Toilet plumbing - drain odours

One More Solo · 14 Dec 2021 at 16:06

We've just moved into a new (old) house and having some issues with one of the toilets. Initially, it was backing up and not flushing properly but this was cleared with a plunger and is now working fine. The issue we're getting is occasional bad drain/stale urine smells in the bathroom. This only seems to have happened since the plunging, so I wonder if this has disturbed something. It's not great. A load of bleach seems to cure it but it's not really a long term solution.

Google says replacing the wax seal may resolve the issue. I've had a poke around underneath and there is also a relatively large gap between the floorboards and wastepipe. It doesn't smell terrible at the moment but there's a definite draft coming up, and a bit of a "drain-y" aroma.

My thoughts were to replace the wax seal (is this what I can see on the flexible pan connector pictured?) and fill the floorboard gaps with some expanding foam. Is this a terrible idea?

iamtheoneneo · 14 Dec 2021 at 17:08

That is shocking plumbing but not exactly surprising.
I wouldn't worry about the draft, thats normal due to absolutely zero insulation in that area but id worry about the smell and maybe a minor leak? You said everything was backing up - potentially putting pressure on the pipework - enough for it to crack a little (especially if its old)

Last I checked it was strongly advised in the trade to NOT go anywhere near expanding foam and floorboards.

You could change the seal and see what happens, but if it persists I would get a plumber out to take a good look with the expectation that some of the pipework needs to be redone.

Hawk Tuah · 14 Dec 2021 at 17:18

You shouldn't have any smell coming - the whole thing 'should' be air tight. You need to take the toilet off and investigate what's going on under the floor with that flexi connector. They're quite thin plastic and my guess is whatever was blocking it has caused a tear in it. You really don't want toilet waste leaking out under your floor. It'll only get worse - much worse.

Waste piping should be incredibly simple - they're all push fit (with a bit of silicon spray). You just need to get the right bits and bends.

Then fit a collar over that badly cut hole.

Syore · 14 Dec 2021 at 17:25

Sounds it could be the soil vent pipe being blocked or the flexi waste pipe was not fully pushed in.

happy_2008 · 15 Dec 2021 at 09:27

Thats awful plumbing and potential for mice or other critters to make they way into your home.

One More Solo · 15 Dec 2021 at 11:48

iamtheoneneo said:
That is shocking plumbing but not exactly surprising.
I wouldn't worry about the draft, thats normal due to absolutely zero insulation in that area but id worry about the smell and maybe a minor leak? You said everything was backing up - potentially putting pressure on the pipework - enough for it to crack a little (especially if its old)

happy_2008 said:
Thats awful plumbing and potential for mice or other critters to make they way into your home.

Presumably you're both talking about the massive gap being the issue?

I think I'm going to replace the flexible pipe and put some sort of collar around it to close the gap as suggested. If we still have issues after that then I'll get a plumber out.

Would something like this that does away with the 90 degree join be a better option? My thinking is fewer failure points. Euroflo ZB38403DB 90° Long Flexible Pan Connector White 110mm | Pan Connectors | Screwfix.com

ANDARIAL · 15 Dec 2021 at 12:01

that connector has a waste for sink/bath if you were unaware
and flexi pipes are not a good idea if you can avoid them.`proper` connectors ftw
Flexi can catch a lot of **** :eek:

One More Solo · 15 Dec 2021 at 12:54

ANDARIAL said:
that connector has a waste for sink/bath if you were unaware
and flexi pipes are not a good idea if you can avoid them.`proper` connectors ftw
Flexi can catch a lot of ****

Fair point, I was thinking of blanking that but would be easier just to get one of the McAlpine connectors and a regular extension if needed. I'm assuming the flexi pipe is there because whoever sited the toilet didn't manage to make it square with the waste, but I guess I'll find out!

ANDARIAL · 15 Dec 2021 at 13:08

Sometimes you can`t avoid using a flexi.BUT if you can its always a good idea to use `ordinary/proper` fittings

One More Solo · 16 Dec 2021 at 09:38

Well, worse than expected. Removed the toilet and piping, shone a torch down there and the drain has backed up and is filling up the void below the floor. Drainage people coming out this evening to take a look.

mickyflinn · 16 Dec 2021 at 10:35

One More Solo said:
Well, worse than expected. Removed the toilet and piping, shone a torch down there and the drain has backed up and is filling up the void below the floor. Drainage people coming out this evening to take a look.

Do you use toilet rim blocks they are known to come off sometimes and may have caused the blockage if one went down ?

One More Solo · 16 Dec 2021 at 10:49

mickyflinn said:
Do you use toilet rim blocks they are known to come off sometimes and may have caused the blockage if one went down ?

No, but the blockage existed before we moved in so god knows what the previous owners have put down it.

ANDARIAL · 16 Dec 2021 at 11:55

One More Solo said:
No, but the blockage existed before we moved in so god knows what the previous owners have put down it.

Action man scuba....maybe

One More Solo · 17 Dec 2021 at 06:02

I have a feeling this could get expensive. Guy came out last night and found the problematic drain. There was a significant blockage that he reckoned had accumulated over a very long period of time, so the previous owners must have been aware there was a problem even if they didn’t grasp the full extent of it. On the face of it, he wondered if the drain had insufficient fall as in his words “it felt like an afterthought”. That fits in with the crap plumbing you all identified. Worth noting this part of the house was a conversion. The assumption as to what happened is the pipe has backed up and then uncoupled the flexible waste leading to the issue we’ve got now.

We now have a working drain but the mess underneath the floorboards is going to need professional attention before we even think about putting things back together.

I’m going to speak to our home insurance this morning and see what happens next.

Macky · 17 Dec 2021 at 08:15

That sounds frustrating! Hopefully you reach a satisfactory resolution.

ANDARIAL · 17 Dec 2021 at 08:47

Would this be a downstairs suspended timber floor?

One More Solo · 17 Dec 2021 at 09:35

ANDARIAL said:
Would this be a downstairs suspended timber floor?

Yep. Insurance are going to cover it by the sounds of it. Just waiting for a call back.

happy_2008 · 17 Dec 2021 at 09:45

Sounds nasty and smelly

Blackjack Davy · 17 Dec 2021 at 16:36

One More Solo said:
Well, worse than expected. Removed the toilet and piping, shone a torch down there and the drain has backed up and is filling up the void below the floor. Drainage people coming out this evening to take a look.

happy_2008 said:
Sounds nasty and smelly

Sounds expensive too probably naff plumbing seems to be all too common my mothers place her ex he employed some cowboy it wouldn't flush properly the amount of times I had to put my hand down the toilet pan to shift it... its since been sorted somewhat but its still too close to the wall you almost have to sit at an angle

ANDARIAL · 19 Dec 2021 at 08:57

Blackjack Davy said:
Sounds expensive too probably naff plumbing seems to be all too common my mothers place her ex he employed some cowboy it wouldn't flush properly the amount of times I had to put my hand down the toilet pan to shift it... its since been sorted somewhat but its still too close to the wall you almost have to sit at an angle

You realise they sell things called `plungers` now don`t you?