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*** NVIDIA GEFORCE RTX 3080 SERIES STOCK SITUATION - NO COMPETITOR DISCUSSION ***

ScottiB said:
AMD's MSRPs are as fictional as Nvidia's

To give you some idea, the MSRP for the upcoming 6700XT MBA is exactly the same as our COST price. So they expect us to make nothing...not even cover our costs...
erm....no, that's not happening.

Worse still, AIB cards are usually more expensive to make than MBA/Founders, so when they start coming through we're going to be well over "MSRP"
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Ever considered forming some kind of retailer union, and doing joint Tweets, PR letters to techpowerup etc. stating MSRP is same as your cost price to raise attention, then AMD would surely have to respond?

But I guess as always by doing that you risk losing supply. never an easy decision.
 
Del-Dredd said:
Was stated earlier OC do not order the cards when we put the orders in (back in September) they only put orders in when cards become available to bid on at Distributors. So they end up paying more than the original asking price.

Seems to me a better practice would be put bids in direct with factory, when the product went live in the first place and cut out the crap middle men.

Waiting to bid on cards that come available seems a very poor system to get your stock.
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canning this reply having read scotts latest post.
 
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ScottiB said:
I don't wish to cause offence, but a certain phrase involving elderly relatives and egg sucking springs to mind. Gibbo and I have about forty years combined experience in this industry. If you honestly believe that you know better after hearing that then I'm at a loss words.

I have gone over this before.

All of the brands were told the morning after the launch how many of their cards we'd sold. They were..and still are, kept up to date on weekly basis.

The brands that do ship direct, (generally Zotac, Inno3D, KFA on the Nvidia side) and like to work this way were given large POs BEFORE the launch. These are still not even close to being fulfilled. You've all seen Gibbo's update so you know how well this practice ACTUALLY works in real life.

The main brands, Asus, Gigabyte, MSI, don't accept large POs direct. THEY allocate stock to each reseller as it's produced and that stock is shipped to one of their local distributors who then tell us how many and at what price to raise the PO. Gigabyte and MSI do sometimes ship direct but, only from their EU hub, and again, only based on the stock that they've got on hand and allocated to us. Asus never ship direct, full stop.

B2B orders aren't subject to any protection so, even if we give them a PO days before launch at launch pricing, there's absolutely no chance that they'd be sticking to it. In fact, one of those examples that I gave before of a $400 increase in a 3090 price in the space of a month, was from a brand direct shipping against one of those "Day 1" POs

I'm tired & cranky, I'm going to bed
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This is interesting and I think goes along way as to why those 3 brands usually cost more. The magic question of course why do those 3 AIB's insist on working that way, I can only assume they approve of the distributor system as its more profitable for them. The B2B transactions in modern manufacturing seems horrible, I am not sure if I would have the will power to stay in business operating on the terms you have to operate under and is a real eye opener. My reply above this was typed before I read this post.
 
JediFragger said:
Also on a morbid note, anyone else think that with the wait for cards being so long that a fairly good portion of people will actually *die* by the time their card comes in? We're talking a low low percentage out of 5000 of course, but that's gotta be 10/20 people easily :eek:
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Depends on the buying demographic (age related mortality rates), but sadly, I can personally confirm you're not far from the truth as I still had a mother when I ordered in Sept... :(
 
Gibbo said:
Been doing this for over twenty years now and never in my life have I experienced times like this for shortages.

The last time we had a mining craze we were able to keep our regular gaming cards in stock, people from here will remember what we did to support gamers and we were also able to get large volumes of cards ideal for mining like RX 470/480 at the time to cater for mining demand. In short I could go hunting for deals and stock, I would find the stock and be able to buy 100 and 1000's of cards, whilst still keeping in stock the latest gaming product at the time.

Now I can't even keep 1050Ti in stock, it is an absolute disaster. I think the biggest issue here is scalpers, they are roaming the internet, have scripts/bots setup to literally buy anything.
The fact some of our competitors are listing 3070's in stock at £1099 and selling out within minutes shows how crazy it is.

