AMD Navi 23 ‘NVIDIA Killer’ GPU Rumored to Support Hardware Ray Tracing, Coming Next Year

humbug · 24 Aug 2020 at 15:50

The XBox Series X is 2080 Super or a bit more with 52 CU's (actually has 56 CU's but is cut down to 52 for yields) at 1900Mhz. the PS5 runs 18% higher clock speeds than that at 2.23Ghz, at 2.2Ghz the XBox Series X would be at least a 2080TI.

If AMD can't beat a 2080TI with a 2.2Ghz RDNA2 GPU by 30% something is very wrong.

BigBANGtheory · 24 Aug 2020 at 16:13

labbby said:
I often think there should be an OCUK meet up sometime, just like the scene in Anchorman between the different network anchors we should do it Nvidia fan boys vs AMD fan boys.

What would be more interesting imho is exposing those using multiple accounts and those with some kind of commercial interest in either company either individually or as part of the supply/retail/review chain

Whilst fan boys I'm sure exist people are too quick to use that label as a weak attempt to lower the value of someone's opinion

ik9000 · 24 Aug 2020 at 16:19

but surely you're not suggesting people would be anything other than unbiased and impartial in their commenting on here?

TNA · 24 Aug 2020 at 16:20

ik9000 said:
but surely you're not suggesting people would be anything other than unbiased and impartial in their commenting on here?

Haha

nashathedog · 24 Aug 2020 at 16:32

Gerard said:
He resigned after taking some time out, not even remotely the same as being sacked.

He was sacked,
His handling of Vega and it's release was awful & he immediately went on leave never to return, It beggars belief that people still think he wasn't sacked. It was a textbook firing.
Lisa Su's actions after show how unhappy she was with how he'd lied & bamboozled the AMD user base.
Koduri managed the development & release of 1st gen Vega, He was dishonest to the consumer scores of times, When Vega released Koduri gave base clock claims that were near impossible to hit even after undervolting & overclocking the cards (I know I had three different models), When 2nd gen Vega (VII) released under Lisa Su she did the opposite giving up to clocks that it flew past.
Koduri was in way over his head, He may be good at working on gpu architecture but he was terrible at management & he was sacked over his handling of RTG.

Gerard · 24 Aug 2020 at 16:37

nashathedog said:
He was sacked,
His handling of Vega and it's release was awful & he immediately went on leave never to return, It beggars belief that people still think he wasn't sacked. It was a textbook firing.
Lisa Su's actions after show how unhappy she was with how he'd lied & bamboozled the AMD user base.
Koduri managed the development & release of 1st gen Vega, He was dishonest to the consumer scores of times, When Vega released Koduri gave base clock claims that were near impossible to hit even after undervolting & overclocking the cards (I know I had three different models), When 2nd gen Vega (VII) released under Lisa Su she did the opposite giving up to clocks that it flew past.
Koduri was in way over his head, He may be good at working on gpu architecture but he was terrible at management & he was sacked over his handling of RTG.

Or it could have been something to do with the fact that something like 2 thirds of his engineering team were transferred to work on ryzen and Vega was basically down to a skeleton crew of engineers? He even made reference to the fact when joining intel his engineering team was around 4000+ at Intel, an obvious dig at what happened at AMD. Not like this is the first time a product has been misrepresented, both the radeon 6990 and 7990 were marketed in promo vids as being cool and quiet and were anything but.

Chrisc · 24 Aug 2020 at 16:37

humbug said:
My thinking is 2080TI +30%, but the 3090 will be 20% faster again.

I think you're in the right ball park. I was thinking more like 15-20% and lets face it, thats not a bad increase

humbug · 24 Aug 2020 at 16:38

More staff does not = better, prime example, AMD vs Intel

Chrisc said:
I think you're in the right ball park. I was thinking more like 15-20% and lets face it, thats not a bad increase

Yeah its fine. i'm not looking to spend £1500 anyway....

Gerard · 24 Aug 2020 at 16:40

humbug said:
More staff does not = better, prime example, AMD vs Intel

It does if you're actually working hard at a new product and not half assing it like INtel has been doing for near a decade.

Chrisc · 24 Aug 2020 at 16:43

humbug said:
More staff does not = better, prime example, AMD vs Intel

Yeah its fine. i'm not looking to spend £1500 anyway....

haha nah, at no point would i be spending that on a GPU

humbug · 24 Aug 2020 at 16:44

Gerard said:
It does if you're actually working hard at a new product and not half assing it like INtel has been doing for near a decade.

