The thing I love about this, how many young people live off less then that 'moderate income' and have to pay rent?
How much do you need for comfortable existence in retirement.
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The thing I love about this, how many young people live off less then that 'moderate income' and have to pay rent?
Where are you going with that question?
Of course not, but all things being equal would you rather pay money into a product you can withdraw from as you like, or be locked into a product with complex rules attached to withdrawals?
Oh **** off with this nonsense. There's enough off it in the GPU subforum.
Gambling on crypto is gambling, and anyone who bets their future prosperity on Bitcoin is an idiot.
Sorry, back to the more sensible discussion
Concur.
Yes the idea is great, but it has a lot in common with a ponzi scheme. Whether it becomes so widespread that eventually it becomes a de-facto currency is another matter but there's absolutely no guarantee it'll go that way.
Man of Honour
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Appreciate the reply despite it being on the phone!
I spend time with work colleagues, clients and people in my professional networks. I'd still be doing that as I currently do voluntary work (mentoring and so on) but it won't be paid work. I think I mentioned in my original reply is that I may still do NED work (non executive director) from time to time. That said my focus will be very much on spending more time for me, rather than HAVING to go to work.
Whilst I'm an extrovert, I do enjoy my own time, and I have a fair few hobbies and support local communities that I could spend more time doing.
I'd still be seeing friends / ex colleagues. Nothing stopping me from going into town to see them. Work is like a long run, it's fine whilst you're doing it, and when you stop, you're relieved to be able to catch your breath again. That's what I'm waiting for, being able to catch my breath!
I realise everyone is different, but I'd be very happy to just be at home, read more, see my family (abroad) more, and not have to plan my life around a work schedule. And know that I dont' have a financial dependence on being at work to live a decent quality of life.
I think I should be comfortable in retirement and have set myself up well, for me the question is when should I retire...
I am currently 38.
Option 1: Early, at 42 years old. I would have just shy of £700 a month to live on. That's after all bills (that's everything accounted for, even the food budget for the month). This would increase to £1,500 after 12 years once the mortgage is cleared and would increase again at SPA, State pension, and work pension increase giving me £2,350 a month after all outgoings.
Option 2: Work 13 more years than option 1, retire at 55 Years old, the mortgage would be clear, bigger work pension giving me £1,950 a month, again after all bills. This would increase by £9k a year at SPA.
No of the above includes the money my Mrs would have each month, I'm solely working on all the expenses and just my money.
What option would you choose?
I am living just fine with £500 spare a month. so with option 1 not sounding like much, it's £200 more than I have now!.
I am currently 38.
Option 1: Early, at 42 years old. I would have just shy of £700 a month to live on. That's after all bills (that's everything accounted for, even the food budget for the month). This would increase to £1,500 after 12 years once the mortgage is cleared and would increase again at SPA, State pension, and work pension increase giving me £2,350 a month after all outgoings.
Option 2: Work 13 more years than option 1, retire at 55 Years old, the mortgage would be clear, bigger work pension giving me £1,950 a month, again after all bills. This would increase by £9k a year at SPA.
No of the above includes the money my Mrs would have each month, I'm solely working on all the expenses and just my money.
What option would you choose?
I am living just fine with £500 spare a month. so with option 1 not sounding like much, it's £200 more than I have now!.
Caporegime
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How has anyone lost money on bitcoin?
It's went from being pennies to £45k a coin and goes up every few years overall.
If you bought it at £50k yes you would be down 10% right now but only a moron would sell when it's down.
Wait 2 weeks and it will be up again. It's a long term investment.
I'd like you to show me how it's possible to buy bitcoin hold it for 5-10 years and lose money.
It's simply not possible.
Only morons who have no clue what they are doing lose money on it by day trading or panic selling. These same morons would lose money anywhere so it's not bitcoin related had they invested in Tesla they would also lose money because they try and day trade or buy high and sell low.
You need to have emotional intelligence when investing and when you lack intelligence it's hard to have emotional intelligence on top of it.
There are Ponzi schemes in crypto but bitcoin isn't one of them.