The miners are an issue, but the real issue is the scalpers I feel and the problem is right now there is so much pent up demand from every type of possible customer, at this rate onboard graphics will be booming again in no time.

I truly do hope Intel can come to this party and get to it this year with something that offers around 3060-3070 performance as we need another major player and one that has huge manufacturing capacity.

Demand is up in general for PC gaming components and system, but mining, scalpers and the hype around the new cards has sent it out of control, 2021 is a write off, it won't get any better, maybe even worse before it does and unless I can see signs of an improvement by June/July then this issue will go well into 2022.
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Is there anything that can tackle scalpers/bots?
 
James T said:
Depends on the buying demographic (age related mortality rates), but sadly, I can personally confirm you're not far from the truth as I still had a mother when I ordered in Sept... :(
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Bro,

I'm sorry to hear you lost your mum mate, hope you and the family are doing ok!

Hope you get your card soon, some gaming might help you through it!
 
What if Valve sell graphics cards they could sell to trusted clean gamer accounts only, that have been going for many years and limit one per customer. email Gabe my idea :) I guess the money is already rolling in for Valve.
 
chrcoluk said:
This is interesting and I think goes along way as to why those 3 brands usually cost more. The magic question of course why do those 3 AIB's insist on working that way, I can only assume they approve of the distributor system as its more profitable for them. The B2B transactions in modern manufacturing seems horrible, I am not sure if I would have the will power to stay in business operating on the terms you have to operate under and is a real eye opener. My reply above this was typed before I read this post.
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It's all about scale. You might not realise it but these brands have hundreds of customers across the country, many thousands around the world, from the biggest forests to the local corner computer store. They can't deal with those themselves...that's why distributors exist, the clue is in the name. The idea being that Asus, for example, can ship a container full of stock to one of their four UK distributors and they deal with each individual customer's price lists, purchase orders, returns, credits etc. The man power needed for a brand who exist in every almost every single outlet in every single country to deal with the sales, marketing and returns themselves boggles the mind. Instead, they can run an entire country with as few as a couple of people.

I don't know if you ever had the fun of trying to return a faulty founders edition card when Nvidia started to sell direct? lets just say it was clear that they hadn't fully considered the full breadth of what a reseller needs to be able to deal with.

one thing that didn't quite click last night when I replied to this
Del-Dredd said:
Seems to me a better practice would be put bids in direct with factory, when the product went live in the first place and cut out the crap middle men.
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The reason that this is a REALLY bad way to do business is because it essentially means that they only do business with the highest bidder...a certain rainforest could wipe out off their global competition in a matter of months and the end user would end up paying even higher prices...
Brands understand that a monopoly is a very bad thing, which is why they ALLOCATE stock across their customer base...that's also why you might find a card in your local store. At times like this it means that small fry can continue to so business, system integrators continue to build PCs and the customer breadth can continue to exist for times when demand is lower and they need to generate business.

The side effect of spreading it wide at times like these is that they also have to spread it thin
 
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ScottiB said:
The reason that this is a REALLY bad way to do business is because it essentially means that they only do business with the highest bidder...a certain rainforest could wipe out off their global competition in a matter of months and the end user would end up paying even higher prices...
Brands understand that a monopoly is a very bad thing, which is why they ALLOCATE stock across their customer base...that's also why you might find a card in your local store. At times like this it means that small fry can continue to so business, system integrators continue to build PCs and the customer breadth can continue to exist for times when demand is lower and they need to generate business.

The side effect of spreading it wide at times like these is that they also have to spread it thin
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I did kind of touch on this on the reply I edited, when I used to work in manufacturing we dealt directly with the big companies, this meant they had the best pricing as they didnt have to pay the middle man his profit, but at the same time we had distributors who supplied the small guys as they couldnt meet minimum order commitments. What we didnt do however is have bidding wars for people to buy our product, this to me is a horrible way to do business, I dont know if its a recent thing, or it just happens that the company I worked for didnt engage in those practices. But still yes larger customers did have the advantage. So I do accept that if everything was direct from the manufacturer then companies like the rain forest would probably reign supreme.

