Hawkeye TV show

Episode 3 was very good. Liked the camera work in the car chase (still not as good as that Chris Hemsworth Netflix movie though)

Do we think Hawkeye and Jack might know each other? In the comics, the swordmaster was a mentor of sorts.
 
ZXSpectrum said:
Decent fight, decent car chase (And loved how it ended :D)
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One big problem with bad writing is the lack of "permanence" so now, in the Hawkeye world, aside from all the fiery explosions and carnage through-out NY (which on it's own would make the news) there's now a huge 50m tall arrow just appeared in a bridge out of nowhere and, post stunt, it's instantly forgotten about yet it'd be huge international news with CCTV of it just "appearing" etc.

Previously these kind of events would be written well enough to either not use a cheap "gag" like this this or it'd be referenced with the subsequent police investigation or shown on news reports on TV with "The Avengers" or similar being involved (due to them knowing about the Pym Particle"). Yet here, it's a 10 second gag and move on to the next scene with zero thought given.
 
ianh said:
One big problem with bad writing is the lack of "permanence" so now, in the Hawkeye world, aside from all the fiery explosions and carnage through-out NY (which on it's own would make the news) there's now a huge 50m tall arrow just appeared in a bridge out of nowhere and, post stunt, it's instantly forgotten about yet it'd be huge international news with CCTV of it just "appearing" etc.

Previously these kind of events would be written well enough to either not use a cheap "gag" like this this or it'd be referenced with the subsequent police investigation or shown on news reports on TV with "The Avengers" or similar being involved (due to them knowing about the Pym Particle"). Yet here, it's a 10 second gag and move on to the next scene with zero thought given.
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This city lives in a world that has very publicly faced the original Loki invasion, an entire city being raised into the atmosphere, half the world’s population disappearing, Thanos appearing and killing one of the worlds most popular superheroes (and there are museums about this)… I could go on and on.

It’s a TV show (ie let it go) but still clearly the fictional world is very used to this stuff. Homecoming was literally about the clean up crews that come in after the action. The Pym particles are no doubt primed not to keep things in enlarged forever either…

it’s really simple.
 
chef-borjan said:
it’s really simple.
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It is simple - simply bad writing.

The point is, again, "permanence". In the MCU films things have an effect which lasts, thats a main core idea to the universe and it helps bind everything and that is "Good Writing", yet this TV Show doesn't have that same core idea because the writing just isn't as good, either deliberately (it's just a TV Show) or incidentally (bad writers).

So don't give me a poop sandwich and tell me I should enjoy it because its just a sandwich - it's still poop in the end
 
ianh said:
It is simple - simply bad writing.

The point is, again, "permanence". In the MCU films things have an effect which lasts, thats a main core idea to the universe and it helps bind everything and that is "Good Writing", yet this TV Show doesn't have that same core idea because the writing just isn't as good, either deliberately (it's just a TV Show) or incidentally (bad writers).

So don't give me a poop sandwich and tell me I should enjoy it because its just a sandwich - it's still poop in the end
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It is not 'bad writing' if a show doesn't pander to you whims of wanting every single detail explained.

What part of a giant arrow appearing on a bridge is so critical to the plot of Hawkeye? Why is its acknowledgment or 'permanence' so important?

Is Hawkeye a show about the lasting effects of superhero battles on the surrounding infrastructure? Spoiler hint: It's not.

If you want to talk about permanent effects that are relevant to the plot, how about hearing loss? There you go, the writers are already doing what you ask, but you are complaining because the CLEANUP of an arrow that grows to gigantic sizes using mysterious particles was not realistic. Not the arrow itself, but the cleanup.

Frankly, fictional works are more enjoyable when they have done a decent job of creating coherent and expansive world building (which they absolutely have done over the decade) and thus you don't need everything spelled out the whole time. The Department of Damage Control already exists, we have no need to see a guy go pick up a dustpan and brush.
 
chef-borjan said:
The Department of Damage Control already exists, we have no need to see a guy go pick up a dustpan and brush.
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Shame they cancelled the Damage Control show, although it being planned as a comedy show didn't sit well with me. Would be great if Marvel resurrected it and did it themselves now Disney+ is a thing.
 
Malevolence said:
Shame they cancelled the Damage Control show, although it being planned as a comedy show didn't sit well with me. Would be great if Marvel resurrected it and did it themselves now Disney+ is a thing.
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Ah I didn't know that they were planning this. I think it could work as a comedy for sure, I'm thinking of the Darcy moments in Wandavision.
 
chef-borjan said:
If you want to talk about permanent effects that are relevant to the plot, how about hearing loss? There you go, the writers are already doing what you ask
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I know and I think thats good writing especially the part with his childs phone call (some of the best writing of the series so far), because it shows permanence, things in this universe have consequences which linger just they like would IRL.

chef-borjan said:
It is not 'bad writing' if a show doesn't pander to you whims of wanting every single detail explained.

What part of a giant arrow appearing on a bridge is so critical to the plot of Hawkeye? Why is its acknowledgment or 'permanence' so important?
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I know we think differently, but I've never asked for "a clean up crew" etc or any of the other stuff you came up with :D

Instead it's about following the rest of the MCU (and parts of this show) in acknowledging that things have an effect which lasts more than 10 seconds later, so a 50m tall arrow appearing in the middle of a bridge wrecking a section of it seconds after various explosions occurred would, in the previous MCU, have an acknowledged effect even if it was just a news report in the background or people talking about it on the train etc but instead these things which "should" have some form of impact (OMG, after everything NY has been through is this a new attack???? etc) are ignored seconds later as if the events in the show disappear once the scene changes.

It just feels odd to me that a massive arrow suddenly appears, smashes a bridge (which would be closed for a while) with car explosions across the city and no-one says anything. Compared to the really well written hearing loss stuff it almost feels like different people are writing different sections of the story and, as it's a stunt section, less care is given.

Anyway, to avoid more thread disruption I'll leave it at that.
 
VincentHanna said:
If they acknowledge the giant arrow in a background news report during episode 4, is it going to increase your enjoyment of the show?
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Enjoyment - not sure TBH as my overall enjoyment isn't really tied specifically to things like this. It's a bit like a having a nice meal but a fly keeps buzzing around i.e. it's annoying but it doesn't ruin everything.

However I would consider it to be better written than I do currently, so it's more of a niggly "hmmmm, thats a bit naff" right now which would upgrade to a "Oh cool, they did something with it" afterwards even if it was just a news report they saw whilst passing a TV etc.
 
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I'm really enjoying the show. The permanence thing doesn't bother me in the slightest, I think because there's context around it being an Avenger, not just some random guy that's shown up.

Did anyone notice Clint drinking from the 'Thanos Was Right' mug? I caught a glimpse at one point, maybe it was made a more obvious point somewhere else and I missed it? (After a google, it was apparently quite obvious in Ep1)
 
gettothechopper said:
think its just an in joke about the reddit group https://www.reddit.com/r/thanosdidnothingwrong/
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I would put it down to the "in universe" events shown in Falcon/Winter Soldier where the return of 50% of the world's population, after a long time away and the world has adjusted, has been a disaster for many of those who remained and its caused chaos since their return.

Based on that I could quite believe that the "Thanos was right" movement would be quite strong amongst those who remained.
 
I am enjoying this far more than i thought i would, a lot of it is to do with Kate's character and the performance. Even though the show is call Hawkeye, Kate steals it in every scene.
 
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