Ukraine Invasion - Please do not post videos showing attacks/similar

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steve45 said:
North Atlantic Treaty Organisation... Yes I get your point and there may be some outliers but generaly NATO is a North Atlantic/eurocentric organisation. As Friendly/Allied as Aus is, its about as remote as you can get from the North Atlantic as you can get...
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Yeah, I know what it means as you say, I actually don't know if another alliance exists though. Australia would make a lot of sense strategically though.
 
Scougar said:
Yeah, I know what it means as you say, I actually don't know if another alliance exists though. Australia would make a lot of sense strategically though.
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AUKUS exists, althought not quite in the same sense of NATO. It is a security/information/defense pact involving Aus/UK/US, and its bigger than just the Subs that have been hitting the headlines recently.

en.wikipedia.org

AUKUS - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org en.wikipedia.org
 
Ukraine defence ministry puts out badass video.

It's actually been revealed today that as part of the HIMARS supply agreement to Ukraine, the US has veto on targets. Apparently what they're doing is that Ukraine intelligence comes up with target location lists, send them to US intelligence, US intelligence pulls and examines real time satellite data to see if the target contains anything they don't want Ukraine to hit - for example something in Russia, then they either veto the target on the list or ok it and Ukraine goes on to hit it by entering the location into the HIMARS computer.

Which means the US had no objection to Ukraine using HIMARS against bridges even though it's not a great use of the rockets.

And because the US has veto rights over target locations that can be entered into HIMARS computer, Russia is now saying this means the US is directly engaged in the war inside Ukraine. Which is obviously false, because there is a big difference between target Veto and target selection.

 
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Grim5 said:
And because the US has veto rights over target locations that can be entered into HIMARS computer, Russia is now saying this means the US is directly engaged in the war inside Ukraine
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Which puts Russia in a sticky position at things stand.
 
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I wonder how many of those target veto conversations are "you might want to look over here instead .. nudge, nudge, wink, wink".

I pity poor Russia in that they clearly need the US help to save them from those naughty ukraines defending their territory. :D
 
Grim5 said:
It's actually been revealed today that as part of the HIMARS supply agreement to Ukraine, the US has veto on targets. Apparently what they're doing is that Ukraine intelligence comes up with target location lists, send them to US intelligence, US intelligence pulls and examines real time satellite data to see if the target contains anything they don't want Ukraine to hit - for example something in Russia, then they either veto the target on the list or ok it and Ukraine goes on to hit it by entering the location into the HIMARS computer.

Which means the US had no objection to Ukraine using HIMARS against bridges even though it's not a great use of the rockets.

And because the US has veto rights over target locations that can be entered into HIMARS computer, Russia is now saying this means the US is directly engaged in the war inside Ukraine. Which is obviously false, because there is a big difference between target Veto and target selection.
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I see, so manpads, ammunition, intel, artillery, that's all ok but when you tell Ukraine not to shoot into Russia, well that's a step too far.
 
Of course the US, the UK and others are assisting with battlefield intelligence and targeting options. The line between offensive and defensive weaponry being supplied is also largely in the imagination of those being hit.
Russia cannot escalate against the US and allies without going nuclear as it has no other capabilities to do so apart from maybe cyber and espionage, I expect that those will be being repulsed all the time.
 
Grim5 said:
Azerbaijan, which shares a land border with Russia, is sending guided bomb supplies for Ukraine to use with SU-25 Jets.

Putin will be furiously adding Azerbaijan to list of countries he wants to invade your make Russia great again

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Azerbaijan recently fought a successful war with Armenia (traditionally a strong ally of russia), due to Russian acquiescence. Turkey provided substantial support to Azerbaijan in that one.

It's all getting rathet complicated...
 
Grim5 said:
And because the US has veto rights over target locations that can be entered into HIMARS computer, Russia is now saying this means the US is directly engaged in the war inside Ukraine. Which is obviously false, because there is a big difference between target Veto and target selection.
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Hotwired said:
I see, so manpads, ammunition, intel, artillery, that's all ok but when you tell Ukraine not to shoot into Russia, well that's a step too far.
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No the Russians are saying the Americans are directly involved in the war by supplying targeting information.

Russia claims US ‘directly involved’ in Ukraine war​


Kremlin says White House supplying information used by Kyiv to conduct long-range missile strikes
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The role of American intelligence in the war in Ukraine has been put under scrutiny after Russia accused the White House of supplying targeting information used by Kyiv to conduct long-range missile strikes.
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The Kremlin’s comments came after an interview given to the Telegraph on Monday by Vadym Skibitsky, Ukraine’s acting deputy head of military intelligence. Skibitsky said the US-made long-range Himars artillery systems had been extremely effective in wiping out Russian fuel and ammunition dumps.
He said excellent satellite imagery and real-time information had helped. He denied US officials were providing direct targeting information.

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Maria Zakharova, leaped on the remarks. She told the RIA Novosti news agency: “No other confirmation of the direct involvement of the United States in the hostilities on the territory of Ukraine is required.
“The supply of weapons is accompanied not only by instructions on its use, but in this case they perform the function of gunners in their purest form.”
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peterwalkley said:
I wonder how many of those target veto conversations are "you might want to look over here instead .. nudge, nudge, wink, wink".

:D
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This is what the Russians are saying.


Hagar said:
Of course the US, the UK and others are assisting with battlefield intelligence and targeting options.
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This is what the Russians are saying.



Jester* said:
The US is involved in a special resupply and intelligence operation in Ukraine.
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This is what the Russians are saying.


I expect any responses will be along the lines of 'he is twisting our words', 'this proves he is a Russian shill', 'we didn't mean that', 'So you think rape is ok', 'He tries to do a gotcha', 'Nobody made that argument'.
 
Amnesia said:
No the Russians are saying the Americans are directly involved in the war by supplying targeting information.

Russia claims US ‘directly involved’ in Ukraine war​


This is what the Russians are saying.


I expect any responses will be along the lines of 'he is twisting our words', 'this proves he is a Russian shill', 'we didn't mean that', 'So you think rape is ok', 'He tries to do a gotcha', 'Nobody made that argument'.
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So what exactly is their point?

Wars have been fought like this for a long time. Countries take sides, supply weapons and munitions and information. All of what they are saying is plainly obvious, they just don't like it because it is causing them untold hassle and at huge cost.
 
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