The Ponzi schemes are meme coins, pump and dump coins which get rug pulled as soon as investors have piled their cash in. But someone who doesn't have a clue about the market just views them all as scams.
These same scams exist on the stock market too. Was there not an electric vehicle company valued in the billions that didn't have any technology or a vehicle and used a shell and rolled it down a hill as proof they had one. You don't see people screaming the stock market is a Ponzi scheme as a result.
It's went from being pennies to £45k a coin and goes up every few years overall.
If you bought it at £50k yes you would be down 10% right now but only a moron would sell when it's down.
Wait 2 weeks and it will be up again. It's a long term investment.
I'd like you to show me how it's possible to buy bitcoin hold it for 5-10 years and lose money.
It's simply not possible.
Only morons who have no clue what they are doing lose money on it by day trading or panic selling. These same morons would lose money anywhere so it's not bitcoin related had they invested in Tesla they would also lose money because they try and day trade or buy high and sell low.
You need to have emotional intelligence when investing and when you lack intelligence it's hard to have emotional intelligence on top of it.
There are Ponzi schemes in crypto but bitcoin isn't one of them.
The Ponzi schemes are meme coins, pump and dump coins which get rug pulled as soon as investors have piled their cash in. But someone who doesn't have a clue about the market just views them all as scams.
These same scams exist on the stock market too. Was there not an electric vehicle company valued in the billions that didn't have any technology or a vehicle and used a shell and rolled it down a hill as proof they had one. You don't see people screaming the stock market is a Ponzi scheme as a result.
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Man of Honour
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We sound very similar, except I'm an introvert who really enjoys seeing other people
Well let's grab a beer then! We'll have another point of contact when we retire!
Man of Honour
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I'll hold you to that!
My preference would be a croque monsieur and wine half way down a ski slope in the alps if that works for you
What's your target retirement date?
Even better!
If all goes according to plan... 2035ish - realistically probably closer to 2040.
Where I was going with it is quite simple - You resent paying tax when withdrawing pension but are happy to get tax relief when paying into it. A bit off is all.
It's just my view on it chap, no need to conclude too much about that.
I pay my fair share of income tax, the only reason I pay anything into a pension (rather than other savings instruments) is the tax relief and the fact a base income from an annuity is not a bad thing to have. I just wouldn't want to aim to have a £40k PA pension and be paying income tax on my retirement money. That's just my view.
I pay my fair share of income tax, the only reason I pay anything into a pension (rather than other savings instruments) is the tax relief and the fact a base income from an annuity is not a bad thing to have. I just wouldn't want to aim to have a £40k PA pension and be paying income tax on my retirement money. That's just my view.
You'd rather pay 40%/62%/45% on it now and have a proportionally smaller pot to grow than pay 20% tax on part of it as you draw down a much larger pot post retirement?
Tax rate on a 40K drawdown is 11.6% taking into account the 25% tax free amount.
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Caporegime
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Because people trade with leverage and get liquidated, bitcoin is a 0 sum game.
The entire space is 90% scams and meme-coins, and 10% coins that have no real purpose, besides gambling on their value. Even the meme-coins like Shiba and Dogebonk end up being pumped and dumped and people get drawn in to "investing" in them.
Ok, ok, the privacy coins are popular with people to buy and sell drugs, launder money, etc. So they have some use cases.
Even the coins that aren't outright scams are many times more risky than fiat. Not just through volatility, but through exchange hacks, losing wallet keys, screwing up a transaction, or a buggy smart contract. And "be your own bank" means there's nobody to help you if things go wrong. Hence the SFYL memes.
Also the lack of liquidity in the system means that even if Bitcoin moons (say, hits $100k), not everybody will be able to convert to fiat. And if the bigger players try to take their money out, the fiat price crashes back down again. Heck the price crashes just because Elon Musk tweets something (or it gains 10%).
The truth is, you lose your money when you buy Bitcoin. You don't make any gains until (and unless) you convert back to fiat. And that requires that somebody else is prepared to buy at the price you want to sell for. If you buy at £50k and sell at £100k, somebody else has to want to buy at £100k.