Quality vs Quantity, Intel have about 120,000 staff, what are they all doing? Sipping coffee.... AMD have about 11,000 and i bet every single one of them has their specially and work to do.

CAT-THE-FIFTH · 24 Aug 2020 at 16:46

humbug said:
Quality vs Quantity, Intel have about 120,000 staff, what are they all doing? Sipping coffee.... AMD have about 11,000 and i bet every single one of them has their specially and work to do.

Nvidia has more employees than AMD. So AMD does very well having less employees and less R and D money than either!

Gerard said:
Or it could have been something to do with the fact that something like 2 thirds of his engineering team were transferred to work on ryzen and Vega was basically down to a skeleton crew of engineers? He even made reference to the fact when joining intel his engineering team was around 4000+ at Intel, an obvious dig at what happened at AMD. Not like this is the first time a product has been misrepresented, both the radeon 6990 and 7990 were marketed in promo vids as being cool and quiet and were anything but.

Exactly - if you listen to senior AMD people,they not only had to reduce R and D spend,but they said a large percentage of the R and D spend was spent on Ryzen.

If you notice the period immediately after R and D spend was cut,and more was focussed on Ryzen,it was basically the years after the R9 290 series was launched.

humbug · 24 Aug 2020 at 16:49

CAT-THE-FIFTH said:
Nvidia has more employees than AMD. So AMD does very well having less employees and less R and D money than either!

AMD are understaffed, well..... lets see. But Raja complaining because he doesn't have 4000 staff under him like he does at Intel? Well again lets see, i'm waiting for this Nvidia killer from Intel.

CAT-THE-FIFTH · 24 Aug 2020 at 16:50

humbug said:
AMD are understaffed, well..... lets see. But Raja complaining because he doesn't have 4000 staff under him like he does at Intel? Well again lets see, i'm waiting for this Nvidia killer from Intel.

Going to be hard when you are stuck on 14NM++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ though. Only now after years of failure,have they grudgingly asked TSMC for some volume,on 7NM when Nvidia and AMD will be soon on 5NM!

humbug · 24 Aug 2020 at 16:53

CAT-THE-FIFTH said:
Going to be hard when you are stuck on 14NM++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ though.

Right.

120,000 what are they all doing? how many does it take to get 10nm, no... 7nm working? This is my point. the number of staff you have does not equate to the quality of what they produce. AMD have always been much smaller than Intel, yet AMD keep out technologying them over and over again.

TNA · 24 Aug 2020 at 16:57

Raja was awesome. Shame he left AMD really. Vega was not his fault. Remember when everyone would say Navi was Raja’s baby? AMD are now benefiting from all his hard work.

ik9000 · 24 Aug 2020 at 16:58

humbug said:
Right. 120,000 what are they all doing? how many does it take to get 10nm, no... 7nm working? This is my point. the number of staff you have does not equate to the quality of what they produce. AMD have always been much smaller than Intel, yet AMD keep out technologying them over and over again.

that sounds like the start of a bad joke, "how many intel employees does it take to change a ~~lightbulb~~ node process?"

CAT-THE-FIFTH · 24 Aug 2020 at 16:59

TNA said:
Raja was awesome. Shame he left AMD really. Vega was not his fault. Remember when everyone would say Navi was Raja’s baby? AMD are now benefiting from all his hard work.

This is the bloke who was instrumental in GPUs such as the ATI R300,aka,as the ATI 9700 Pro.

Another factor,AMD was also due to WSA using GF 14NM,which was a worse version of the Samsung 14NM process,which was made for smaller mobile orientated dies.

Nvidia used Samsung 14NM for some of its smaller GPUs,and they were less efficient than the TSMC 16NM ones which were larger dies.

Edit!!

You can see that with Polaris,where GF couldn't make a simple GPU like that properly. It had a high stepping number and was no doubt delayed.

Even Ryzen was delayed by nearly 3~6 months if you look at older roadmaps.

Vega is efficient in mobile form. But the desktop Vega we got was a repurposed machine learning GPU.

Navi he no doubt had some input on.

humbug · 24 Aug 2020 at 17:02

TNA said:
Raja was awesome. Shame he left AMD really. Vega was not his fault. Remember when everyone would say Navi was Raja’s baby? AMD are now benefiting from all his hard work.

Raja left / Was sacked whatever... Super Sue walked into the GPU division, said "hold my bear...." and increased Vaga IPC by 50%, BOOM, mic drop. Bye Raja

humbug · 24 Aug 2020 at 17:03

ik9000 said:
that sounds like the start of a bad joke, "how many intel employees does it take to change a ~~lightbulb~~ node process?"

lol...