1930s Semi Refurb - Part 2 of ... (Edition: Boiler/Water Tank Relocation)

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Lols
dLockers said:
Small update and the first use of the shower - oh man what a fantastic decision to get an unvented tank. Will be no heat and we'll have to use the immersion over the weekend but that's ok.

Gas hard lines partially in.

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Small but oversized rad for the girls future bedroom. Usefully this allows enough room to the left for a bookcase or something.

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Temporarily fitted a new shower too. He's made good the hole in the roof too.

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Final jobs for Monday include new rad pipework downstairs and then connecting up the gas.

Very pleased!
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Looking good.

I'm going to create a similar build log thread too but I barely have time to read a few posts here!

It's Been soo busy in my life both work and housing
 
Coming along well.

I was going to mention to make sure your guys are fitting a magnetic filter (most boilers require it for warranty anyway) and an automatic bypass valve which will save you energy.

Also, are you happy with how they've plumbed the shower in or is it temporary until you can get behind the wall?
 
Mysterae_ said:
Coming along well.

I was going to mention to make sure your guys are fitting a magnetic filter (most boilers require it for warranty anyway) and an automatic bypass valve which will save you energy.

Also, are you happy with how they've plumbed the shower in or is it temporary until you can get behind the wall?
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Haven't spotted a magnetic filter yet but haven't had a look in the attic just yet. I'm sure there will be one.

Happy with the shower - the whole bathroom is going to become a bedroom so I insisted they didn't waste time making it good. The shower was an after thought on scope too as they hadn't spotted I had an old power shower that would have likely blown off of the wall under the new pressure.
 
How come you're hanging /second fixing rads? Presumably you're changing the decor and/or getting the room plaster skimmed?

Best to take them off before that but appreciate you may just have them for now then take them off and refit
 
Buffman said:
How come you're hanging /second fixing rads? Presumably you're changing the decor and/or getting the room plaster skimmed?

Best to take them off before that but appreciate you may just have them for now then take them off and refit
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It'll be a fair while till I get to decoration so the lads are second fixing everything today, and coming back tomorrow to do a powerflush of the full system.

I'm under orders to get the house liveable (like this isn't liveable/more fun for my 2y/o crawling under the floating floor?!) in time for Christmas. I may be able to get away with sinking my back boxes and chasing out some walls but focus will shift for a little while.

When I do the room I'll remove and rehang, although I did get a lecture about how difficult it'll be to get centres on the pipework if I remove all the brackets etc. Love my plumber :D
 
Mysterae_ said:
I was going to mention to make sure your guys are fitting a magnetic filter (most boilers require it for warranty anyway) and an automatic bypass valve which will save you energy.
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An automatic bypass valve is something needed if the primary circuit flow could be blocked (TRVs all closed etc) without an alternative bypass arrangement but isn't an energy saving device.
 
No fancy valves - there's a 22mm to downstairs and a 22mm to upstairs.

I did ask them to put a TRV in the WC but they said they'll leave that as there are TRVs everywhere else.

Kohaashi said:
Rads look great! We’re going for the same style downstairs where they’re visible in the hallway and dining room.
Where did you order yours from?
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B&Q - 863£ for all of them. The hall rad was an oversized 400mm that happened to also be on clearance but the other two were bought to 'spec'/had to be that size so paid full price/no deals to be done.

They're Acova. I fitted one at least 15 years ago in my mum's house and it's still in as-new condition tbh.
 
Simon42 said:
An automatic bypass valve is something needed if the primary circuit flow could be blocked (TRVs all closed etc) without an alternative bypass arrangement but isn't an energy saving device.
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Very true, but it can be an energy saver if you just have a non-automatic gate valve with a fixed percentage open as a bypass, like I have currently. There's always some amount of flow returning to the boiler.

@dLockers if you do remove the rads later for redecorating, a bit of advice as I did the same and with a vertical radiator - although it was drained and sat for a week or so the inside of it corroded so much that 3 'veins' were blocked and nothing would unblock them. Not sure what I should have done to prevent it, either make sure to get all the water out or seal it while it's sat, or even both! If I remember rightly I laid it flat which probably wasn't wise.
 
