the front of the queue if they ever needed an organ themselves.
The level of selfishness required to actively opt out of a system like this is truly amazing - nothing surprises me about the general populace these days, but even that is scraping the barrel.
I haven't read the whole thread - I'm going to assume there is some guff about "Government has no rights to ma body" and "Doctors will be letting people die" and "slippery slope....." - all complete BS, all without substance - just attempts to justify completing a selfish act.
The very same people wanting to be at the front of the queue if they ever needed an organ themselves.
The level of selfishness required to actively opt out of a system like this is truly amazing - nothing surprises me about the general populace these days, but even that is scraping the barrel.
I haven't read the whole thread - I'm going to assume there is some guff about "Government has no rights to ma body" and "Doctors will be letting people die" and "slippery slope....." - all complete BS, all without substance - just attempts to justify completing a selfish act.
Soldato
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- 6 Nov 2002
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- 10,025
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- London UK
Whether its not donating from a lack of registering to opt-in or now opting out, other than some form of religious beliefs (which is a whole can of worms discussion) I really don’t understand why anyone would not want to help/donate after their death.
Yes it may be seen as lazy to not opt-in, but to purposely go out of your way to opt-out just seems very very bitter.
Yes it may be seen as lazy to not opt-in, but to purposely go out of your way to opt-out just seems very very bitter.
Honestly interested in this point and would like to understand, when you say 'sacred' what do you mean, is this connected to your religious beliefs? How do you see what happens to your organs after your death affecting you?
Say a a family were involved in a car crash. If one family member had opted out of organ donation and they were now unconscious, the other family member needed an organ, would there be a way to overrule this by power of attorney or whatever the medical term is granting you the right to decide your next of kins treatment?
I guessed this was the way it was going to go and suspect it's the desired effect - having "choice" but effectively being shamed into making the "right" choice. 
I can understand that some people and/or their families just want "dignity in death" or have other cultural factors that are at odds with being used for spare parts. If you want to become fertiliser and feed back into the natural cycle completely intact, that's your perogative IMO.
Also, totally agree with the sentiment that there was no apparent outrage before this, where people just couldn't be bothered to sign up to the register and that was absolutely fine for some reason.
@Angilion - great point re: no resistance = consent being a crap idea. That's what I wanted to get across originally and you made it in a far more eloquent fashion.
I can understand that some people and/or their families just want "dignity in death" or have other cultural factors that are at odds with being used for spare parts. If you want to become fertiliser and feed back into the natural cycle completely intact, that's your perogative IMO.
Also, totally agree with the sentiment that there was no apparent outrage before this, where people just couldn't be bothered to sign up to the register and that was absolutely fine for some reason.
@Angilion - great point re: no resistance = consent being a crap idea. That's what I wanted to get across originally and you made it in a far more eloquent fashion.
Associate
- Joined
- 22 Sep 2012
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- 664
Do you not see how full of judgemental ASSUMPTIONS you are.
No I wont be at the start of the queue for one if needed, I'll gladly stick my middle finger up and say bugger off.
Strawman arguments. Lack of consent is not comparatively universal, and requires context. Your head is broken if you think being being unable to consent is on the same level as not being bothered to remove consent.
You can keep philosophising that consent should always be given in every situation as if the topic is black and white. It isn't black and white, and you're in the minority of those who think it should be applied in this context.
I think the only rational objection to being registered as an organ donor (And some would argue that even this is barely rational)
Is the fear that one might end up in hospital with serious, but potentially recoverable, injuries but end up being triaged as being worth more as spares than as a patient.
Having said this, this does concern me
Especially when combined with this.
"Forced" consent isn't consent either!
Is the fear that one might end up in hospital with serious, but potentially recoverable, injuries but end up being triaged as being worth more as spares than as a patient.
Having said this, this does concern me
Especially when combined with this.
I guessed this was the way it was going to go and suspect it's the desired effect - having "choice" but effectively being shamed into making the "right" choice.
"Forced" consent isn't consent either!
The easy way to fix the issues of consent would be when you register with a GP.
Box suggesting opt in or out.
This way everyone is informed and can make their own choice.
But forcing people to consent with out knowing the policies is pretty bad and leads to further changes in the future.
This provided further problems let’s say you have 10 % chance of living would you get proper care or will the doctor see you as a donor and not try and do everything he can to save your life? And this has happened in the past.
I believe we should throw as much money into stem cell regeneration for human organs. Yes, in the short run it will be very expensive, however it would save more people and be cost efficient in the future.
Box suggesting opt in or out.
This way everyone is informed and can make their own choice.
But forcing people to consent with out knowing the policies is pretty bad and leads to further changes in the future.
This provided further problems let’s say you have 10 % chance of living would you get proper care or will the doctor see you as a donor and not try and do everything he can to save your life? And this has happened in the past.
I believe we should throw as much money into stem cell regeneration for human organs. Yes, in the short run it will be very expensive, however it would save more people and be cost efficient in the future.
Wait until the opt-out list is lost/leaked and the "scum" can be publicly shamed! Pitchforks ready, peeps!
Caporegime
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To me a soul is your human spirit. Who you are and what you do in life. That is what people remember, not whether or not you had a nice liver or something.
Body parts do not matter after you die, they are simply organic matter, nothing more. But to some, they could offer the chance of a better life. They can help a child reach adulthood, they can help a mum watch her child grow up, they can help a husband stay with his wife, and to deny people that chance because you’d rather your organic matter end up being eaten by worms or burnt is both heartless and nonsensical.
Yeah especially from a high horse.
I get mine out from time to time, the weather is nice up there.
Soldato
- Joined
- 6 Nov 2002
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- 10,025
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- London UK
This is the key point!
Regardless of what has made you bitter in the past, what mess your life may or may not be in, or what your objections are around a government making decisions on rights, why would any normal human go out their way to prevent being able to provide the above gift to a fellow human?
If they have these beliefs then doubtless there'll be plenty of discussion and publicity in the circles they keep with people holding similar beliefs.
Ignorance is rarely an excuse.