Ultimately, the number can't go up forever. It can't, for example, have a market cap more than the entire world economy put together
At some point you're going to buy at the top and those people are screwed.There are other ways for the price to stop inflating or indeed reasons why it could crash in future.
If you bought when it was pennies and sold at the ATH then you made a killing. But nobody can buy for pennies now. Remember, back when Bitcoin cost pennies, nobody knew it would grow to the present-day value. Anybody who claims they knew is flat out lying. Many people sold for £100, £300, £500. Sure, they made decent returns, but by your logic, they should just have kept their Bitcoin forever.
That's the point. You can only say that with hindsight. If in a year's time it reaches £100k you can again say, "Told you so." But if it crashes to <£1000 probably you'll be claiming that you cashed out at the ATH and saw the crash coming.
It's all about hindsight. And it's all about gambling.
But it's also about shilling and encouraging people to buy your coins if you think the price is about to freefall.
Or you can hodl your Bitcoin forever, but then it's mostly useless. It's pretend money. It's only useful if you convert it back to fiat, so you can spend it
Caporegime
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Exchanges these days are insured.
Losing the keys to your wallet is your own fault. You cannot blame that on bitcoin.
If you lost your wallet when on a cruise ship by it going overboard. Guess what of you had £1000 cash in that wallet it is now gone also. Are you going to blame the government for creating physical money?
The exchanges I use have never been hacked. They are also insured for 250k USD per person of they are hacked.
The coins I do buy do have real world uses. I also get 4% cashback on purchases. So when I buy a Ps5 it actually costs me 4% less than retail as I get cashback through my crypto card.
Losing the keys to your wallet is your own fault. You cannot blame that on bitcoin.
If you lost your wallet when on a cruise ship by it going overboard. Guess what of you had £1000 cash in that wallet it is now gone also. Are you going to blame the government for creating physical money?
The exchanges I use have never been hacked. They are also insured for 250k USD per person of they are hacked.
The coins I do buy do have real world uses. I also get 4% cashback on purchases. So when I buy a Ps5 it actually costs me 4% less than retail as I get cashback through my crypto card.
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Soldato
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My preference would be a croque monsieur and wine half way down a ski slope in the alps if that works for you
I'll meet you in the middle
and I'll bring cheese and meat... maybe some wine to help wash it down!Example of one client of mine.
Currently takes £22.5k per year "income" (in the sense of money into his account), pays zero tax.
State pension - circa £8k per annum, takes just under £4.5k income from his pension this keeping him under his personal allowance for taxable income.
Then £7.5k per year from his ISA investments - again tax free
And £2.5k per year from his tax free cash is withdrawn on a monthly basis.
Doesn't have massive pension pot/huge ISA portfolio - (circa £260k pension and £150k ISA).
His pensions came from 5 or 6 different work pensions/small private pensions he built up over 40 years of work.
Has been doing it this way for nearly 7 years now since he retired. His current value of pension and ISA are well above where he was 7 years ago and he's been drawing income/tax free cash for that length of time.
You don't need massive pension/ISA funds for retirement - you just need to be smart about how you structure the withdrawals to make it last.
He travels 3 or 4 holidays a year, has no mortgage or debts and in his eyes lives very comfortably on that level of income.
Currently takes £22.5k per year "income" (in the sense of money into his account), pays zero tax.
State pension - circa £8k per annum, takes just under £4.5k income from his pension this keeping him under his personal allowance for taxable income.
Then £7.5k per year from his ISA investments - again tax free
And £2.5k per year from his tax free cash is withdrawn on a monthly basis.
Doesn't have massive pension pot/huge ISA portfolio - (circa £260k pension and £150k ISA).
His pensions came from 5 or 6 different work pensions/small private pensions he built up over 40 years of work.
Has been doing it this way for nearly 7 years now since he retired. His current value of pension and ISA are well above where he was 7 years ago and he's been drawing income/tax free cash for that length of time.
You don't need massive pension/ISA funds for retirement - you just need to be smart about how you structure the withdrawals to make it last.
He travels 3 or 4 holidays a year, has no mortgage or debts and in his eyes lives very comfortably on that level of income.
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