Ukraine Invasion - Please do not post videos showing attacks/similar

the wopster · 26 Feb 2022 at 09:56

PMSL, Russian lovers on here thinking Russia would give NATO a run for its money, it can’t even supply its troops with fuel and food

Soldiers say they are out of gas. Driver offers to tow them back to russia. Everyone laughs. Russian soldiers ask for news on how they are doing in war. Driver tell them that Ukraine is winning, russians are surrendering and impliest that they should too.

https://twitter.com/Liveuamap/statu...^1497485623225200640|twgr^|twcon^s1_&ref_url=

Puzzled · 26 Feb 2022 at 09:56

Entai said:
There will still be a lot of pro Russian in the Ukranian population.

Not a majority, by a long way, but to say the entire population is against Russia is plain wrong.

I doubt even the pro Russian population would support Putin murdering their friends and neighbours.

I'm sure Russian media will be showing footage of the flag waving separatists though and claiming its happening across the country.

dowie · 26 Feb 2022 at 09:57

Entai said:
Those figures are wrong.

He has over 1 million currently serving troops, with another trained 2 million reserves.
Forced conscription, that could be ten million easily.

You posted this before, you don't seem to get that those aren't all combat-ready troops. Similarly, Ukraine had hundreds of thousands on paper back in 2014, they weren't really able to do anything, they were unprepared, had to surrender in Crimea, had to form ad hoc militias as things turned hot in the East - how do you think some separatists and Russian troops on "holiday" managed to breakaway into two separate provinces while Ukraine had hundreds of thousands of regulars and reservists. Can you not see how that is flawed?

Sure if you want some conscript to stand guard duty somewhere or man a checkpoint in the caucuses etc.. then you've got some people who can be handed a rifle. In terms of actual battle groups that can be used in operations, he'd got most of them either on the Ukrainian border or currently invading - he's had to take troops away from all over Russia to assemble them for this operation.

On the other hand, a civilian prepared to fight for their city, that doesn't require much, it's much more effort for the invader, the civilian can pop up and take shots at Russian soldiers in the street, throw molotov cocktails etc...

delta0 · 26 Feb 2022 at 09:57

Amnesia said:
They are already at the capital, once that goes down and Russia installs its own pro Russian puppet government then all this western support will stop.
The Ukraine people will be on their own, no hero leader, no army, no western support....pretty much forgotten about.

This is what Putin assumes. It won’t stop. The people do not want to be part of Russia. Even Russians I know are concerned about what is happening there. They do not think they should be killing and destroying Ukraine.

Entai · 26 Feb 2022 at 10:01

woppy101 said:
PMSL, Russian lovers on here thinking Russia would give NATO a run for its money, it can’t even supply its troops with fuel and food

Soldiers say they are out of gas. Driver offers to tow them back to russia. Everyone laughs. Russian soldiers ask for news on how they are doing in war. Driver tell them that Ukraine is winning, russians are surrendering and impliest that they should too.

https://twitter.com/Liveuamap/status/1497485623225200640?ref_src=twsrc^tfw|twcamp^tweetembed|twterm^1497485623225200640|twgr^|twcon^s1_&ref_url=

NO ONE ON HERE has said Russia would give NATO a run for their money.

I have said exact opposite many times, bit you ignore that.

You are trolling to the max.

LabR@t · 26 Feb 2022 at 10:01

woppy101 said:
PMSL, Russian lovers on here thinking Russia would give NATO a run for its money, it can’t even supply its troops with fuel and food

Soldiers say they are out of gas. Driver offers to tow them back to russia. Everyone laughs. Russian soldiers ask for news on how they are doing in war. Driver tell them that Ukraine is winning, russians are surrendering and impliest that they should too.

https://twitter.com/Liveuamap/status/1497485623225200640?ref_src=twsrc^tfw|twcamp^tweetembed|twterm^1497485623225200640|twgr^|twcon^s1_&ref_url=

LOL

SPG · 26 Feb 2022 at 10:02

Look this has been in the plan for years, it's not just three weeks ago Putin said let's get Ukraine.

Every step will have been planned meticulously by his generals, Every possible outcome and reaction will have a contingency plan and a contingency plan.

Planning for a quick win was just that, stocking up the coffers for a protracted campaign has been in the making for years. Knowing the west would be supplying kit will be known. It's all in the Russian plan as time goes on it becomes more reactionary.

Putin may have lost the plot but his generals will be on point.

All a complete waste of life & time.

dowie · 26 Feb 2022 at 10:02

Minstadave said:
They're fighting for Russia aren't they?

Yup, but they're going to a country that will be very hostile to them now with potentially iffy logistics etc..

Amnesia · 26 Feb 2022 at 10:02

delta0 said:
This is what Putin assumes. It won’t stop. The people do not want to be part of Russia. Even Russians I know are concerned about what is happening there. They do not think they should be killing and destroying Ukraine.

