Ukraine Invasion - Please do not post videos showing attacks/similar

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Freddie1980 said:
Those are just the numbers though and doesn’t tell the whole story. The 1st Guards Tank Army isn’t just any old division this was Russia’s most elite armoured unit. It can trace its routes back to WW2 but It was redeveloped during the cold war with a view that this army group would be the be armoured tip of a long soviet spear that would take on NATO tanks head on in any conventional ground war. Now it’s mystic and name have been ruined and it take years for it to be rebuilt and reconstituted.

There were people at the start of this invasion saying ‘Russia was holding back it’s best and there was more to come'. I would like to think by now they’ve got their heads around to the fact that Russia went into Ukraine with the best it had available and lost and that’s why their left to source old T-54’s from deep storage and conscripting anyone they can lay their hands on.
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Exactly - its numbers; but as i said with the VDV, replacing numbers doesnt replace experience and effective capability. Weclome to Vranyo sadly
 
Freddie1980 said:
Those are just the numbers though and doesn’t tell the whole story. The 1st Guards Tank Army isn’t just any old division this was Russia’s most elite armoured unit. It can trace its routes back to WW2 but It was redeveloped during the cold war with a view that this army group would be the be armoured tip of a long soviet spear that would take on NATO tanks head on in any conventional ground war. Now it’s mystic and name have been ruined and it take years for it to be rebuilt and reconstituted.

There were people at the start of this invasion saying ‘Russia was holding back it’s best and there was more to come”. I would like to think by now they’ve got their heads around to the fact that Russia went into Ukraine with the best it had available and lost and that’s why their left source old T-54’s from deep storage and conscripting anyone they can lay their hands on.
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I can't entirely agree with this, Russia did heavily utilise elements of their best forces, but we didn't see T-90s, BMP-Ts, etc. in the initial weeks of the war even though those were available, neither did they deploy many of the forces at full regular strength with significant number of newly drafted soldiers, Rosgvardiya and irregular forces like Wagner and Chechens, etc. bulking up numbers many of them with as little as 3 weeks training. There is always a bit of a factor there as to what they actually had available and ready but still.

Russia very much did attempt to do this on the cheap initially - their composition was much more structured around the notion that it would largely be 2014 all over again on a larger scale - in many cases light on regular infantry and heavy on the heavy artillery seemingly under the impression most of the fighting would be hold out cities and isolated army groups to be sieged and pummelled into submission.

People have been saying since the start practically that they were out of ammo, out of missiles, etc. yet here we are... one of the reasons they've been digging out T-54/55s is as much as anything they've got large amounts of ammo for those still which means they can conserve the dwindling stockpiles of more modern stuff for where it is needed more. Though they are more or less out of modern T-72 variants now they still have a few 100 older models and still seem to be digging some T-72B3s (or modernising some to that standard) out from somewhere - there was a train of about 20 of them seen a few days ago for instance moving towards Ukraine.

EDIT: Also no presence from many of their top of the line aircraft until weeks into the war - albeit as I've said before the actual combat operational numbers of those aircraft is often in single digits :s and there is the factor there that attempts to destroy Ukraine's air defences were not effective so they'd be less willing to risk them.
 
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Scougar said:
True. They aren't really setup for combat against tanks/APC's though unless I am wildly wrong here.

It is somewhat surprising they didn't have better border protection given an active war.
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Ukraine have said over and over again that they won't go cross the border though so they've got a bit complacent. It probably never occured to them that an anti Putin group would do it. If that means they now have to tie up extra troops on the border that's a good thing.
 
Rroff said:
Shows them approaching the border crossing from the Russian side:


So I'm guessing most of them have left Russia now.
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Have you looked through the replies ?

See the video under the reply with
“The Russian MoD has released footage of what happened to many of these forces following their entry in the Belgorod region. “

No idea if it true or false
 
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chaparral said:
Have you looked through the replies ?

See the video under the reply with
“The Russian MoD has released footage of what happened to many of these forces following their entry in the Belgorod region. “

No idea if it true or false
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A lot of claims but little of substance yet. The supposed bodies raise questions as they have no yellow or blue tape, though there was reports of them changing into other uniforms, and the images of the forces at the start of the incursion shows most of them in marpat ubacs rather than t-shirts and 4 layer jackets (which is a more typical Russian setup) the bodies mostly have.
 
Well hopefully most of them got out in time, not like anyone was there to cut off the retreat.

Russia playing up the number of killed is par for the course, though I somehow doubt they all survived and lived happily ever after.
 
HungryHippos said:
Well hopefully most of them got out in time, not like anyone was there to cut off the retreat.

Russia playing up the number of killed is par for the course, though I somehow doubt they all survived and lived happily ever after.
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TBH a lot of the guys in this incursion appear to be actual ex-Russian neo-nazis, I don't think it is Russian propaganda, which adds yet another strange dimension to the whole thing.
 
Rroff said:
TBH a lot of the guys in this incursion appear to be actual ex-Russian neo-nazis, I don't think it is Russian propaganda, which adds yet another strange dimension to the whole thing.
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If nothing else it's certainly caused some chaos and the ill-preparedness of Russia to defend that border is evidenced by how long it's taken them to do anything about it.

This will force them to garrison that area with more troops now to avoid a repeat, so it's likely to pin down more Russian soldiers in garrison duty far away from the front, where Russia want to put them.
 
Does seem like a decent excuse to infiltrate a team to possibly take out a high value target whenever the circumstances allow for it, as far as Putin is concerned there are now an unknown number of assassins walking freely around Russia.
 
Whether Russia have restored order or not, no one will really know, but it’s a brilliant diversion from the frontline with an upcoming counter offensive that could start at any moment.
 
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