Great shout, thank you. Wouldn't have considered that! @Mysterae_

Plumbers left around 1720, I was instructed to leave the heating on till I went to bed but my god is it effective; especially the tiny 600x600 double panel in the future bedroom. I was absolutely sweating and the 2/yo was about to go to sleep, so I have let them down slightly by switching it off early.

I've been instructed to turn the heating on at 6am so its nice and toasty for when they arrive to do the power flushing. Secretly I can't wait to wake up baking versus frozen :D

Obviously being a millennial I had to identify the easiest way possible to turn it on at 6am without waking up so have setup an extension lead to my bed...........which was still cave man, so I have now programmed a smart plug :D

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Her current room's rad fits great with the curtains too (these annoyingly are hand me down heirloom curtains from a family friend and I'm too sentimental to replace them, lol):

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Downstairs looking good:
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He had a 50/50 chance of getting flow and return right as he picked it up from the area that was boxed in, and he got it wrong - lol. So he is going to swap the 22mm around tomorrow, too.

One thing I am looking forward to leaving (immersion, tools, electric radiator etc):

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...one thing I didn't quite expect from the new boiler -

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I imagine because I don't have a thermostat at the minute (tomorrow's job), the boiler is just continuously supping gas. Almost fell off of my chair...
 
I've started to configure Hive and my TRVs on the test bench, and having a glitch with one - annoying.

Plumbers are on the final furlong now...:

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Mysterae_ said:
Very true, but it can be an energy saver if you just have a non-automatic gate valve with a fixed percentage open as a bypass, like I have currently. There's always some amount of flow returning to the boiler.
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Indeed, but in practice the boiler then uses less energy to heat back to the output temperature. The only saving could be boiler efficiency on return temp and condensing but you would have to have a lot of bypass to make a difference which would impact flow to rads. Either way its not a big issue and the first heating refit I had (35 years ago) was fitted with a fixed bypass gate valve. However even the modern ABVs are not ideal and I've avoided relying on the one in my current system almost entirely by plumbing an extra two port valve that only opens when my other two port valves (CH Upstairs, CH Downstairs and HW) are all closed. This gives better bypass flow than the ABV and quieter but the ABV is still there in case the two ports valve fails.

@dLockers - I would definitely check the mains cold bore size as older houses like the one I have currently could have an original 13mm LDPE mains feeds to the meter which reduces flow considerably. I upgraded mine from 13mm LDPE to MDPE 32mm OD (26mm ID to closely match the ID of 28mm copper) but for 22mm internal cold pipework internally as you've now got 25mm MDPE (ID ~21mm) is ideal. Something perhaps for a later project but an often overlooked item that will improve flow rate if not limited by other pipework in the home and an area plumbers ignore as they just consider pressure.
 
Simon42 said:
@dLockers - I would definitely check the mains cold bore size as older houses like the one I have currently could have an original 13mm LDPE mains feeds to the meter which reduces flow considerably. I upgraded mine from 13mm LDPE to MDPE 32mm OD (26mm ID to closely match the ID of 28mm copper) but for 22mm internal cold pipework internally as you've now got 25mm MDPE (ID ~21mm) is ideal. Something perhaps for a later project but an often overlooked item that will improve flow rate if not limited by other pipework in the home and an area plumbers ignore as they just consider pressure.
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Interesting! I am not sure I have any flow issues (he did test it I think - he had two devices). I imagine the pipe coming in has been changed to copper at some point but I am not sure how to "check". I did consider swapping for plastic when I had the drive done but timing was too tricky to arrange it.

Anyways, plumbers have gone. I have Stockholm syndrome and need them back :D

I can't imagine this is correct:
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But I am fully Hive'd up and expecting a glorious 65 degree shower tomorrow morning. I hope I haven't jinxed it!
 
Simon42 said:
Indeed, but in practice the boiler then uses less energy to heat back to the output temperature.
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This is misleading. You should deposit as much heat as possible at all times. Your demand is, for example, 2 kW. If you only deliver 1.5 kW then you still need to deliver another 0.5 kW. So sending warm water back to the boiler means it hasn't fulfilled the demand.
 
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