No that's what I assume, Putin has probably put a little more thought into it than me and has backup plans for most scenarios.
I fully agree with you about the population not wanting to attack Ukraine.
Reminds me of the Iraq war, so many of us didn't want it but they went ahead anyway.

the wopster · 26 Feb 2022 at 10:03

SPG said:
Look this has been in the plan for years, it's not just three weeks ago Putin said let's get Ukraine.

Every step will have been planned meticulously by his generals, Every possible outcome and reaction will have a contingency plan and a contingency plan.

Planning for a quick win was just that, stocking up the coffers for a protracted campaign has been in the making for years. Knowing the west would be supplying kit will be known. It's all in the Russian plan as time goes on it becomes more reactionary.

Putin may have lost the plot but his generals will be on point.

All a complete waste of life & time.

They can’t even supply their troops with fuel and food

dowie · 26 Feb 2022 at 10:05

SPG said:
Every step will have been planned meticulously by his generals, Every possible outcome and reaction will have a contingency plan and a contingency plan.
[...]
Putin may have lost the plot but his generals will be on point.

Not so sure about that, this plan has had to take some bold risks so far and I suspect they weren't expecting it to be as hard as it has been. That assault on the airfield by elite paratroppers for example turned into a bit of a farce after they were cut off and the planes had to be turned around.

They seem to have had extensive losses and are regularly seeing aircraft shot down, tanks destroyed. If Ukraine can keep up the momentum then an insurgency campaign would be a nightmare for Russia.

Amnesia · 26 Feb 2022 at 10:06

LabR@t said:
Do you remember Yugoslavia?

No, did we spend time there together?

g67575 · 26 Feb 2022 at 10:07

President Zelensky seems brave, but I think he needs to be cautious from now on. He can't let his guard down when there are hit squads assigned to kill him.

I worry what will happen if he is assassinated.

MrWhippy · 26 Feb 2022 at 10:08

Amnesia said:
No that's what I assume, Putin has probably put a little more thought into it than me and has backup plans for most scenarios.
I fully agree with you about the population not wanting to attack Ukraine.
Reminds me of the Iraq war, so many of us didn't want it but they went ahead anyway.

Wasn't it something like 70 odd percent of the population didn't support a war the day before the invasion of Iraq, and the day after the invasion about the same percentage supported it. Or maybe I'm misremembering.

Amnesia · 26 Feb 2022 at 10:09

g67575 said:
President Zelensky seems brave, but I think he needs to be cautious from now on. He can't let his guard down when there are hit squads assigned to kill him.

I worry what will happen if he is assassinated.

It's do or die for him, either save Ukraine or die trying.

dowie · 26 Feb 2022 at 10:10

woppy101 said:
PMSL, Russian lovers on here thinking Russia would give NATO a run for its money, it can’t even supply its troops with fuel and food

Entai said:
NO ONE ON HERE has said Russia would give NATO a run for their money.

I have said exact opposite many times, bit you ignore that.

ORLY???

Jono8 has correctly posted eariler that the USA alone could beat Russia, you seemed to think that isn't the case and that only with NATO would there be a "chance", which didn't seem to be the "exact opposite" at all.

Jono8 said:
Yes, I expect the USA alone, let alone the whole of NATO in its entiriety would beat Russia in a conventional war.

Entai said:
USA have approx 480,000 regular troops, most of which are in the US obviously.

Russia have 1.5 million regular troops all of which are only a few hours from Ukraine.

Without escalating to WMD's, personally, the US could not beat Russia.

With the help of all of NATO, there might be a chance, but as Russia are far more likely to use WMD's before NATO would, i still think we would loose

delta0 · 26 Feb 2022 at 10:11

Aljazeera reporting a lot of unhappiness in Russia about what is happening. They did not want to see Ukraine being attacked.

g67575 · 26 Feb 2022 at 10:11

Amnesia said:
It's do or die for him, either save Ukraine or die trying.

The risk is too high. He should remain in Ukraine, but stay hidden at all times. He has proven his point that the government still stands, that's enough.

ianh · 26 Feb 2022 at 10:13

delta0 said:
You’re right it is in the CCM. However we can’t justify their use even slightly. They are very dangerous to civilian populations.

Just to be clear, the CCM doesn't "ban" cluster bombs, it only bans a few very specific cluster bombs based on sub-munition size/weight and fusing system. In fact the UK still uses quite a few "unbanned" cluster munitions as the ones we use fall juuuuust outside the scope of the CCM. So for example we still use the M270 MLRS rocket system which drops almost 8,000 sub-munitions per vehicle and no-one complains.

The reason we still justify the use of certain cluster munitions is that their design makes them the most effective weapon for killing large numbers of infantry in the open or destroying large numbers of soft-skin vehicles.

Puzzled · 26 Feb 2022 at 10:14

g67575 said:
The risk is too high. He should remain in Ukraine, but stay hidden at all times. He has proven his point that the government still stands, that's enough.

Videos of him being in the city will be a massive morale boost.

I wonder when Russia will bring down the mobile network to try and break morale / hide their atrocities.