Not sure of the solution, it does feel like its an industry that needs regulating, we have consumer protection and it would make sense to add some building blocks to prevent things like volatile pricing in the b2b space as well as requiring distributors to honour sales agreements. I just dont know how one can run a business when they dont know when they getting stock and they didnt even know what price they going to pay, but for sure this explains why PC hardware is super volatile on price watch sites, I always did wonder why prices moved around so much.

Also been reading stories governments deciding to fund their own fab factories, this would make a lot of sense as right now we have a few fab companies reigning control over multiple industries.
 
Noticed today an influx of MSI 3080's come up for sale on the popular auction site.. Has a company just released a large pre-order of these? Noticed some of the adverts show them as being posted out today via their website and cost paid £744.99.
 
RayRayFPS said:
Noticed today an influx of MSI 3080's come up for sale on the popular auction site.. Has a company just released a large pre-order of these? Noticed some of the adverts show them as being posted out today via their website and cost paid £744.99.
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phantom drop IMO, not actually enough there today. I'm on a parts tracker discord ( multiple actually) and was there when the links hit. hovering over the links, happen to be looking at them right on time, all gone before I could click a link. I magically got a link a few mins later where managed to put a RX 6900XT ( though I want an NV card) into a basket on a "very large German site" ( no competitor talk) only to find they won't even ship over seas and it disappeared shortly after (actual F'ing progress!!!, not lying here). The actual # of available cards was countable on your hands and feet i'd say, and still overpriced to hell. Even though OCUK put their prices up to cover what the distributor is screwing them for, these cards were more than what OCUK have listed. I'm ROI based, and I can't even get stuff from Europe ( insert snarky Brexit comment here) let alone those "looking else where" here. The situation is absolutely dire.

I'd imagine there is a ton of FOMO here too if you planned to sell your soul to the mining community just to make up the cost of a card that is x3 more than MRSP, or you were genuinely planning the upgrade this time for a new rig built for years to come to replace the dial up era of a rig you have, the chance to get new card is like hens teeth. I work for a very large SI, and are hit for part shortages too on specialized storage ( my area of the business) equipment. The "silicon" shortage is very real, though its not silicon the element per se, its all the bits and pieces that come with a board that are in short supply.

All those frustrated with OCUK and despairing over not getting your card, I get it. I was 1000ish in the ASUS TUF NON OC queue on Christmas eve, can't even get an update now. They were my only hope for my 3080 tbh. Do I blame them, absolutely NOT. They are a middle man who is getting dumped on by the global system of make everything for cheap elsewhere in the world. There are others in the UK in the same position, and others in the European continent in the same situation too. Though I would love to dunk on Brexit for fun here, it ain't the real reason for the shortage issues. Scalper is one ( and a serious one), but the shortage of components is THE major contributing factor. the likes of MSI "dropping" a "large number" of cards is merely optics. For the 100s of millions in Europe and the actual market that are gamers, the supplied numbers for any country are a complete joke. my 3 yr old niece an count that high.

only reason I post this is just a heads up, and to wish everyone happy hunting. Also, to those who have posted snarky comments to Scott and Gibbo, it really isn't their fault, they are genuinely been honest from what I can see, even giving their insight from the inside of the industry as an aside from someone who isn't OCUK staff.
 
RayRayFPS said:
Noticed today an influx of MSI 3080's come up for sale on the popular auction site.. Has a company just released a large pre-order of these? Noticed some of the adverts show them as being posted out today via their website and cost paid £744.99.
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They way oversold. Most of the dimwits listing on the bay will get a cancelation email tomorrow. Basically a clothing retailer listed the cards for about 2 hrs at £744, to make matters worse they allowed you to buy five at a time! Lots of people went for it but talk is they had a few cards but sold hundreds. Not the first time this has happened.
 
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